M52 starts then dies help!

**zohaibrose** · 07-23-2017, 12:05 PM

Hello everyone I've been trying to figure this out the past month the cars been sitting forever I can't do anything until it's done. It's a 98 328is. I replaced the ccv system, cleaned out the icv even looked at all the vaccum hoses their all connected. I can start the car but as soon as I do it dies the second after. What could it be? I know it's not a maf sensor because I've tried 3 different ones. any other possibilities? It's killing me

**dworthy** · 07-23-2017, 12:41 PM

Have you looked at the Crank Position sensor yet? How about pulled any codes from the DME?

**zohaibrose** · 07-23-2017, 02:41 PM

I've got quite a bit of codes I still don't know what's causing it P1250,P0412,P0505,P1188,P1189,P0170,P0173,P0101,P0 170 P, p0173 these are all the ones I got from code reader

**dworthy** · 07-23-2017, 03:01 PM

Well 4 of them tell me you have a vacuum leak, the P017x ones.

The P-1250 points to the fuel pump being bad, which you can check using the schrader valve and a fuel pressure gauge.

The one after that has to do with the secondary air pump, that will not keep the car from starting/running.

505 is your ISV, which can keep the car from a proper idle, but won't stop it from running. You can clean it with carb or maf cleaner and re-install it.

The 1188/89 are fuel mixture, worry about them later.

So do this: Clear all the codes and see if the car starts. If not, then pull the codes again to see which ones come back and post them up.

**zohaibrose** · 07-23-2017, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by dworthy

Well 4 of them tell me you have a vacuum leak, the P017x ones.

The P-1250 points to the fuel pump being bad, which you can check using the schrader valve and a fuel pressure gauge.

The one after that has to do with the secondary air pump, that will not keep the car from starting/running.

505 is your ISV, which can keep the car from a proper idle, but won't stop it from running. You can clean it with carb or maf cleaner and re-install it.

The 1188/89 are fuel mixture, worry about them later.

So do this: Clear all the codes and see if the car starts. If not, then pull the codes again to see which ones come back and post them up.

Oh thanks so much for help I've tried getting help from mobile mechanics none are replying your best help I'd get.
As for the fuel pump I thought mine was good because I can hear it whine when I turn key to the on position.

As for the icv I've cleaned the hell out of that I don't know why it's giving me a check engine still let me clear the codes and see what shows up if they all come back the same then maybe it's not seated correctly,

**zohaibrose** · 07-23-2017, 03:46 PM

Ok just cleared the codes and the two codes that stayed pending are p0170 and P0173 I tried starting the car but still nothing, says I've got no fault codes but those are the two codes I still have guessing because vaccum leak, I made sure all the hoses were connected under the intake manifold and they are but it's still doing this start and stall for some reason. I'm guessing the p1188 and p1189 will come back when the car runs because air fuel ratio is not good but darn it I've checked all fuses their good what else it could be is Killing me

**bmwdirtracer** · 07-23-2017, 07:54 PM

Test the fuel pressure. Just because you here it make noise doesn't mean it's pumping fuel, or producing the correct pressure.

**zohaibrose** · 07-23-2017, 10:16 PM

Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer

Test the fuel pressure. Just because you here it make noise doesn't mean it's pumping fuel, or producing the correct pressure.

What if the fuel pressure is good could it be that the ccv is problem because I installed a brand new one if I remember it works with the dirt old oily one

**bmwdirtracer** · 07-24-2017, 06:18 AM

In such a situation, I establish a baseline set of facts. Fuel pressure is what I'd be testing.

You want to see if the problem is the ICV? Hold your foot down on the gas pedal 1/4 way. If the car starts and keeps running, the ICV is likely. If it still stalls, test fuel pressure.

**zohaibrose** · 07-24-2017, 08:29 PM

Just an update guys, the car did run on it's own when I took out the new ccv and put a rubber plug in it's place, wtf? I thought a new ccv would make it run its the same one from BMW it was snug in it's hole and even the old ccv that was gunky was working with the car I don't know what's wrong with the new one, the car is hissing so I have a vaccum leak somewhere so I don't think it's fuel related it's gotta be air related

**zohaibrose** · 07-24-2017, 08:59 PM

Could this one be faulty and order a new one? I really want to get rid of this ccv system it's killing me I see some people using catch cans and stuff but I don't know what the heck that is and nobody told me how to do it or what it is

**bmwdirtracer** · 07-25-2017, 06:18 AM

If you put plugs in all the holes the ccv normally occupies, and the car idled, then you have a massive intake leak. And I still think you should test fuel pressure.

**dworthy** · 07-25-2017, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer

If you put plugs in all the holes the ccv normally occupies, and the car idled, then you have a massive intake leak. And I still think you should test fuel pressure.

+1

Once you figure out the fuel pressure is good, then we can move on to the next item up for bid: Ignition system

**zohaibrose** · 07-25-2017, 03:01 PM

But wouldn't fuel pressure have nothing to do with it if the car idles without the ccv and a rubber plug in it's place? With the new ccv it doesn't idle. So this would be something as a faulty ccv I'm returning it because even my old ccv the car idled with it.

**bmwdirtracer** · 07-25-2017, 10:16 PM

First, you establish baselines. You cannot produce a valid diagnosis based on happenstance.

If you do it that way, you're going to end up throwing expensive parts, and extensive labor, without ever establishing a set of proven factors which enable you to rule things out.

IF you can establish that the engine does not sputter and die, and holds proper fuel pressure through three or four gears, flat out, you can say the fuel delivery isn't the issue.

After a pro smoke test, you can prove the intake system isn't leaking.

And, um....it's not the ICV, because you took it our of the equation. Hell, you proved that the car runs with every air passage deleted.....which is impossible, of course. Therefore you have a massive intake leak. IYou have zero proof that fuel pressure remains reliable though.}

**zohaibrose** · 07-26-2017, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer

First, you establish baselines. You cannot produce a valid diagnosis based on happenstance.

If you do it that way, you're going to end up throwing expensive parts, and extensive labor, without ever establishing a set of proven factors which enable you to rule things out.

IF you can establish that the engine does not sputter and die, and holds proper fuel pressure through three or four gears, flat out, you can say the fuel delivery isn't the issue.

After a pro smoke test, you can prove the intake system isn't leaking.

And, um....it's not the ICV, because you took it our of the equation. Hell, you proved that the car runs with every air passage deleted.....which is impossible, of course. Therefore you have a massive intake leak. IYou have zero proof that fuel pressure remains reliable though.}

Yeah I'm gonna test fuel pressure anyway maybe I have a bad fpr who knows but I didn't say every air hole deleted i said if I put a rubber plug in where the ccv goes the car will idle but with the new ccv it won't, any reason you think that is?

**dworthy** · 07-26-2017, 12:19 PM

Me thinks that the old CCV was plugged up, and now you have air flowing, it is killing the car.

**MIKYZZ4** · 07-26-2017, 12:30 PM

OP, listen to what these 2 top techs in this forum are trying to explain to you.
Follow their recommended steps at diagnosis, that means follow procedures,
guessing and changing things willy-nilly is bad, we need confirmation at each step,
then once confirmed can proceed to the next step. You're in good hands here,
They truly know BMW diagnostics, make use of their knowledge and take heed of their advice.

**MIKYZZ4** · 07-26-2017, 12:35 PM

I myself have some knowledge,
but I really don't have nothing to add,
as it would be a rehash of what has already been said.

**zohaibrose** · 07-26-2017, 04:13 PM

I've tested for fuel pressure the mechanic said it's in good reading, I don't remember what the results were but what could this problem be? Oh my I just tried another ccv and its still dying upon startup. If I plug in a rubber plug to where the ccv goes it will idle, I don't get it how is that possible the car doesn't want to cooperate with a ccv anyone have any idea, like anything will help

**328 Power 04** · 07-26-2017, 06:43 PM

I almost want to bet you have a bunch of vacuum leaks, compounding the problem even more as you focus on just the CCV. I have seen what these E36s look like after a lot of miles and some neglect.

**zohaibrose** · 07-26-2017, 07:30 PM

Originally Posted by 328 Power 04

I almost want to bet you have a bunch of vacuum leaks, compounding the problem even more as you focus on just the CCV. I have seen what these E36s look like after a lot of miles and some neglect.

Oh is that why you think it's stalling? I can confirm with you I do have a vaccum leak but I didn't think that could stop me from idling at least, with the rubber plug in place it does idle, with the ccv in place it does not, that's why I'm focused on the ccv problem

**shadowpuck** · 07-26-2017, 08:00 PM

Yup. Yeah I agree. Smoke test and confirm fuel pressure. We need real data - not theory.

**zohaibrose** · 07-27-2017, 01:56 AM

Ok everyone I have just smoke tested the car and thankfully found that I was missing a gasket on the front of throttle body and the throttle body wasn't closed correctly hopefully it idles tomm morning

**dworthy** · 07-27-2017, 02:17 AM

Cool, now once that is done, have it tested again. Let me tell you why: The smoke will go out the biggest hole, and you won't see the smaller ones. You have to confirm that the intake is completely sealed before moving forward. Now if you still have problems and the fuel pressure is at 51PSI, plus the intake is sealed, we will move on to the next thing.