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Thread: Can an S50B32 be built from an S50US or S52?

  1. #1
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    Can an S50B32 be built from an S50US or S52?

    I would LOVE an S50B32 power plant in my 99 M3 but I would really hate to drop 7K+ on an engine plus import fees, could I build one from an S50US or an S52? The 240hp engine is really quite disappointing that we Americans got. I've done searches on the topic here and all I seem to be able to find is differences between the two, and swap info. Seems like the bottom end is the same, only a slightly longer stroke by like a millimeter and a half. As far as top half goes, my only concern would be the double VANOS which I know is not interchangeable. But even at that point wouldn't it be cheaper to buy an S50B32 head that can house the VANOS unit and slap it onto the existing block? Thoughts?

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    You cannot easily put Euro internals in the US block or the Euro head on the US block. You can mod a US motor to make stock Euro power but it is expensive and not emissions legal. The most important questions are what is your budget and how much power do you want. The options are modded US motor, Euro motor swap, S54 swap, domestic V8 swap, and turbocharging or supercharging your motor. Costs range from $3k to $10k and that is with you doing all the work and buying used parts and finding good deals.

    I have had a supercharger and a turbo on my 99M3. Today I would consider selling the E36 and buying a car that is faster to begin with or easier to mod. E46M3, 135i, 335i?

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    Euro s50b32 parts are almost now exclusive to only being available in Europe as no vendors in the US carry anything for it.

    nothing swaps over from engine to engine, that's like trying to put Ford engine parts into a chevy. The s54 is basically a newer version and is better, also it's available in the US so parts are easy to come by, plus the aftermarket for parts, performance, and tuning is huge.
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    They are very different engines. The S52 is a mildly re-worked version of the M52 - cams, crank, bore. The euro S50B32 was a completely reworked version of the M50 - ITB's, different VANOS, pistons, rods, larger intake valves... the euro S50 basically took the M50 block then put a different head on it and bored out the block. The M52 was a different evolution of the M52, then the S50 became the S54.

    You can't turn an M50 or M52 into a euro S50 just as you can't turn an M52 or M54 into an S54. They are too different

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  5. #5
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    The parts shared by the US S52 and the S50B32 are few. Oil filter, a few external bits, i.e., motor mounts, alternator (maybe), bolts, etc.

    So conversion is not a viable option.

    Thread being moved to the 1994 - 1999 Euro M3 sub-forum.
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    My budget is whatever the cost is of a euro engine. I just want the power plant the car was meant to have. The S54 swap is super common for bmw-bmw engine swaps I do have some problems with the S54 though. The biggest is that its super unreliable. At least the ones I've owned were anyway. The car is getting fresh interior and with the cost of that I know I'm going to lose money on the car at some point and I have no intentions of selling it--well, ever. If I can help it. We all know that old guy strereotype that has his 2002 with factory price sticker and everything in mint condition that will probably be buried in his car? Yeah... that'll be me. But with my M3 lol. I had already done some research and am (or at some point will be) fully prepared to get a euro engine. I just have some concerns about emissions.

  7. #7
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    PianoGuy, I have a sweet S50B32 in my 99 M3. It's as you suggest, it is the engine that was meant to be in the car. I do disagree about the S54 and reliability, but this is only based on my personal and a number of friends experiences. If I had to do it again. I'm not sure which direction I'd go, euro or S54.

    re: emissions. Realize that the S50B32 will never be OBD-II. If the testing is a sniff only, a stock motor likely will pass go. But there's no OBD plug or post-converter O2 sensors. There's a stickie in this forum on this very topic if you want more data.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BmwPianoGuy View Post
    My budget is whatever the cost is of a euro engine. I just want the power plant the car was meant to have. The S54 swap is super common for bmw-bmw engine swaps I do have some problems with the S54 though. The biggest is that its super unreliable. At least the ones I've owned were anyway. The car is getting fresh interior and with the cost of that I know I'm going to lose money on the car at some point and I have no intentions of selling it--well, ever. If I can help it. We all know that old guy strereotype that has his 2002 with factory price sticker and everything in mint condition that will probably be buried in his car? Yeah... that'll be me. But with my M3 lol. I had already done some research and am (or at some point will be) fully prepared to get a euro engine. I just have some concerns about emissions.
    Euro is even less reliable than the S54 (which really isn't all *that* unreliable). You just don't hear about it as much because there aren't as many in the US. S54 is basically a euro motor with an improved head.

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    Head porting generally doesn't hurt emissions, and the best option is to have your existing head ported by ExtrudeHone. It forces an abrasive putty through the ports, it knots up wherever there's a restriction, forcing the abrasive to wear away the restriction. The advantage is that the results are consistent, flow and therefore power are improved, and there's no risk of screwing up an otherwise useable head. But to make the most of it you also need better-flowing valves, typically larger-diameter, preferably stainless, swirl-polished, undercut, with a 30* back-cut. Combine those with having the valve seats cut to match, with a 5-angle valve job on the intakes, and a radius cut on the exhausts. Those 5 angles go in steps of 15/30/45/60/75*, 45 is the seat itself, the contact point for the valve heads.
    You may be limited on valve lift, valvesprings should be replaced as they do lose tension over time, get some with more tension than original. Camshaft(s): As long as there's no overlap at 0.075" actual valve lift, it'll pass emissions. Overlap is when both intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time. Opening the exhaust earlier and closing the intakes later will add power, in the mid and upper RPM range.
    Intake manifold runner length determines your useable RPM range more than anything else, so if you want it to pull to higher RPM, then you'll need to do something to shorten the runner lengths. You should do that before getting the manifold ExtrudeHoned to match the head(s).
    Same deal with exhaust manifolding / headers.
    Do all of that, you'll make more power, and at higher RPM, while still passing emissions. And it may give the car the soul you like. But you'd probably be happier, for less money, just adding a Chinese turbo off E-Bay for 364 days per year.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Oh, is your transmission strong enough for extra power? If you do all of that, you'll need to change the rear axle ratio. Not so if you go turbo. And either way, the rest of the exhaust system will need to flow better. How's the cooling system? If you go the non-turbo route, you'll be finding the limits of the cooling system. If turbo, there's no real risk since you can't keep your foot in it long enough to build heat, you'll have to use the brakes first.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by TerraPhantm View Post
    Euro is even less reliable than the S54 (which really isn't all *that* unreliable). You just don't hear about it as much because there aren't as many in the US. S54 is basically a euro motor with an improved head.
    Both, apart from some known issues, all of which by now are easy to correct/prevent, are very reliable engines.

    and yes, the S54 is the natural successor to the S50.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by BmwPianoGuy View Post
    ... But even at that point wouldn't it be cheaper to buy an S50B32 head that can house the VANOS unit and slap it onto the existing block? Thoughts?
    The head is not the same. Different deck height. And about none of the boltholes that connect block to head line up.

    By the time you are modifying your US engine into the EU one, you will have spent 3x the money of a straight swap, with less result.

    If you're in the US, going S54 seems the only logical solution. Or FI.
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by 734i View Post
    Head porting generally doesn't hurt emissions, and the best option is to have your existing head ported by ExtrudeHone. It forces an abrasive putty through the ports, it knots up wherever there's a restriction, forcing the abrasive to wear away the restriction. The advantage is that the results are consistent, flow and therefore power are improved, and there's no risk of screwing up an otherwise useable head. But to make the most of it you also need better-flowing valves, typically larger-diameter, preferably stainless, swirl-polished, undercut, with a 30* back-cut. Combine those with having the valve seats cut to match, with a 5-angle valve job on the intakes, and a radius cut on the exhausts. Those 5 angles go in steps of 15/30/45/60/75*, 45 is the seat itself, the contact point for the valve heads.
    You may be limited on valve lift, valvesprings should be replaced as they do lose tension over time, get some with more tension than original. Camshaft(s): As long as there's no overlap at 0.075" actual valve lift, it'll pass emissions. Overlap is when both intake and exhaust valves are open at the same time. Opening the exhaust earlier and closing the intakes later will add power, in the mid and upper RPM range.
    Intake manifold runner length determines your useable RPM range more than anything else, so if you want it to pull to higher RPM, then you'll need to do something to shorten the runner lengths. You should do that before getting the manifold ExtrudeHoned to match the head(s).
    Same deal with exhaust manifolding / headers.
    Do all of that, you'll make more power, and at higher RPM, while still passing emissions. And it may give the car the soul you like. But you'd probably be happier, for less money, just adding a Chinese turbo off E-Bay for 364 days per year.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Oh, is your transmission strong enough for extra power? If you do all of that, you'll need to change the rear axle ratio. Not so if you go turbo. And either way, the rest of the exhaust system will need to flow better. How's the cooling system? If you go the non-turbo route, you'll be finding the limits of the cooling system. If turbo, there's no real risk since you can't keep your foot in it long enough to build heat, you'll have to use the brakes first.
    no body really extrude hones cylinder heads because there are much better ways to do it. despite what the marketing says it doesn't remove only the restrictive parts making magically perfect shapes. the material removal rate is based on the surface pressure and on curved things think about the pressure distribution and where most removal will be. it mostly just smooths the insides like removing cast texture which doesnt do that much. it is about only good for inaccessible areas because short of cutting something up and welding there isnt any other way

    as for fitting the head on ive seen he s50b32 head ona m20 short block so anything can be done
    Last edited by digger; 06-10-2017 at 04:34 AM.

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