Chinese Brake Rotors; by all the names you trusted

[bmwdirtracer]

Hi Friends,

The following rotors are Chinese, and they are crap, inferior iron, which turns to Cementite, far too easily:

Brembo, Textar, Bosch, StopTech, Meyle, Akebono.

The following rotors are German made, and do not suffer the same issue:

Zimmerman.

If you're not familiar with the term "Cementite", and you think that brake rotors actually warp, please see this:

http://www.stoptech.com/technical-su...nd-other-myths

[dworthy]

Don't forget about ATE, who is normally the OE supplier to BMW.

[bmwdirtracer]

THANK YOU, DARIN!

I am very familiar with Ate brake parts, of course, but I haven't seen their rotors here. It's so good to know there's another supplier of German rotors. Anyone know a place that sells Ate rotors in the US ?

[jclausen]

But if you want to save your self all the guess work of why are my rotors warpped there so new or they squeak lot or the brake pedal does not feel the same any more. Use only factory BMW parts in BMW boxes, they are the best, most expensive, create dust, but you will always have the best pedal feel. Also ate does not make BMW rotors and pads, you may ask how do I know this because the ate rep came by the shop and told us.

[TonyAngel]

Yeah, I recently did all 4 ends on my E90 and went with Brembo. After seeing one of racer's comments, I looked into it and sure enough, Brembo has a big blog on their website about their venture with China. I didn't even bother to check.

[bmwdirtracer]

Jclausen, so who DOES make those rotors for BMW? To the best of my knowledge, that's Textar and Brembo and Zimmerman. And, to the best of my knowledge, the following companies make the pads: Textar, Pagid, Jurid, Brembo. And Ate makes a majority of the other brake hardware, like calipers, master cylinders, etc.

BMW has a factory in China now. So do the vast majority of their suppliers. I'll gladly take the Ate and Zimmerman German-made rotors over boxes which don't even identify the country of origin. We're talking about metallurgy, not dust. And, no, there's no talk of guesswork of rotors warping, because rotors don't warp.

BMW does not make brake rotors or brake pads. They buy them, from one of the above companies.

[Mless5]

I just bought Meyle coated ones and packaging said Made in Germany and so did the booklet inside.

[jclausen]

I have been with BMWs for a very long time back when we started we used ate textare all sorts of combinations but had squeaking, warpped rotors or hot spots Then we went to 100 % factory brake parts no more complaints, ever. Who makes BMW rotors nobody has ever answered that question, nobody knows. All I know is this if you need to change brakes and you don't want all those problems that ther aftermarket parts bring you use oem factory parts. Textar does make pads for BMW but the factory parts will have the BMW logo stamped in metal plate that the pad material is glued to, the aftermarket textar will not. Use what you want but if they feel different or start shaking the steering wheel while braking and blow out your thrust rod bushing you will know why

[bmwdirtracer]

I just bought Meyle coated ones and packaging said Made in Germany and so did the booklet inside.

Are you really sure about that? Because the Meyle coated rotors I've received, time after time, said "Meyle Germany", and then, in small print on the label, said Made in China", much like the Brembo label shown above.

In fact, here's the description, from FCP Euro. Note the words at the bottom: "Made in China":

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...39-m5-40406176

and, here they are for your 330; also made in China:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...xi-z4-40406001

For your M3, also Made in China:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...meyle-40406014

[bmwdirtracer]

My erudite friend jclausen, I also worked at the dealership for years, and we had many comebacks for pulsations/squeaking, front end shaking from hot-spotted rotors. Certainly, many of the shaking/pulsation issues are caused by improper customer use, and inadequate bedding-in, so that pad deposits cause a raised spot on the rotor, and therefore the rotor turns to Cementite at that point. The effect, of course, might as well be called "warped", since that area of the rotor does indeed have excessive runout, and the metallurgy change ensures the problem will recur, even if the rotor is cut on a lathe.

I'm certainly not saying that BMW rotors or pads in BMW boxes are bad, but I'm personally going to avoid buying brakes that don't show their country of origin, or say "Made in China". I'd have trusted BMW on this, until they, and so many of their suppliers, opened factories in China.

Here are some factory SIBs and the "Brake problem chart", from BMW:

[jclausen]

I understand what your saying, but even when I worked at the dealer i hardly ever had to deal with pulsation and or shaking under braking because of new brake rotors. You are right BMW has the assembly and block casting factory's in China. All I'm saying is when folks put after market brake parts on, they are more likely to have issues either straight away or down the road bacuse of the parts they used. Then they start chasing there tails replacing alsorts of parts when the brakes were the issue all along. They just can't believe it could be the after market brake parts. And this has nappened to me on other makes of cars using after market brakes. If you want the best possible out come when replacing brake parts I can only recommend factory parts

[dworthy]

And that is the reason why I have different level of recommendation for any parts. I tell people about how long that part will last based on experience and knowledge. When it comes to brakes, I only use OE-BMW or the actual OEM on my cars. Now have I experiment with aftermarket stuff just to see, sure as 20-40 bucks isn't much money, but it give me an idea of what to look for when it comes to fitment, and quality. Here in Germany, more specifically in Bavaria, there is a company called ATP. They have of course their own line, which says "Made in Germany" on the box, but in very small letters "Made in Russia". Needless to say those parts are garbage, as they will last anywhere from 6 weeks to 6 months. I adamantly discourage anybody from using that brand, but people still buy it and then complain afterwards about it to me. Of course I have a chance to say I told you so, but I don't, and I just nod and agree.

So the old adage comes into play: You get what you paid for.

[ptarditi]

Slightly off topic.
I recently left the dealership work environment and in the last few months BMW has made it extremely difficult to replace rotors under warranty. They are now on a cut the rotors with a on car lathe kick, we had a Pro-cut lathe. To condemn a rotor you must measure the rotor's thickness with a micrometer, not runout with a dial indicator, in 8 places at a set distance from the edge of the rotor. Just what I'd want as a remedy, cut rotors. They obviously can't be cut under minimum thickness, but if the thicker ones warped, will the thinner ones fare any better?

Not trying to start any trouble, but on my own cars and some side jobs I've done I've used (after full disclosure to my clients) aftermarket rotors with OEM or very high quality pads with no complaints, albeit these cars aren't tracked and the only one I know that's driven hard would be my own.

[shadowpuck]

wow! i had no idea on the cut rotors deal....

[bmwdirtracer]

Yep, BMW now cuts rotors, as you'll see in those documents. (Blame it on the free maintenance thing)

Not me.

As you see in the StopTech document, and as dozens and dozens of experiences have shown me, you can't fix it, when the rotors overheat and turn to Cementite in certain spots. I have two sets of M5 front rotors, that anyone who wants them can have, for free. Officially zero wear. , with a scuff, they measure true, and don't vibrate for a couple hundred stops. And then the shaking starts, again.

On the good side, I've recently installed new Zimmermans on the front. It's nice to have no shaking again. I have stock (Textar) Pads, for street use, Hawks (with different rotors) for track. The track rotors are trashed, too, going to have to buy another set of Zimmermans before August.(The track rotors are also Meyle Platinums, zero wear.)

Eh, brakes and tires. I'm rougher on them, than most people. On the good side, my clutches last forever......

[328 Power 04]

I wonder what happened to these..

Some no name, or whatever "WBR" is, on my Jetta with double the power than stock, and after towing a 3 person jet ski.

They don't vibrate though. Just crappy. Waiting to find an upgrade to the size too.

Any more heat and pressure and I can sell off some diamonds .


IMG_20170525_123135re.jpg

[Jason5driver]

What about Pagid and Balo?
I bought Balo rotors from Auto Parts Warehouse about 2 years ago because no one sold them anymore.
Balo = Made in Germany. Pretty sure they are the same as the original BMW rotors on my E39.
I haven't tried ATE rotors or pads. Not sure if the ATE pads are as good as the Jurid or Textar pads.

[Mless5]

I am 100% sure boxes said Made in Germany, which caught me by surprise.

Are you really sure about that? Because the Meyle coated rotors I've received, time after time, said "Meyle Germany", and then, in small print on the label, said Made in China", much like the Brembo label shown above.

In fact, here's the description, from FCP Euro. Note the words at the bottom: "Made in China":

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...39-m5-40406176

and, here they are for your 330; also made in China:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...xi-z4-40406001

For your M3, also Made in China:

https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...meyle-40406014

[dworthy]

I don't use the ATE pads, just the rotors. I like to use either Jurid or if it's cheaper BMW pads which are pretty much the same.

[bmwdirtracer]

What about Pagid and Balo?
I bought Balo rotors from Auto Parts Warehouse about 2 years ago because no one sold them anymore.
Balo = Made in Germany. Pretty sure they are the same as the original BMW rotors on my E39.
I haven't tried ATE rotors or pads. Not sure if the ATE pads are as good as the Jurid or Textar pads.

I haven't seen Pagid rotors, though I've installed Pagid pads on dozens of cars. I used to see Balo rotors all the time, but don't recall having seen any for the last couple of years. I do recall them as having been made in Europe.

I googled "Balo rotors", and got a couple of hits at generic car parts places. I checked out one of those, and this was what I found:


Why bother with cheap offshore brakes that might not give you the same performance as originalespecially when OE Balo brakes are available

Balo brake rotors are produced from the same heat-treated steels as your original rotors

As one of the premier suppliers to BMW and Mercedes, Balo brakes have been tested in the harshest conditions
Balo brakes are the best brakes that most folks have never heard of.



I'll be glad to buy Balo or any German / European made OEM rotor, but I certainly won't be ordering rotors from any company that doesn't know rotors are NOT made of "heat treated steel".

Interesting, though....this generic place shows nothing but "Powerstop" or Centric rotors for my car (both Chinese). However, they DO show Ate, and Zimmerman, and lots of good brands for YOUR car, Jason!

http://www.carparts.com/results/?Ntt...=&No=10&Npp=10

....as Mless says, he got Meyle rotors made in Germany....while all Meyles that I received came from China, and that's all I can find, for Meyle, now.

Perhaps we can use this thread to document the places and brands to buy? I'm sure that SOME Brembos are still made in Italy, although all that I can find these days are made in China.

It would be very good to have some sort of database, so that those who want European made rotors, not Chinese, have a way to differentiate them.

I will mention that FCP Euro seems to be the only supplier which lists country of origin. I have suggested to them that they start carrying the entire Zimmerman product line, because I am sure that all Zimmermans are made in Germany....for right now, anyway!

Mless, where did you purchase your German Meyles, and for what car? Maybe we can figure out if they were "old stock", or whether Meyle makes rotors for certain models in Europe?

[marcva]

Pelican has a wide variety, and they have great pricing. They had a free shipping offer once when I was tracking my car a lot. A neighbor and I ordered 4 sets of E36M rotors. UPS was a bit annoyed that day.

[dworthy]

I would like to add ECS Turing's line of Slotted brakes to this list as well.

So I had those rotors on the car for about 3k now, and they too have started to pulse. I installed them last year about 3 weeks before I stored the car, and the only real heavy braking I did then was to bed in the pads. It only took about 10 good heavy braking from 160mph to 60mph to go all pulsating.

So it looks like I will be looking once again for some quality slotted rotors, Zimmerman are at the top of that list right now.

[shadowpuck]

admittedly, i've had success with whatever bimmerworld has laying around for their "no-name" rotors....
that said, tracking where your parts come from and knowing how to order the quality items is quickly becoming a full time job! that is, unless your budget is infinite!

granted, my success mentioned above has been in an e36 - and, let's be honest, if i'm going through rotors and pads in that car odds are i'm "doing it wrong."

[justinco]

Good info, wish it was around before I bought my StopTech's :O

[Cyrix2k]

Bump. I just received an order of ATE rotors for an F25. They're marked as "Made in PRC" (People's Republic of China). The Zimmermann rotors I got in for an E60 are still made in Germany.