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Thread: Best cams, street/track car

  1. #26
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    I had my original valves checked and ground and reused them along with supertech springs. Valves are pricey and i'm not totally convinced they just fall apart without a little piston contact.

    My head machine work was $1200 including new guides and seals, valve springs were like $600, so yeh $2k is easy even doing the gasket install yourself.
    Last edited by TXBDan; 07-17-2017 at 09:55 AM.

  2. #27
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    Well, just spoke with VAC.

    #1 They're out of stock on the street schricks. (Dammit!)
    #2 They recommend going with their double valve spring kit with the Schrick 276 if the car is a track car. That spring kit is $859. (Ouch!)
    #3 They also recommend going with Viton valve stem seals with those cams
    #4 Depending on the motor you may not need to shim the vanos with the 276 cams, but you absolutely need to measure clearance first to see
    #5 I can piece together a nice oil cooler kit using a universal Mishimoto AN based kit, their AN adapter kit and a used S54 oil filter housing

    In talking with them they feel the street schricks don't really give much power, which isn't a surprise to all of us. However the cost of the 276's increases dramatically with having to use the double valve spring kit.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TXBDan View Post
    I had my original valves checked and ground and reused them along with supertech springs. Valves are pricey and i'm not totally convinced they just fall apart without a little piston contact.

    My head machine work was $1200 including new guides and seals, valve springs were like $600, so yeh $2k is easy even doing the gasket install yourself.
    My stock valves just bent a tiny bit, but did not break. I caught the over rev relatively early. But if you search around, there are periodic stories of the stock 2 piece valves breaking rather than bending.

    I think Supertech springs are cheaper than VAC. Ferrea may also make springs for these motors.

    Staying with stock or mild cams is definitely cheaper. If you were happy with your motor before, just fix it stock.

  4. #29
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    Yup, I can get SuperTechs for around $575. Still makes me have to think about going with the bigger 276's though, as the 276's are $300 more, than the $575 for valve springs and another $150 (over the "regular" rebuilt vanos) for the limited vanos. So those are about $1000 more than the mild schricks.

    On the valve front I suppose I'll let the machine shop check them out, if they're damaged, I'll replace them. If they're fine, I won't.

    I think at this point my best bet is to either stick with the stock cams, or get a street grind set, either the Schrick's or Riot Racing, or Epic's....
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  5. #30
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    mslevin is offline Have you checked RealOEM? BMW CCA Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocWyte View Post
    Yes, head gaskets are that much money. Figure $2000 not counting oil cooler, cams, valve springs, etc, etc, etc.
    How're you getting $2000? I did a head gasket on my M50 recently. Head cleaned/decked/tested, rebuilt VANOS, tensioners, full gasket kit, ARP studs, special tools, etc. I've never fully added it up but I don't think it was even $1000. Are you having a shop do it?
    1993 E36 325is

    Quote Originally Posted by JEC928 View Post
    Step 1: Take a thick wad of cash, place it on the hood, light it on fire. Does it hurt? Yes, that's what a project car feels like.

  6. #31
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    Shop labor. I just don't have the time to do this job, plus I've never done it before, so it'll take me even longer.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  7. #32
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    Yes, he is paying for labor, which is why this is a much more expensive project than it would be for a DIYer. I think the best way to own a modded car or an older car is as a DIYer. Otherwise too much of the mod budget gets eaten up in labor. I started significant DIY projects late in life, so I can say it is never too late to learn. If worried, get someone who has done the job before to help. I might not have a turbo E36M3 and a modded NA E90M3 if I had to pay labor.

  8. #33
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    I do the vast majority of work on the car myself for that very reason. Paying $125/hour adds up really quickly on an older car that needs attention.

    I'm caught in the perfect storm here really. I've never done this job before and I don't have a whole lot of free time to do it. It's also the middle of my track season and I want to get the car back together ASAP so I don't miss many events. I've already missed one this year because of the motor mount failure.

    If this happened in October, I'd definitely do it myself as I'd have months to get it done and more free time as the kids are in school.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  9. #34
    mslevin's Avatar
    mslevin is offline Have you checked RealOEM? BMW CCA Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocWyte View Post
    Shop labor. I just don't have the time to do this job, plus I've never done it before, so it'll take me even longer.
    Ah okay that makes sense. It took me about 2 weeks, but I worked very slowly and carefully (first time doing it as well). I had a local shop quote me $6500 for a HG- that did include a whole new cooling system but I still think thats outrageous. Another shop quoted me $3000. I think shop rates are higher here, $2000 doesn't sound bad (relatively) to have the job done.
    1993 E36 325is

    Quote Originally Posted by JEC928 View Post
    Step 1: Take a thick wad of cash, place it on the hood, light it on fire. Does it hurt? Yes, that's what a project car feels like.

  10. #35
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    It'll end up being a little more as I plan on adding an oil cooler at the same time, plus whatever the machine shop charges for work done to the head. Then, obviously, cams if I do them.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocWyte View Post
    Well, just spoke with VAC.

    #1 They're out of stock on the street schricks. (Dammit!)
    #2 They recommend going with their double valve spring kit with the Schrick 276 if the car is a track car. That spring kit is $859. (Ouch!)
    #3 They also recommend going with Viton valve stem seals with those cams
    #4 Depending on the motor you may not need to shim the vanos with the 276 cams, but you absolutely need to measure clearance first to see
    #5 I can piece together a nice oil cooler kit using a universal Mishimoto AN based kit, their AN adapter kit and a used S54 oil filter housing

    In talking with them they feel the street schricks don't really give much power, which isn't a surprise to all of us. However the cost of the 276's increases dramatically with having to use the double valve spring kit.
    Call a few other places. Or at the very least Bimmerworld. Honestly, I don't generally trust VAC to do anything other than upsell the $hit out of you.

  12. #37
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    I've talked with Bimmerworld yesterday. The only place with those Schrick 276's is VAC. Bimmerworld has the Epic cams, the sport cams can use the stock valve springs but they recommend upgrading. Not really sure what that means for durability, maybe its a CYA just in case something happens?

    Waiting to see on a few used sets of cams, if those fall through I'll most likely get the mild schricks, as they're a drop in and go cam set.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocWyte View Post
    I've talked with Bimmerworld yesterday. The only place with those Schrick 276's is VAC. Bimmerworld has the Epic cams, the sport cams can use the stock valve springs but they recommend upgrading. Not really sure what that means for durability, maybe its a CYA just in case something happens?

    Waiting to see on a few used sets of cams, if those fall through I'll most likely get the mild schricks, as they're a drop in and go cam set.
    I think you're kinda stuck. I bet it's some degree of CYA since they don't want your valves getting whacked and then you coming back to them saying "WTF?".

    If the cams are really for chasing a class, would it make sense to keep the engine on stock cams and try to take some weight out?

  14. #39
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    I've done all the easy weight removal on the car. Anything else really pushes it over the line from track/street car to track only car. I'm not sure what the new rules will be, its possible that with a higher hp/lb ratio I'd get more latitude in tire size and compound, but I'm not sure.

    Basically at this point my budget is dictating this more than anything. I can't see spending $2000 just on the 276's and valve springs alone. Unless I can get my hands on a set of the Epic Sport cams for a reasonable price, I'm going to get the mild schricks. They'll give me a nice little bump and won't cost me a ton of extra cash.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  15. #40
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    Yeh, but you're also spending money on a nonoptimal solution that is a dead end because of stock valve springs. Those cams add more midrange torque than top end so you might not even notice a lot on track. If you're sure you'll be happy with it long term, good, but if not, I think it'd be smarter to spend the cam money on valve springs so down the road you can add "real" cams. Granted, "dropping in" the big cams isn't trivial since you might have to shim the VANOS. But still, not a head job.

    Also, contact Achilles. They know their shit and seem rational in contrast with other shops that up sell the shit out of you all the time.
    Last edited by TXBDan; 07-18-2017 at 12:13 PM.

  16. #41
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    I very much doubt I'll ever go back to install cams later. I can't see spending the time to do it for an incremental gain or spend the money to pay a shop to do it.

    This is very much a "while I'm there" type of purchase. It makes sense to add cams because its really no additional labor/cost right now. Both of those very much come into play if I add them at a later date.

    That's why the much larger cost of the bigger sets of cams is making me pause. Not only are they not really in my budget but I don't see the cost/benefit of them for me. Since I have no plans to go back and install cams later, there's no sense in buying valve springs now and sticking with the stock cams.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  17. #42
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    OK, everything is ordered and on its way. Here's the run down
    Schrick 264/256 cams
    Epic Tuning for cams
    S54 Oil filter housing
    Euro E36 OEM oil lines and oil cooler
    Bimmerworld Vanos line banjo bolt
    Bimmerworld Oil filter housing thermostat bypass kit
    Bimmerworld Oil cooler mounting kit
    VAC rebuilt Vanos unit
    VAV OEM+ valve springs
    Camshaft and crankshaft sensors
    ARP head studs

    I'll let the shop order up all the gaskets, heater core hoses, etc. Head will go to the machine shop to get checked out. Sending the car to the shop next Friday.
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

  18. #43
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    If I was selling my Metric Mechanic cams, would you consider them? They'd be a good bit cheaper than the Schricks! The motor is all apart right now so there'd be no delay in shipping them out to you.

  19. #44
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    Appreciate the offer, but I have the schricks on their way....
    '98 M3 track whore
    '06 Porsche Cayenne Turbo S 521hp daily driver/Ski Machine/Tow Pig
    '07 KTM 990 Adventure Beastly 2 wheeler

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