1981 BMW 320i e21 fuel regulator adjustment HELP

[epmedia]

Be safe with that fuel. Fire extinguisher, no sparks, eye protection, etc...

Originally, there are small cone-shape filters under the injector-line banjo bolts on the fuel distributor. And yes, it's very possible the injectors are dirty. Check for the small filters, they are very hidden and the ports must be dry to see them.

Remember that no fuel is suppose to come out the injectors when the meter plate is at 'rest'.

[320iAman]

Randy
Sorry , I have been several days with out internet service , and finally I got it back (Spectrum ....NO good!!!!)
I have some good news and some not to good news .
Today , I removed the injectors and labeled 1 thru 4 , as well as each plastic tubing to each injector , labeled each plastic bag with zipper (1 ... 4) , turned the ignition key on for about 15 sec and checked each plastic bag for volume .
#s 2,3 & 4 cyl. shown about the same volume , which is good . But # 1 had very Little volume , just a trace (you can see gas inside the bag)
Taking into account one of my last e mails , which I said #s 1& 3 NOT working , and #s 2 & 4 working , with today's results , # 3 should have been working , but there was no engine change when wire disconnected ??????. Remember I changed the spark plug # 3 , SO , i DO NOT UNDERSTAND , UNLESS THE INJECTOR IS PLUGGED ????? , please comment or advice .
# 1 cyl. , if I am getting very little gas flow , that means the line from the fuel regulator is partially plugged ??? or what is your interpretation ??? , please advice and let me know what to do in this cyl.
Remarks : I have not worked on your other suggestion , yet , I want to solve the fuel injection problem to all cyls. first and see what happens If you have any questions on my text please let me know .
I just got the new relays this morning , and have not installed them yet , I need to remove a jumper that a mechanic installed , but the gas pumps are working ok the way it is know .

No biggee we all have things to deal with.


Switch no 1 injector with either 2,3 or 4 and test again and state the results of the test , nothing else.

We know 2,3,4 are good and 1 isn't good, so by switching you'll know if its the injector or the fuel distributor.

Example switch No 1 fuel injector with No 2 fuel injector. If after the switch The No 1 injector in the bag has fuel like 3 and 4 Bags and 2 has little--the problem is the fuel injector.

If after the switch with known good Fuel Injector No 1 has little fuel then its the fuel distributor, which I tend to doubt as your last mechanic said injector problem.

If its the fuel injector its decision time--either take to a shop and have them pressure cleaned and tested- all of them or the one not working or buy 4 new ones or 1 new one. your choice.

DIY cleaning is possible, yet shop cleaning - ultrasonic cleaning, leak testing and so forth is done.

Randy

[luis320i]

Randy
I will do it tomorrow , however , I want to inspect injectors #s 1 & 3 , first and pressure test them , and , if one of them is plugged or dirty , how do I suppose to clean it or unplug it ???? any suggestions ???? . Please advice .
# 1 injector is not getting gas from the fuel distributor at present , and , I am going to inspect its plastic line and purge it to try to ensure gas flow to the plastic bag .
Am I going in the right direction ???? any ideas or additional suggestions ????
Please advice

[320iAman]

Remove injector no 1 and replace with injector no 2, use two open wrenches to remove injector from fuel line--remove the complete fuel line from Fuel line from Fuel distributor before removing the fuel injectors,,mark where they came from and reinstall and test -4 bags with injectors and fuel line ends in them. Be careful with the FI lines-dont bend them , handle with care-kid gloves.

Remove banjo bolts for no 1 and 2 fuel lines from top of fuel distributor first,next pop out the fuel injection lines from the plastic routing holders-if any, then pry out the injectors from there seals, switch injectors 1 for 2 then push in injectors back into there seal( not the lines pushed),then push fuel lines back into the plastic routing holder-empty slot- if any and then install the banjo bolts thru the banjo eyes on top of the fuel distributor , and then test all 4 fuel injectors again in 4 bags.

My quess is there will fuel from lines in bags 1 , 3 and 4 and little in bag 2.



Randy

[luis320i]

Hello , here we go again !
I had remove yesterday all 4 injectors , and run the gas test on each plastic bag . #s 2, 3 & 4 with good gas amount . # 1 very little gas into the bag .
TODAY , I checked each injector, #s 2 & 4 OK , 1 & 3 not so good, so I raise the small cone carefully (at the end of the injector) and pour WD40 and used compress air to check them with good cloud flow on each one and when air stopped the small cone closes , then I repeat this test (WD40) on #s 2 & 4 . So, all four injectors are cleaned and in good working condition.
Checked the plastic bags and all of them were empty , re install them by the numbers and try to start the engine (with out the injectors) for about 15 sec. , check the bags and the amount of gas inside the bags was a lot less than yesterday in #s 2 , 3 & 4 but all about the same volume . However # 1 , had very little gas . So , I removed the plastic line between the gas distributor and the # 1 cy. blow compress air and had a good flow (not plugged) , in the gas distributor (# 1 cyl.) there was gas (can see it and smell it) , re install the line , and install all 4 injectors by the numbers .
Started the engine , and it sound about the same than before ( I did not like it) , disconnect the spark plug wire to # 1 and nothing happens , disconnect # 2 and the engine hesitates , disconnect # 3 and nothing happens , disconnect # 4 and the engine hesitates .
The engine sound rough (inside) there are some noises that did not had before ????
With the engine at operating temperature , put it in Drive and the hesitates (it feels with no power) , NO test drive today on the streets .
I dont feel like i made any progress today , please analyze what I have done today , give me your thoughts or comments , I am lost at this point . However , I learned a lot , but not getting close to be able to drive my E 21 , yet .
Remarks : With the engine running , I installed my hex tool and press it down lightly and the engine hesitates / like want it to stop .

[epmedia]

Be safe with that fuel. Fire extinguisher, no sparks, eye protection, etc...

Originally, there are small cone-shape filters under the injector-line banjo bolts on the fuel distributor. And yes, it's very possible the injectors are dirty. Check for the small filters, they are very hidden and the ports must be dry to see them.

Remember that no fuel is suppose to come out the injectors when the meter plate is at 'rest'.

^

[320iAman]

"I had remove yesterday all 4 injectors , and run the gas test on each plastic bag . #s 2, 3 & 4 with good gas amount . # 1 very little gas into the bag ."

There is the answer its your fuel distributor Port 1 is not sending fuel


Randy

[luis320i]

"There is the answer its your fuel distributor Port 1 is not sending fuel"

OK , what can / should I do ???, I have no idea or know how to fix it . Is it a simple job or needs to be done by an expert ???
Please advice

[320iAman]

Okay. There is several items here that have to be running in specifications or there will be fuel supply problems.

1.) Fuel Pumps
2.) Warm up Regulator
3.) Fuel Distributor
4.) Fuel Injectors

What is the Fuel pressure measured at the Fuel distributor made by the fuel pumps ?

Do you have a CIS test kit ?

Somjuan borrowed and returned my CIS test kit just recently and found his WUR cold control pressure was 46 psi , did the adjustment that I recently did on my spare and Eric did in his thread and got cold control down to 20 psi or so-just right, now his car starts easier and the WUR is calibrated correctly. I gave him viton o-rings that fit Fuel Distributor Pressure Regulator so his system pressure and rest control pressure is good and new from that standpoint.

Answer these two questions and one more question do you want to check Port 1 fuel flow on the fuel distributor from port 1 fuel control allen screw standpoint and see if it has been changed or tampered with ? If it has I can assist you in adjusting it to get it just right and get fuel flow back up to where it belongs, I did this many many years ago when I was learning about CIS, more of a extra fine tuning than just adjusting.

Randy

[luis320i]

I am going to explain what I did TODAY and try to answer your questions , the best I can , and will continue from that .
Removed # 1 cyl.'s line/ connector to the gas distributor , dry the port , but could not see the small filter (mentioned yesterday), but I saw the ball bearing and it was clean . Started the engine to check gas supply (with ou the plastic line) , but only got wet with gas , no flow or pressure . Dry it again and push it down lightly (ball bearing) and re started the engine , with no changes . Re connect the plastic line to # 1 cyl. and re started the engine . with same results , no power and rough noise inside the engine .
Know , your questions :
What is the Fuel pressure measured at the Fuel distributor made by the fuel pumps ? , Dont know , I have not measured

Do you have a CIS test kit ? No

1.) Fuel Pumps , The one inside the tank was new when project started , but dont know its exit press. Same as the hi press. gas pump.
2.) Warm up Regulator , I am not familiar with this part , please tell me what is it and where is it to locate it and check.
3.) Fuel Distributor , was overhauled in California when project started but I do not know if is working correctly or no .
4.) Fuel Injectors , I checked them and to me all are working , the fine mist is my only experience with them .

Answer these two questions and one more question been changed or tampdo you want to check Port 1 fuel flow on the fuel distributor from port 1 fuel control allen screw standpoint and see if it has ered with ? If it has I can assist you in adjusting it to get it just right and get fuel flow back up to where it belongs, I did this many many years ago when I was learning about CIS, more of a extra fine tuning than just adjusting.
Yes , I want to try to fix it , with your help , please explain as detail as you can , I am not a good mechanic but I will do it . Thanks

[320iAman]

There should not be a ball bearing in the port dont push on anything in the port can damage the plate, ect.

Are you sure its a ball bearing and just not part of the shiny stainless steel plate under the port your seeing ? Use a strong flashlight to view this area and move it around. Your seeing the Shiny Plate.

Whom overhauled it in California ? If it was FIC they warranty for 18 months and will repair for free

Randy

[epmedia]

Interesting ^

I found a picture that shows the top of a filter, inside an injector-line port. Some filters look different, but this should give some perspective. Note that this is not a BMW fuel distributor, but it does work the same. The filters are pushed down, deep in the ports. You can see the slots in these filters for extracting them with a tool (ie: pocket screw driver, or torx driver).

click to enlarge
img_5290dc1b04d0d.png

[320iAman]

I am going to explain what I did TODAY and try to answer your questions , the best I can , and will continue from that .
Removed # 1 cyl.'s line/ connector to the gas distributor , dry the port , but could not see the small filter (mentioned yesterday), but I saw the ball bearing and it was clean . Started the engine to check gas supply (with ou the plastic line) , but only got wet with gas , no flow or pressure . Dry it again and push it down lightly (ball bearing) and re started the engine , with no changes . Re connect the plastic line to # 1 cyl. and re started the engine . with same results , no power and rough noise inside the engine .
Know , your questions :
What is the Fuel pressure measured at the Fuel distributor made by the fuel pumps ? , Dont know , I have not measured

Do you have a CIS test kit ? No

1.) Fuel Pumps , The one inside the tank was new when project started , but dont know its exit press. Same as the hi press. gas pump.
2.) Warm up Regulator , I am not familiar with this part , please tell me what is it and where is it to locate it and check.
3.) Fuel Distributor , was overhauled in California when project started but I do not know if is working correctly or no .
4.) Fuel Injectors , I checked them and to me all are working , the fine mist is my only experience with them .

Answer these two questions and one more question been changed or tampdo you want to check Port 1 fuel flow on the fuel distributor from port 1 fuel control allen screw standpoint and see if it has ered with ? If it has I can assist you in adjusting it to get it just right and get fuel flow back up to where it belongs, I did this many many years ago when I was learning about CIS, more of a extra fine tuning than just adjusting.
Yes , I want to try to fix it , with your help , please explain as detail as you can , I am not a good mechanic but I will do it . Thanks

I need to know the fuel pump pressure and the pressures of the Warm up Regulator. I understand this is complicated yet its routine fuel system analysis to test all items in the fuel system and then do a repair to whats wrong. Get your friend the mechanic to do the tests, get the results and post back here--otherwise buy the CIS test kit and do it yourself and post back results. There is no shortcuts on working on cars-the learning curve takes its time.

these:
Fuel Pump pressure test ,,Should be 60-70 psi
Warm Up Regulator Cold Control Pressure test,, Cold Motor ~ 20psi (WUR unplugged, also AAV, fuel pumps on and jumpered)
Warm Up Regulator Warm Control Pressure test, Cold Motor ~50 psi( WUR plugged in for 5 minutes or so, fuel pumps on and jumpered)
Warm Up Regulator Rest Pressure Test ~ 24-28 psi after 20 minutes( fuel pumps off--checking pressure valve in Fuel Distributor-o-rings)

This is the Warm Up Regulator: Behind the and underneath The Starter Motor:

DSCI0101.JPG


Randy

[320iAman]

Interesting ^

I found a picture that shows the top of a filter, inside an injector-line port. Some filters look different, but this should give some perspective. Note that this is not a BMW fuel distributor, but it does work the same. The filters are pushed down, deep in the ports. You can see the slots in these filters for extracting them with a tool (ie: pocket screw driver, or torx driver).

click to enlarge
img_5290dc1b04d0d.png

Here is 320i 1980-83 Fuel Distributor I rebuilt with the little Filter Screens 3 in-1 out.

DSCI0097.JPGDSCI0098.JPGDSCI0099.JPGDSCI0100.JPG

redone

Randy

[epmedia]

Here is 320i 1980-83 Fuel Distributor I rebuilt with the little Filter Screens 3 in-1 out.

Randy

Crap, it tells me "invalid attachment specified" when I click them

[320iAman]

Redone pictures, I'll measure this small filter later..Heres a link to to some filter screen small I found browsing, these are for Fuel injectors and may fit

http://injector-rehab.com/shop/Injector-Filters/

Fuel Distributor Filters

9.5 mm Height
3.8 mm ID, measured at the end cap
Filter Area 3.90 mm OD
Sealing End cap- 4.7 mm OD
End cap Ridge at very end 5.4 mm OD, the difference in the cap end, the last part being larger is it forms a lip so that when pushed in the filter stops and is secured in the port to filter gas to fuel injectors.

The sealing end cap area is very significant, Why its close to the fuel port size which when expanded by .1mm or so increases Fuel to the Fuel Injectors,,Dont tell anybody I told you this Blue Print Secret- or specification improvement Okay. Also Porting and Polishing the Fuel distributor is standard Blue Print Practice,again dont tell anyone about this okay Get the picture of this--the fuel is going up a cylinder with a 90 degree cut--the fuel is being forced up, now the bottom edge is ported(rounded a little) now more fuel is admitted as the rounded edge lets more fuel pass thru plus from the polishing less gasoline flow is colliding on the unpolished walls impeding smooth flow... Dont tell anybody about this blue print practice Okay ,,

DSCI0102.JPG


Randy

[epmedia]

Great stuff, Randy. I saved pics for later reference too. Thanks.

[luis320i]

[QUOTE=320iAman;29841389]There should not be a ball bearing in the port dont push on anything in the port can damage the plate, ect.

Are you sure its a ball bearing and just not part of the shiny stainless steel plate under the port your seeing ? Use a strong flashlight to view this area and move it around. Your seeing the Shiny Plate.

Whom overhauled it in California ? If it was FIC they warranty for 18 months and will repair for free

Randy[/QUOTE
I need to double check tomorrow , because started to rain and had to move into warehouse , but , it sure look like the pic in the next mail/comment , the fuel regulator it is installed and it is hard to see it clearly . Ok , I will get it out , inspect it , clean it with thinner re install it and then ????, try again ???

[320iAman]

You need to get these tests done:Otherwise cant tell whats good and whats not. This tool will do all the tests:

Toolaid 33380

C.I.S. K-Jetronic Fuel Injection Tester

these:
Fuel Pump pressure test ,,Should be 60-70 psi
Warm Up Regulator Cold Control Pressure test,, Cold Motor ~ 20psi (WUR unplugged, also AAV, fuel pumps on and jumpered)
Warm Up Regulator Warm Control Pressure test, Cold Motor ~50 psi( WUR plugged in for 5 minutes or so, fuel pumps on and jumpered)
Warm Up Regulator Rest Pressure Test ~ 24-28 psi after 20 minutes( fuel pumps off--checking pressure valve in Fuel Distributor-o-rings)

You Have a problem with the Fuel Distributor and its unknown if there is a problem with the Warm Up Regulator. Its possible you have an internal leak in the Fuel Distributor and no adjustment can fix this, the Fuel Distributor has to be taken part cleaned, Stainless steel plate examined and if good reused, new o-rings installed and put back together again.

Cleaning tells me nothing about the fuel pressures and this is necessary to diagnose whether these items are good or not.

You may want to rebuild the fuel distributor and warm up regulation at the same time and send both to a shop-this is not a loss--this a gain in time and both will be calibrated and simply install and these items are good in all tests, yet the Fuel pump pressure is still unknown and this is necessary to find out.

If you want to test the warm up regulator internal coil--you have to remove the cap on it and with a multimeter set to ohms test the the two pins and get a reading should be like 16 -25 Ohms, if the internal coil is bad-"0 or 1 in Ohms"-it has to be rebuilt at a shop as coils for these are difficult to find and they have them, if its good, then the 3 control pressures have to be known to see how much to adjust the WUR to get clean Start Up and idle.

You read somjuan borrowed my cis tool ( the one mentioned here) and tested his Warm Up Regulator and found cold control pressure was 46 psi, did the work himself, made the adjustment to 20 psi or so and car starts faster and shall run better. I charged him a cup of starbucks coffee-latte-tool rental fee , lol.

So test the wur with ohm meter and get the ohm reading and post the results, tomorrow, cleaning the wur will not change the ohms in the internal heating coil,,cleaning the pins is a good idea then test the pins on the Warm Up Regulator in ohms and post the result.

Randy

[320iAman]

Great stuff, Randy. I saved pics for later reference too. Thanks.

Sure save the pictures, I have many saved

Randy

[cgifool]

Redone pictures, I'll measure this small filter later..Heres a link to to some filter screen small I found browsing, these are for Fuel injectors and may fit

http://injector-rehab.com/shop/Injector-Filters/

Fuel Distributor Filters

9.5 mm Height
3.8 mm ID, measured at the end cap
Filter Area 3.90 mm OD
Sealing End cap- 4.7 mm OD
End cap Ridge at very end 5.4 mm OD, the difference in the cap end, the last part being larger is it forms a lip so that when pushed in the filter stops and is secured in the port to filter gas to fuel injectors.
...
Randy

Hey thanks Randy for the measurements and web site reference! I didn't know you could buy these - would love if someone could confirm which (if any) of these filters actually fits.

I can't quite tell if you're kidding about porting and polishing the fuel distributor. I sure wouldn't try that myself!

-David

[320iAman]

You'll have to search and find these micro filter baskets according to the dimensions yourself, as to enlarging fuel ports this is nothing new with adjustable flow all can be calibrated to the same flow, sealing is not a problem as stronger plate springs can be installed.

No I would not try it unless you have experience blueprinting a motors Lubrication, Cooling, Suspension, fuel , air, spark, and compression and can work out all the variables to get a faster controlled ride, otherwise your enhancing one area and leaving the others behind, this is not acceptable to me, this is not to say improvements within specifications of the others is not acceptable-that is the heart of blueprinting.

Example 1: Increasing displacement and nailing down air fuel, spark, and compression thru all rpms sought and yet being outside of lubrication specifications is not good.
Example 2 : Moving the 1.8L to 2.0 with 2.0 Crank and pistons--this is an upgrade that BMW mentioned some years ago and did the prep work on so its all good.


Randy

[luis320i]

Randy
Toolaid 33380

C.I.S. K-Jetronic Fuel Injection Tester
Yesterday , I checked with my mechanic , Auto Zone, Advance and O'raley and other local service shops and they do not have this test kit or know how to use it , so , I do not think I can get the pressure readings that you are requesting in order to continue our trouble shooting work . Also , I do not have the skills to do this job by my self correctly and I do not what else to do at this point .
I am thinking more in Plan "B" which is , get an air intake manifold and adapt a suitable carburetor , and make it much simpler so I can use my E21 , also , my car is located at present in Mexico and I need to travel back and forth every day which is a little problematic for me .
So , my question to You , Can you help / Gide me with this new task ???? , I hope you do , I can tell you, you have been a great help and I have learned tons from you and I really appreciate it.
I am good at dismantling the K jectronics fuel injection system and save all those parts , but with your help it will be a lot better job and do it right .
Please advice and let me know your thoughts.

[Thecatmilton]

Randy
Toolaid 33380

C.I.S. K-Jetronic Fuel Injection Tester
Yesterday , I checked with my mechanic , Auto Zone, Advance and O'raley and other local service shops and they do not have this test kit or know how to use it , so , I do not think I can get the pressure readings that you are requesting in order to continue our trouble shooting work . Also , I do not have the skills to do this job by my self correctly and I do not what else to do at this point .
I am thinking more in Plan "B" which is , get an air intake manifold and adapt a suitable carburetor , and make it much simpler so I can use my E21 , also , my car is located at present in Mexico and I need to travel back and forth every day which is a little problematic for me .
So , my question to You , Can you help / Gide me with this new task ???? , I hope you do , I can tell you, you have been a great help and I have learned tons from you and I really appreciate it.
I am good at dismantling the K jectronics fuel injection system and save all those parts , but with your help it will be a lot better job and do it right .
Please advice and let me know your thoughts.

I think harbor freight tools has fuel pressure test kits.

[luis320i]

Thanks for the tip , I hope I can find Toolaid 33380, C.I.S. K-Jetronic Fuel Injection Tester at harbor freight tools