Ultrasuede closest matching stock gray headliner

[GregT53]

I looked into getting a new headliner but my color is NLA. I bought parchment color one for my E34 525 in November 2015 for $250 ( a real bargain) but all other colors were NLA. Now, even parchment is NLA. Unfortunately, BMW does not support its vintage owner enthusiasts very well. The silver lining is that it made it easier to justify recovering the entire interior.

[Smith Jason]

Isn't that the truth. I called Bavauto to get some stuff for my car that is NLA. He mentioned that MB and Porsche do a much better job with that. He suggested I try Europe so I did. Still waiting to hear back. I am looking for the elusive quarter window sun shades. RealOEM shows them as available but it is not always accurate. The headliner very well may end up in a new material if I cannot get a new one. It is on my list of things to do next year.

[Jackson42]

I don't know if they can help with the Alcantara, but I've had really good luck over the years with World Upholstery and Trim in Santa Paula, CA. They are not the cheapest supplier, but the interior kits and materials I've purchased from them have all been first-rate.

[GregT53]

I don't know if they can help with the Alcantara, but I've had really good luck over the years with World Upholstery and Trim in Santa Paula, CA. They are not the cheapest supplier, but the interior kits and materials I've purchased from them have all been first-rate.

World Upholstery is a great supplier of interior leather, fabrics, vinyl, and dyes/paints. They have some nice, ready made re-upholstery covers. I do not believe that they sell Alcantara, but you could really go over the top and use leather for the headliner, pillars, and package shelf.

[katit2]

Update: Got Weldwood glue and bought Ultrasuede Toray #5970 (French Grey). I decided not to even wait for Alcantara sample. I paid $100 for almost 5 yards of this material. Which would cost $500+ for alcantara.
Actually, this Ultrasuede costs about as much as Alcantara if you pay List price. I got remnants on eBay. Better color match would be #5971 but again, same issue with a price. In any case #5970 is very close match to original one, but looks so much better.

Will see how it turns out.

[David9999999]

Nice- can you post a photo comparing the new to old colors? Looking forward to hearing about your results.

[sugaki]

The visors are original leather.

What option package did those come under? My impression was it came with full leather interiors, but notice you have vinyl door cards.

[GregT53]

I bought the visors a few years ago from a forum member.

[katit2]

Nice- can you post a photo comparing the new to old colors? Looking forward to hearing about your results.

Picture doesn't transfer colors that great, but anyway. 2 samples on top of my old discolored rear shelf. Left sample is 5971 and I think it would be perfect match, maybe a little too dark. Right sample is what I got (#5970). Looks like too light on picture, but in reality it's same color as discolored shelf. I figured I'm OK with lighter interior, it will look good. As long as I do good job applying it

[David9999999]

Thanks! So you figure your rear shelf is a bit faded? In that case it does look like the 5971 would be closer. I assume you don't have the side pillar covers or headliner pieces which might be less faded?

[katit2]

Thanks! So you figure your rear shelf is a bit faded? In that case it does look like the 5971 would be closer. I assume you don't have the side pillar covers or headliner pieces which might be less faded?

Shelf is out because I'm redoing suspension, no pillars taken out yet. But in any case - I can tell for sure 5971 is closer. It's that "reacher" gray color. But I will be OK with 5970 for price reasons. It is lighter but not that light. Camera doesn't give very good colors.

[katit2]

Received Alcantara sample today. It's in a middle. It's got different color to it. Color is OK, also I think 5971 matches better. But Alcantara has some kind of "plasticky" backing which will make gluing easier for sure, will have to really try to get glue through it.
Also, Alcantara probably 1/2 thinner with about same weight. Density of Alcantara is much higher, it feels more like leather. It's stretches not as good (which is good because I need all I can get). All in all - if color fastness of Ultrasuede is as good as they advertise - I will be happy. It's not like I'm making seats out of it.

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[katit2]

I got my Alcantara at Gulf Fabrics in Florida. Cost was $109/yard. Figure on five to six yards to do everything. The headliner alone will take about 2.5 yards. You might wonder why so much material. The reason is that Alcantara has a grain to it so to properly install it you must keep the same orientation on all the surfaces being covered.

If you are investing this much labor you should consider the differences between Alcantara and other makers of ultrasuede. After doing all of my comparisons I decided on Alcantara because of its superior colorfastness and durability. Alcantara is noticeably thicker than all the other materials.

I would advise you to have it professionally installed by someone who has worked with Alcantara. It requires using steam to get around the compound curves as it does not stretch.

Use Weldwood Landau Top Adhesive; it is heat resistant.

Hi Greg!

Another question. Did you do prep work yourself? I started to clean rear shelf. Foam came off with light brushing (metal brush). But there is still sticky residue. I tried using Acetone and it seems to be doing good job rubbing off this "sticky" stuff. I wonder if there is something better/easier?

Thanks!

[GregT53]

Yes, I did all the prep work. Acetone is the best glue solvent. I used medium grade steel wool to help greak up stubborn patches. After most (I.e. 90%) was removed I used 220 grit sandpaper to make a smooth surface. I think if you get the headliner shell smooth enough you could eliminate use of foam backing. The advantage of doing this is a more secure application as it is the foam that breaks down over time, not the glue, that results in headliner sag. One thing to be aware of is that without the foam fitment between the headliner and the pillar tops may show a bit more gap, but with material like Alcantara the thickness helps minimize this.

[katit2]

Yes, I did all the prep work. Acetone is the best glue solvent. I used medium grade steel wool to help greak up stubborn patches. After most (I.e. 90%) was removed I used 220 grit sandpaper to make a smooth surface. I think if you get the headliner shell smooth enough you could eliminate use of foam backing. The advantage of doing this is a more secure application as it is the foam that breaks down over time, not the glue, that results in headliner sag. One thing to be aware of is that without the foam fitment between the headliner and the pillar tops may show a bit more gap, but with material like Alcantara the thickness helps minimize this.

Great, I'm doing it right then. After all prepped I will check what pro's will charge to glue it up Maybe I don't want to re-do it

I'm not doing foam backing. Don't know what thickness your Alcantara was(my sample is ~1mm), but Ultrasuede Toray I got is thicker, probably 1.1-1.2mm. I think it will be good without any foam for sure.

P.S. I'm driving car now after full suspension rebuild and really excited about interior. I think this is going to be great all around car, but need to have interior restored.

[katit2]

Never easy with those cars, isn't it? I removed C-pillars, A-pillars. Those don't really need to be prepped. Finally done with rear shelf after scrubbing with wire brush and then acetone. Then sanding with 80 grit paper.

B-pillars is another question. Driver side was kind of easy, raised seat, then took belt out and pillar out. Easy peasy. Passenger side - oh my. I got "twisted" seat. Right side won't raise. Can't take belt out. So, had to pull whole seat out to get this trim (and seat need to be fixed..)

B-pillars is PITA. How do you remove cover from those? It's glued really well and underlining white layer just won't come out..

[katit2]

Upholstery Level 1

Started simple. Sunroof panel is the best piece to practice with. Came out great.
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[katit2]

Upholstery Level 2
A-B-C pillars. Don't know, but I didn't do them in one shot. I did all pieces in 3 shots. Exposing 1/3 first, then doing middle portion and then last 1/3. Key is to keep rest covered in plastic.

Also it glues "permanent" on contact - it's not really permanent. If you screw up - you can always pull material back and fix. Not bad, really. Main thing - keep it covered. I didn't cover one piece and guess what? Got some glue on it. It cleaned up, but still, keep it covered!

Notice how I laid out pillars so material orientation kept the same.

Level 3 will be rear shelf and Level 4 is headliner, also I feel that headliner won't be bad at all. Rear shelf seems the worst, but I have some ideas, stay tuned...

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[katit2]

Ok, "level 2" failed. On C-pillars I screwed up. 1st - I sprayed to much on one and it bled through. 2nd - While spraying air from gun lifted fabric and I got glue on a face part. Both scrapped and cleaned again. Lesson: Use masking tape, cover very well. Don't over-spray. I guess I was too confident after doing A/B pillars.

"Level 3" going well. I think rear shelf is a most complex piece because of shape. Part where stop light is didn't work well at all trying to do it as whole piece. I had to pull fabric and now I do about 1 inch at a time brushing glue on as I go. Brush, dry/wait, glue. Repeat.. tedious but nothing hard. Just need to come up with more efficient way to do headliner.
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[BleedsBlue]

Nice, good thread for my future reference. I've got an OE black M5 headliner to put in my formerly silver-grey M5, but only C Pillars. I'll have to wrap the A pillars to match and have yet to find a perfect black match. It will probably only bother me and only be noticeable in nice photos, but still.

[katit2]

Pictures of this material don't really give it justice. In person whole thing looks so much "warmer" and nicer - it's unbelievable. I think of this not as "fix" to sagging headliner but as improvement of interior because it starts to look very different from original. More modern..

[GregT53]

There is a reason why ultrasuede is used in higher end cars, and why it's on the list of custom order items for cars like E34 Individual builds. Absolutely not just a fix; it's a great upgrade. Like I said earlier, not being able to get an OE replacement headliner put me in a position to either have a mismatched headliner or do the whole job. Glad it turned out that way because I am loving my Alcantara.

[katit2]

I'm done with all pieces except for headliner. Will pull it off tonight. I don't anticipate any issues with doing headliner as I learned a lot while doing all pillars and back shelf.

So far - main advice I would give is: DO NOT use spray gun. This glue (recommended above) goes on easily with a brush. I had no issues whatsoever with bleed-through on ultrasuede using brush. But I did waste one piece because of too much spray bleed through. And I wasted another piece when I sprayed on a face side. Whole "spray" thing is kind of pushing you to be in a "rush" and make mistakes. It's messy. If you have no helper to stretch fabric - you can't deal with bigger pieces. So. Brush and glue. Repeat. Works excellent. I did back shelf with 2-3 inch steps. On headliner it looks like easy profile, will take bigger brush and probably going to go in 5-6 inch steps.

Fabric orientation: That's another thing to watch for. It's not about "stretching". It's about suede orientation. When you move your palm over - you will see which way fibers directed. You want them to go down. That applies to A/B/C pillars. With Ultrasuede(R) this direction matches how fabric rolled on a spool. So, for back shelf and top you want them to go "back". I had to re-glue sunroof cover because I put it backwards.

[katit2]

Update for level 4 (headliner). After removing I realized how fragile it is. Rear shelf may have some sharp angles, but it's pretty stiff. Headliner is very gentle. Cleaning it was 2 steps. First light brushing with vacuum, Second - wipe with acetone.

Then I started to think how to knock it down. I realize with material I have there is no freaking way you can do what they show on YouTube. It just doesn't stretch easily. No freaking way. So, I decided to start in a middle (axis) and go to sides. This is not touching rear portion but covering handles and sunroof opening. Main reason - I can approach handles and tackle them carefully. Need to move really slow when doing recesses. Like 1/2-2 inch at a time. There is probably lot more I should say, I learned many tricks and would do second one no problem, but probably wouldn't, just too time consuming. Pictures of process and start attached!1.jpg2.JPG3.jpg4.jpg

[katit2]

Pictures of screw-ups, but to make it fair - most of them not visible because covered or not in a view (I decided to do so in front of sunroof panel for example, there was no way to stretch it overthere)
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