Vader variations and questions

[tsmith25]

I have had two cars with vaders now, the other was a sedan with sport seats. The first was a 95 with manual, and the current is a 99 with electric.

I don't fit as well in the 99 electric vaders as I did in the 95 manual set. Does anybody know if there was a design change when they did the 96+ facelift? the two things that I have noticed that are different, are the height, and leg bolster position.

I remember the 95 leg bolster position being closer to my knee, than the current set, which are about mid thigh. I also noticed this when I got into the sedan sport seats, but thought it was just because they were sedan seats instead of vaders.

The lowest setting is still higher than I would like, both for head clearance, and for steering wheel to leg clearance. I am guessing that this is from the electric seats motor clearance.

Basically, for when I get to the point that I can work on fixing this, I am trying to figure out if I just need a set of manual frames, or if I should look for 95 manual frames specifically.

Or if anybody has modified theirs to fix either of those two things, I would like to know how you did it.

[BMWManiac]

How don't know how varied they were, but I can tell you that the headrests from early M3s are flat and the headrest from later M3s have a protruding part in the middle, followed by two seams. When I googled it, the first row of images had the later Vaders while the second row had a couple images of the early Vaders

This is a pic of my early model Vader headrest on a later model Vader. The asshole had a couple sets of Vaders he was doing and sent me the wrong ones.
IMAG0237.jpg

[Moron95M3]

yup, early '95s had single stitch head rest. The change came mid '95, and got a double stitch. Also, the older '95 vaders are more difficult to take apart, before photoshop killed forums...there was a good writeup someone on here.

[MauiM3Mania]

.... before PhotoBucket killed forums...there was a good writeup someone on here.

Fixed.

[Moron95M3]

ty

[tsmith25]

They really did ruin a lot of valuable DIY's. I feel like there should have been some type of pre-existing hosting continuation thing. They are basically holding forums ransom for money. "Give us money, and you can have your information back." It is unethical at the least.

I may have figured out the leg bolster thing, by staring at google images for a while. It looks like BMW added lumbar support to the later vaders, which pushes your hips forward within the frame of the seat. It basically makes the seatback less deep. I am not sure if there is a way to modify this or not.

[bmwstephen]

i'd skip the 95 m3 vaders. they were a major rush design that wasn't serviceable and I mean you cannot fix anything on the seat without destroying the upholstery. Those seats also had a fiber glass back rest that tend to snap and distort the seat.

[MParallel]

Leccy seats definitely sit hihger. I have two verts, both sport seats, one manual, one leccy, both lowest setting, same position.

When I go from 328i to M3 and vice versa, you notice it right away. And is the reason I'm not upgrading my M3 seats to leccy ones.

[Braymond141]

1996 was not a facelift year. 1996 marked the introduction of OBD2 and the 3.2 to the US market. Other than a unique 96 only set of kidneys that fit in the prefacelift nose panel, nothing else changed visually. 1997-1999 are facelift models.

Mid 1995 production year BMW changed the seats. Early frames are very basic. The foam is what makes up the shape of the seat which is why so many early vaders have folded over bolsters. They wear horribly and always look like fat cankles to me. The revised seats had far more metal structure to them that helped make up the shape of the seat.

[TH3 Shifty]

braymond... change your subtitle from "Expert" to "Authority"... or "Encyclopedia"... you are the Google of E36 M3

[nismo2020]

How can you tell what year Vaders you have? is there a different part number?

[Moron95M3]

You can tell if you have single or double stitching on the headrest whether it's a early vs. late style.

Hope that helps.
Early (single stitch)
passseat.jpg

Later (two stitches)
dceadd8d8704f34f707072af3fce1191--interior-ideas-vader.jpg

[nismo2020]

Blasted!! I have single stitching...

[35nhma]

You can tell if you have single or double stitching on the headrest whether it's a early vs. late style.

Hope that helps.
Early (single stitch)
passseat.jpg

Later (two stitches)
dceadd8d8704f34f707072af3fce1191--interior-ideas-vader.jpg

helpful, thanks.

mine is a 10/95 with double stitching.

[RRSperry]

Mine is 5-95 and is right at the change over for some things. It has the early smooth black bumper trim, (Pretty sure that changed to textured in 6-95) and it has double stitched headrests... And it hasn't dropped a valve...(10-95) lol

I had some this AM, since there is only one car in the garage. I sold my 2016 C7 Corvette, my new 2021 C8 hard top convertible was built last Wednesday, and I'll be bringing it home this Wednesday... It's crazy how well the Corvette held it's value and how much interest I had in it when I posted it for sale on the corvette forum.. (at least I think so..) All the M3 has for company is the Aprilia... (and the golf simulator...lol)

[35nhma]

RRSPERRY— what is your 10/95 reference to dropping a valve?

I found another picture of old vaders on a BAT auction. VIN Decoder says production date is 3/94! That's early.

old vaders.jpg

[RRSperry]

There were some cases of early M3's dropping a valve because of a valve retainer failure. BMW started to use retainers and keepers that had extra hardening. The official change was 10/95 and onwards. IIRC, it was only a problem for cars that saw a lot of high RPM use... Anyway, the proposed fix was to replace all the keepers and retainers with the upgraded parts.

Basically, put a cylinder at tdc, use air to hold the valves up, and then change the valve hardware.

I never bothered... Haven't had a problem..

I told myself that if I ever had to have the head off, I'd get it done. Almost 26 years later, haven't had to do it...

[bmwstephen]

RRSPERRY— what is your 10/95 reference to dropping a valve?

I found another picture of old vaders on a BAT auction. VIN Decoder says production date is 3/94! That's early.

old vaders.jpg

I used to have access to a TSB that list all the changes for BMW and I recall it listed it as either a 9/95 or 10/95 production revision. If it is any consolation, my car was a 10/95 production and I noticed I had practically every enhancement that addressed common problems in my 8/94 production (which I sold). For example:

-Dashboard reinforcement plate (prevents center ac vent from warping)
-Speaker system found in 96+s (I was able to install bavauto sound system that was for 96+ only)
-Late style vaders with power and heated seats (although this could have been swapped in by the PO)
-front strut tower reinforcement plates (although this could have also been swapped in by PO, somoene confirmed for me)
-reinforced front subframe
-nut insert provision for xbrace underneath subframe

In short, if you desire an s50 over s52 e36 m3; aim for the late production models they seemed to had all the kinks out.