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Thread: 1978 323i driver/project

  1. #176
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    Jun 2016
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    1978 323i
    Did I say tonight a couple nights ago? Ha ha, never believe me when I say that about things that haven't happened yet

    Tonight I went ahead and used Randy's method of tightening the pinion nut with the electric impact wrench. Didn't even need any kind of holding device, I just held the flange with my hand. It was a little fiddly rigging up something to prop the pinion shaft on while I tapped the flange down into the splines far enough for the nut to engage the threads, but I managed ok.

    I'll say 22 inch pounds feels really tight, but I checked and rechecked it so I'm gonna go with it! I guess I was expecting it to feel like wheel bearings, eg, pretty much 0. I'm assuming after a few miles it'll loosen up a bit?

    I also re-inserted the pumpkin and attached the two side bearing covers, with 2 bolts each just barely seated and no o-ring or grease seal, so I can check the gear mesh next time.. I have this fear that somehow along the way I got either the bearing covers or the shims swapped side to side - I was pretty careful when I took it apart but it's been a while now, and it's exactly the kind of mistake I would make!

  2. #177
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    1980 BMW 320i E21 M10B18

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    At zero play --"now you tightened the pinion nut some more until you get to 22 in lbs reading on the in lb torque wrench, when your at 22 in lbs take the pinion shaft nut off and install the pinion shaft seal, now torque up to 108 ft lbs + the pinion nut and your good to reassemble. I set my digital torque wrench to 108 ft lbs and went over slightly."

    Tighten to Zero Play
    Tightened to 22 in lbs
    Remove Nut- and put in new pinion shaft seal coated on outside with High Tack-High Temperature or similar.
    Tighten nut to 108 Ft lbs or there abouts
    Now assemble the internals with seals and so forth.

    Measure the Ring Gear Carrier Shims----they should be identical unless they were changed out to biggee/small due to Pinion/Ring gear mesh wear and / or uneven bearing wear, which I doubt was done.

    Randy
    Last edited by 320iAman; 04-13-2019 at 11:01 AM.

  3. #178
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    1978 323i
    Ahh, I see. thanks for the clarification!

    Good to know about the carrier shims. So most likely even if something got swapped it'll all still be good. Fingers crossed!

  4. #179
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    Whats new ?

    Randy

  5. #180
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    1978 323i
    A trip out of town and a little drama at home kept me from working on this for a couple weeks..

    Today though I finally had a few minutes to check the gear mesh, and it looks good to me, so I'm feeling a bit relieved.

    IMG_9513.jpgIMG_9514.jpg

  6. #181
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    Almost done with the diff!

    Installed the side cover seals, o-rings, shims, and secured with new bolts and wave washers.

    Installed the drive flanges and secured them with their C-clips.

    Installed the rear cover with new gasket, and secured with new bolts and wave washers.

    Remaining work on the diff: loosen pinion nut and retorque to 108 ft/lb, install lock ring, install fill & drain plugs with new crush rings, fill with oil, and do some touch-up painting. So maybe another week at the rate I'm going
    Last edited by cgifool; 04-30-2019 at 11:05 AM.

  7. #182
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    Nothing like a fresh rebuild, except a fresh remanufactured part..

    Randy

  8. #183
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    Today I took the day off work so I could get a much-needed boost in getting my car back together (and get some housework done). Luckily, my wife is extra supportive because we're trying to get the driveway re-paved soon and the car needs to be functional in order to do so!

    I got the diff finished (touched up paint, torqued pinion nut to 108, inserted locking plate, installed fill & drain plugs with new crush rings, filled with oil.

    Reinstalled the subframe on the car, reinstalled the diff (mounting bolts loose until new driveshaft nuts were tightened), reinstalled the left trailing arm and left shock absorber. reinserted both emergency brake cables, still dangling at the ends.

    Out of all that, I think tightening the shock top nuts is my least favorite part (cant get a socket wrench on it, very uncomfortable position to reach up in there with a wrench, cant turn the wrench much). Tightening the driveshaft nuts is only moderately less obnoxious.

    Sadly now I have to go work on a different obnoxious task (and far less rewarding) , re-sealing the belly wrap under my house where I had to cut it open and remove the insulation in a 10x10 area to remove a rats nest complete with 6 babies
    (YUCK)

  9. #184
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    Whats the turning torque of the assembled differential with very wet gears or better filled with 1 qt of differential fluid ?


    Randy

  10. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by 320iAman View Post
    Whats the turning torque of the assembled differential with very wet gears or better filled with 1 qt of differential fluid ?


    Randy
    Guess the answer will have to wait for the next person to do this job, because I didn't bother to measure

    I would guess it at half or 2/3 of what it felt like previously.

  11. #186
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    I measured the turning torque on the rebuild I did, it is 12 in / lbs.

    Randy

  12. #187
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    Over the weekend, I reinstalled the rear brakes, brake lines, and hooked up the parking brake cables.

    Parts pile is growing ever smaller.. remaining work is reinstalling the mufflers and axles, and bleeding the brakes!

  13. #188
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    Tonight I reinstalled the axles with all new bolts, and re-hung the mufflers (loosely). I attempted to adjust the handbrake, but decided pretty quickly I really should look up the procedure first, and put it off

    Reminder to myself- I still need to torque the wheel bearing castle nuts. They're tight, but not TIGHT. I figured I'd wait until the wheels are on the car and car on the ground to do that.

    Rain forecast the rest of the week, gotta take every opportunity I get.

  14. #189
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    Rear Castle nuts are around 210 Ft Lbs..


    Randy

  15. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by 320iAman View Post
    Rear Castle nuts are around 210 Ft Lbs..


    Randy
    I don't know about for 320i, but for 320/6 and 323i my blue book specifies 295-347 ft lb.

    I don't think I have any long pipes I can use as a cheater bar, and I'm a little afraid to just go to town with the electric impact. Probably will end up with something like "half of me on a 4 foot pipe"

    castle_torque.jpg
    Last edited by cgifool; 05-14-2019 at 03:14 PM.

  16. #191
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    Torque is basically anti loosening in automotive applications, the castle nut is staked as well so very little loss of torque there if any, 200, 300, 400 Ft lbs is not going to make any difference. I did mine

    to 210 ft lbs,,

    TomD answered this when I asked the question of how much torque to apply to the rear axle castle nut.

    I used the law of lever by Archimedes, proven by Geometric Reasoning to find the exact point to step on the 3/4 in torque bar or breaker bar with 3/4"- 36 mm 6 point socket.

    F1D1 = F2D2

    210ft lbs = Your weight standing at Distance -D2 down the torque bar.

    Ex

    210 ft lbs = 150 lbs x D2 Ft

    210 ft lbs/150 lbs =1.4 ft

    D2 = 1.4 ft x 12 inches/foot = 16.8 inches

    So by standing on the bar 16.8 inches will torque the Castle Nut to 210 Ft lbs, mark the bar with tape at this point and then stand on the tape with 1 foot balanced and your good to go. There is a little

    ingenuity and balance in setting this up yet not that much, if the stake holes dont line up, add a little more D2 till they do.

    Set the torque as you want. I weigh more than 150 lbs,,,

    Randy
    Last edited by 320iAman; 05-14-2019 at 09:11 PM.

  17. #192
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    Thanks for the clarification Randy! I had a similar thought in wondering how much difference it would really make.

    Tonight I secured the rear mufflers and bled the brakes with the power bleeder. Sadly, when I removed it I saw I had either drained a bit much or the bleeder was tilted and not refilling properly, so the brake reservoir level ended up below the point where the clutch line comes off - so the brake pedal feels nice and hard, but the clutch pedal is still floppy. Ah well. It was getting late, so I put that off until tomorrow.

    In the meantime I hooked the battery back up and fired the car up, it was a bit reluctant and didn't want to stay running at first, then ran rough for the first few minutes, but smoothed out mostly by the time it got fully warmed up. I'd be a little rough too after waking up from a 4 month nap

  18. #193
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    Sure, Torque wrenches that go beyond 150 ft lbs can get pricey,can use 1/2" drive breaker bar and socket as well, I got 3/4" as it was stronger. I seen on it mine from 210 ft lbs to 500 ft lbs, I like 210 ft lbs so that if I have service later its not like welded on.


    Randy
    Last edited by 320iAman; 05-15-2019 at 11:27 AM.

  19. #194
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    On the road again!

    clutch bled, castle nuts torqued (0.8 of a David on a 25 inch breaker bar), cotter pins installed, test drive taken (just around the neighborhood a few times, several hard stops to de-rust the rotors). Drives pretty smooth but the brakes do shake the steering wheel a bit and pull slightly to the left (nothing new)

    only things left (unless I messed something up is checking tire pressure and adjusting the parking brake..

    1624D65E-16DB-49CD-AFA0-7BA87BA165FE.jpg

  20. #195
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    Had the front rotors machined (still plenty of meat on them) and installed new brake pads, seems to have cured the shaking steering wheel.

    Car still pulls left with braking, but without the steering wheel wanting to turn.. I previously solved an issue like this when I found one of the front sway bar nuts loose, allowing the strut to move a little under braking.

    Also, there's a periodic light "thumping" noise on braking at low speeds. I'm thinking this is due to the rust on the rear rotors, because the noise only seems to happen under braking, and I never noticed it prior to taking the car out of service a few months ago. There was a brake-pad-shaped area that was rustier than the rest, probably the source of the noise. I'm assuming the left pull on braking is due to uneven rear brake effectiveness unless one of the front sway bar nuts has gotten loose again.. All the rubber brake lines are less than 2 years old.

    Sadly, I bought a new set of rear pads nearly two years ago and somehow lost them Also when I was playing with adjusting the parking brake, it seemed the inside surface of the rotor is not quite round, the pads were rubbing on only a few places as I was rotating it.

    I think I'll try and have them resurfaced and have the inner parking brake friction area turned as well to get them as round as possible, as well as replacing the pads. My parking brake has never worked all that well since I've owned the car..

    Funny, I had the engine running and idling really well cold AND hot over the winter, but now it again runs a bit rough and doesn't like to idle "cold" (75 degrees); still good hot though.
    Last edited by cgifool; 05-21-2019 at 11:24 PM.

  21. #196
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    1983 320I, 1986 325E
    I think you can use e30 rear rotors. I have them on my 323i trailing arms. I also have modified e30 rear calipers. The e30 parking brake pads seem the same too. I remember cross referencing a bunch of stuff to order it from the U.S. when I had catastrophic rear wheel bearing failure. Only two of the wheel bearings were difficult to buy but I got in on a group buy which lowered costs.

  22. #197
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    Thanks! Yes I replaced these rotors a while back, but not the pads (probably my first mistake). I was reluctant to gamble on another new pair of rotors having an out-of-round parking brake surface which is why I thought I'd have them machined instead - to ensure they are truly round and concentric to the hub. I also got in on the group buy for wheel bearings a while back and replaced them just a few weeks ago. If the parking brake shoes are that easy to get I'll pick up some of those too. Thanks for the reminder!

  23. #198
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    Nice.. Centric Parts 111.09010 Brake Shoe, $15.98 shipped on Amazon Prime.

    New rotors are about the same cost as having the old ones machined, but I think I'll still keep the old ones because they only have a thousand or so miles and would rather know for sure they are round and concentric inside.

  24. #199
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    Suspecting the "thump thump" noise has more to do with my driveshaft or differential alignment than the brakes.. I only hear it at low speeds, and although it comes and goes, it's not quite in time with applying and releasing the brakes. Going to go check the manual regarding how to adjust the differential position and check that everything's tight and square.. What I did was simply tighten the driveshaft bolts and "eyeball" the straightness of the diff position before tightening the diff/subframe bolts (and tightened the dogbone last)

  25. #200
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    1980 BMW 320i E21 M10B18

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    Preload on the center bearing may have changed, preload it again 2 mm or 0.08 in forward.
    Alignment of the two sections of the drive shaft should be checked by straight edge and or straight edge on blocks both vertically and horizontally, pitch and yaw- zero difference in level bubble graduated lines for Pilots in the crowd or zero difference in inclinometer..

    Correcting of vertical misalignment by washers under the center bearing mount plate, lateral or horizontal misalignment by moving the mounting plate of the center to one side or the other.

    Could be just the preload. It gets involved measuring all the relevant angles of inclination, engine,front section of drive shaft,,rear section of drive shaft and 3rd member ,final drive or differential . I have a magnetic inclinometer that costs very few bucks to check angles and get mind over the matter, so as too speak and then take it from there...

    Randy
    Last edited by 320iAman; 05-23-2019 at 12:31 PM.

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