Z3 hunt leads to frustration....

[Colo Springs E]

Wow, why can't people be honest in their ads?

I've gone to look at five Z3's in the last month or so. Every. Single. One. of them was misrepresented.

"Beautiful--overall excellent condition with stunning cobalt blue paint!" I don't even know if cobalt blue is a Z3 color (is it?), but what I found particularly stunning about the color on this Z3 was the large amount of clearcoat peeling away on the hood, and a terrible "clear" bra that looked to have been installed when the car was new (1999). Yellow, cracked, brittle, and crappy looking. Also, 3 or 4 very noticeable scuffs/scratches and the underside of the front of the car had excessive deep scuffs/scratches from not using care when pulling into driveways, speed bumps, etc.

"This is one of the nicest Z's around!" Yes, if you're good with HAIL DAMAGE (I kid you not!) and a power top that no longer works!

"Car is perfect--needs nothing." Except the fact the airbag and check engine lights are on and the tires are over 10 years old (I looked at the date code)... yep, NEEDS NOTHING.

Another one, the guy told me he had owned it 3 years. Checked the carfax, he had owned it just over ONE year (and there were 3 other owners in the last 3 years-- red flag for me).

I am seriously considering just buying a new/certified Miata.

One more to look at this week (a Z4 actually). We'll see how that one goes. Anyone else run into the issues I have? I'm blown away--do they think potential buyers won't notice this stuff?? Why not just be upfront?

[LimehouseBlues]

Wow, why can't people be honest in their ads?

I've gone to look at five Z3's in the last month or so. Every. Single. One. of them was misrepresented.

"Beautiful--overall excellent condition with stunning cobalt blue paint!" I don't even know if cobalt blue is a Z3 color (is it?), but what I found particularly stunning about the color on this Z3 was the large amount of clearcoat peeling away on the hood, and a terrible "clear" bra that looked to have been installed when the car was new (1999). Yellow, cracked, brittle, and crappy looking. Also, 3 or 4 very noticeable scuffs/scratches and the underside of the front of the car had excessive deep scuffs/scratches from not using care when pulling into driveways, speed bumps, etc.

"This is one of the nicest Z's around!" Yes, if you're good with HAIL DAMAGE (I kid you not!) and a power top that no longer works!

"Car is perfect--needs nothing." Except the fact the airbag and check engine lights are on and the tires are over 10 years old (I looked at the date code)... yep, NEEDS NOTHING.

Another one, the guy told me he had owned it 3 years. Checked the carfax, he had owned it just over ONE year (and there were 3 other owners in the last 3 years-- red flag for me).

I am seriously considering just buying a new/certified Miata.

One more to look at this week (a Z4 actually). We'll see how that one goes. Anyone else run into the issues I have? I'm blown away--do they think potential buyers won't notice this stuff?? Why not just be upfront?

If you live in a place where seasons change....I wonder if the legitimate finds are more likely available in spring and fall, leaving summer for crap that nobody else would purchase in spring

Sent from my RS988 using Tapatalk

[z3forlife]

Mainly cause no one would come and look if the ad was truthful. 15-20 year old cars are going to need some work as I'm sure you're prepared for. The " perfect " z is out there just like the perfect woman but you'll probably find one before the other ��

[TommyMaddox]

These cars are extremely expensive to keep in perfect shape and durability on all cosmetic aspects of the vehicles are very low.When you look at things relatively you may find that those examples are actually on the better end of the condition spectrum.

[khammack]

Have you tried looking here - http://www.mroadsterbuyersguide.com/listings

[mpire]

Its funny, but I think most of the craigslist ads are either complete shit or are just the same dealer reposts over and over again.

No one actually reads a newspaper anymore.

Facebook for sale groups are the current thing. It literally takes seconds to list a car with your phone and it lets you cross list it in several places with literally zero additional effort. So if I were you, I would be finding the applicable facebook forsale group and signing up.

I just listed a car there around 7 am while drinking my coffee and standing in the driveway and had cash in hand in less than 6 hours.

I don't want to deal with craigslist people, the first thing they do is low ball you and I absolutely hate people who try to haggle before they even show up in person.

[Colo Springs E]

If these examples are on the better end of the condition spectrum, I won't be buying a Z3, that's for sure. The ones I've looked at are straight garbage but frankly, not priced all that low.

[Mr Bingley]

I agree with Mpire in that Craig's list seems to appeal to the lowest level of seller, and, for whatever reason, has the effect of promoting misrepresentation. However, I have never actually seen Facebook, or have any idea what it is or how to use it, so I won't be listing or buying cars there. I have had great luck buying with eBay--I've bought 8 or 9 cars on it and have always made out. I construct a search, limit it to a 500 mile radius, and check daily for new postings. If you're patient, you should be able to get what you want for about a 3rd of what it's worth within a year of staring your search--at least that's been my experience.

[gmushial]

I've actually gone the other direction: and have been dealing with dealers, but not until Jan or Feb or maybe even March... generally I can hold them to account for what was mis-advertised (intentionally or not); likewise can generally get a short term warrantee... and the people that I've helped, weren't looking for a bottom dollar Z, but one that they could enjoy and not hassle with... and come mid-winter, and the Z has been sitting on the lot for a couple three months: the prices are good. ... my 2 cents. YMMV

[JoshS]

The issue with Craigslist, and even ebay, is the anonymity. There's no reputation on the line. With Facebook Marketplace (which I have used for two transactions now, one selling, one buying, but nothing as expensive as a car) you use your real name and real profile (the public parts of your profile, anyway). So you aren't anonymous and I think this leads to people to be a lot more honest.

[Colo Springs E]

Regarding craigslist: well, I'm certainly open to other methods. I have purchased directly from dealers with good results (some of whom I found through craigslist). I haven't yet tried Facebook marketplace. But I have to add, I have bought 5 or so cars on craigslist without the issues I'm seeing now. And these included European cars for whatever that's worth (an E46 and a Jag x-type). Those cars were accurately described.

I guess the part about the dishonesty I don't get, is it's not like I'm buying sight unseen--I will eventually see the car, and all the flaws and warts it has. Wouldn't it be smarter to slightly under-represent the car?? Oh well, the search continues!

[Bilito]

Its funny, but I think most of the craigslist ads are either complete shit or are just the same dealer reposts over and over again.

No one actually reads a newspaper anymore.

Facebook for sale groups are the current thing. It literally takes seconds to list a car with your phone and it lets you cross list it in several places with literally zero additional effort. So if I were you, I would be finding the applicable facebook forsale group and signing up.

I just listed a car there around 7 am while drinking my coffee and standing in the driveway and had cash in hand in less than 6 hours.

I don't want to deal with craigslist people, the first thing they do is low ball you and I absolutely hate people who try to haggle before they even show up in person.

I sold cars once upon a time many years ago and in training we had a line we used on the phone when a person wanted to lowball you, WE always asked them if you could get a haircut over the phone. When they said no we would say, well then, how can you expect to get price over the phone, come on down, have a look and lets make a deal.

[BimmerBreaker]

I'm also wondering if maybe your standards are just too high...?

"Mint condition" to me does carry a different meaning when applied to a 20 year old car vs. a 2 year old car. I would never expect a 20 year old car to be at my "mint condition" standard for a 2 year old car.
These cars are old, they are going to show wear somewhere unless you are REALLY paying $$$$$ for a showroom example

[mpire]

These cars are extremely expensive to keep in perfect shape and durability on all cosmetic aspects of the vehicles are very low.When you look at things relatively you may find that those examples are actually on the better end of the condition spectrum.

I disagree. The Z3 is terribly easy to take care of and maintain as compared to just about every other BMW that came after it.

The thing is that people had to actually take care of them. I find the M Cars to be in much better condition than the Z3s simply because they were considered "special" by the owners even as they aged. Comparing the condition of my Z3 Coupe to the condition of my M Coupe is a very good example.

The Z3 is high mileage, and while its solid mechanically, they didn't really care to take care of the door panels or do regular mainteance. The M car may have had 190+ k on the clock, but the service history was dramatically more robust.

If you really want a mint car, they are out there. You just need to know where to look. I got one you can buy for a low 6 figure sum that definitely qualifies as mint.

Be patient, the right car will come around. Miles aren't as important as who owned the car.

I keep telling my brother this and he won't listen. He paid top dollar for an M3 with less than 60k miles on it and its just been sitting neglected for 20 years.

[rhitee93]

I am seriously considering just buying a new/certified Miata.

I can understand your frustration, and agree that many people misrepresent their cars either because they have rose colored glasses on, or they are just dishonest.

However the quoted piece of your OP makes me wonder if a Z3 is right for you. Any 20-year old Z3 is going to require considerably more care and maintenance cost than a new Miata. They shouldn't really be compared as equal alternatives. One isn't better than the other, but they are very different from a lifestyle perspective.

[Bilito]

Question, What makes a Z3 an M car? I have 97 Z3 2.8 5 speed convertible and I printed out a build sheet and it says my engine is an M3 with a HECK drivetrain and it lists a development code of E36 (7), and a POWER of 142. What does that all mean? (I am guessing 2.8 is 6 cylinder and Power is 142 HP)

I am thanking everyone in advance.

[BimmerBreaker]

Question, What makes a Z3 an M car? I have 97 Z3 2.8 5 speed convertible and I printed out a build sheet and it says my engine is an M3 with a HECK drivetrain and it lists a development code of E36 (7), and a POWER of 142. What does that all mean? (I am guessing 2.8 is 6 cylinder and Power is 142 HP)

I am thanking everyone in advance.

If its a 2.8 it's not an M

M's are M's

[adhumston]

Are you looking for an M, or a 'regular' Z3?

[SunzOut]

Question, What makes a Z3 an M car? I have 97 Z3 2.8 5 speed convertible and I printed out a build sheet and it says my engine is an M3 with a HECK drivetrain and it lists a development code of E36 (7), and a POWER of 142. What does that all mean? (I am guessing 2.8 is 6 cylinder and Power is 142 HP)

I am thanking everyone in advance.

Nice way to hijack a thread that has nothing to do with your question....

[paul4223]

OP's post makes me think of a line in that country music song: "Lookin' for love in all the wrong places...."
I don't, in the least, mean to be snarky. I found my M Coupe online in another BMW forum. The car was an 800 mile plane ride away. I paid an independent BMW garage for a detailed inspection. The car checked out fine and I knew what to expect when I arrived to purchase it and drive it home. The only "surprise" was some paint defects which I was able to correct using some touch up paint, an orbital buffer, and a few hours of careful labor. Full disclosure: I've been known to be called "obsessive."

Otherwise the car was completely solid and accurately described by the seller.

[pine1000]

I suspect that all perfect condition Z3s are owned and maintained by people who love their cars.

Luckily, you are in a forum filled with such people.

If you are serious, throw out a ball park offer (maybe 25% over nada retail). Who knows, you might get some interest.

Otherwise, I would try to find a good condition car and bring it up to "perfect".

[Colo Springs E]

Thanks for all the info everyone-- I really appreciate it.

To be clear: I am NOT looking for perfection, or anything close to it. I would like a car that is in at least "good" condition visually, and is solid mechanically (hopefully with at least a decent maintenance history). Some minor nicks and dings? I'm good with some character flaws here and there

The ones I've checked out so far were well below that standard. Most were what I would describe as "fair" condition.

I am giving serious thought though, is this what I really want to pursue. I owned two E46s in the last 5 years, and as much as I loved driving them.... damn, I really detested the constant trips to the mechanic. So, I probably need to think really hard about whether or not I want to jump back into BMW ownership again.

[healeydays]

Don't worry as the car that you want is out there and you'll find it. As for Craigslist ads, not all folks are liars. I sold my 97 to someone on the list and I think he'll tell you that I advertised it fairly and he got a great car for the age. As for my 2001, it was better than he advertised it. So, don't give up and take your time till you find the one you want and don't be afraid to look miles away in another state. If you need to, ask to have someone check it for you if too far away too.

[Terry F.]

If you buy the right car, you can buy it sight-unseen and ship it with high confidence. Shop US wide. I have bought my Roady, Phaeton and now Mini from other areas or states. 3-0.

With these cars, use the guide and find a loved car.

[mpire]

Come to think of it, I had some of the guys from the forum check out the Press coupe before I bought it.

They changed the oil for me too!

Then I flew up to DC and drove it back to Florida.

I brought a new water pump with me for luck, so of course I didn't need it.