leaky engine bay on the m3... so frustrating.... need some input

[m3j0n]

So when the car sits outside and it rains (worse when it is parked slightly uphill on my driveway), cylinders 5 + 6 fill up with water and obviously misfire. So every day that it rains, I have to remove the coils, blow out the water, then put everything back - it pretty much rains every day here. Obviously, its not as bad when I am running the engine cover, but it still occurs. The car is a s52 swap, but has a an obdi valve cover. I have searched all over, but cannot find the leak. I would assume that its coming from the area around the center wiper arm assembly, but cannot pinpoint it. The cowl and all of the seals in the engine bay are in great shape, so this is driving me bonkers at the moment. Thanks for any help and suggestions.

[TheJordanWhitte]

I have no idea how that's possible...

[gingerELITE]

I think you should be more concerned with how the water is getting into your cylinders than how the water is getting past your hood...

Or is it not actually getting into your cylinders and just pooling around the coils on top of the spark plugs?

[mitch500]

I think you should be more concerned with how the water is getting into your cylinders than how the water is getting past your hood...

Or is it not actually getting into your cylinders and just pooling around the coils on top of the spark plugs?

I'm sure that's what he means.

Also check the windshield cowl and hood seal. It's the only place where it's going to come from.


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[M3C]

How water is getting into the coils to cause a problem?
About how it is getting into engine compartment you might want to update have you replaced the hood recently?

[MauiM3Mania]

I'm trying to grasp the significance of the photo of a torque wrench on the windshield wiper stud.

[mitch500]

How water is getting into the coils to cause a problem?
About how it is getting into engine compartment you might want to update have you replaced the hood recently?

Huh?


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[TH3 Shifty]

i would look around the intake manifold.. i bet your gaskets are shot

[ScotcH]

Run the cover. e36s do that ... our race car would suck in the rain, always got misfire in major downpours. Put the cover on, no issues.

[m3j0n]

I have no idea how that's possible...

sweet. thanks for the helpful contribution.

I think you should be more concerned with how the water is getting into your cylinders than how the water is getting past your hood...

Or is it not actually getting into your cylinders and just pooling around the coils on top of the spark plugs?

... the water isn't in the cylinders of the block... They are filling the chambers in the head where the coilpack and sparkplug are...

I'm sure that's what he means.

Also check the windshield cowl and hood seal. It's the only place where it's going to come from.


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Like I said in the OP, the hood seals and cowl are in great shape. No condensation or anything to show that the water is coming in from there. That's why I am baffled. Is it possible to leak out of the wire harness contraption in the center of the cowl that houses the wiper motor?

How water is getting into the coils to cause a problem?
About how it is getting into engine compartment you might want to update have you replaced the hood recently?

Water in the coil/spark plug chamber causes misfires. so the cylinders don't have combustion when the chamber is filled with water. No, the hood has not been replaced.

I'm trying to grasp the significance of the photo of a torque wrench on the windshield wiper stud.

It was the best photo online that I could reference the center section of the cowl.

Huh?


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i would look around the intake manifold.. i bet your gaskets are shot

ugh,... it is leaking into the sparkplug/coil chambers., it has nothing to do with the intake manifold gaskets.

Run the cover. e36s do that ... our race car would suck in the rain, always got misfire in major downpours. Put the cover on, no issues.

LIke I said in the OP, the cover does HELP a lot, but even with the cover on, I get the same symptoms/problem (only to a much lesser degree) under heavy rain. Still have to remove the cover, and the coils to blow out the water, so that's why I have been running without a cover.

[PITT M3 RR]

There's there's 2 screws that hold the wiring harness plastic box thing to the removable firewall piece. Take the grating off and tighten / seal those up. Water can get by them, leak around onto the cover and the. Down the mounting bolts to the VC.

[jayjaya29]

Theres a rubber seal that goes around the oil filler neck that you might be missing.

#14 on this image:
MzI5MzlfcA==.png

PN is 11127526447

[TheJordanWhitte]

Now that we all understand you're not talking about your actual cylinders... I would try to re-create the problem with a bucket or a hose and try to track down how it's getting in there.

I still don't understand how it's physically possible for water to travel over the valve cover to get in that spot.

[TostitoBandito]

Theres a rubber seal that goes around the oil filler neck that you might be missing.

#14 on this image:
MzI5MzlfcA==.png

PN is 11127526447

Yes, and I remember that being a PITA to get back in place and seated properly when I had to replace my plugs recently. It could easily have fallen out and been forgotten when the cover was previously removed.

[m3j0n]

There's there's 2 screws that hold the wiring harness plastic box thing to the removable firewall piece. Take the grating off and tighten / seal those up. Water can get by them, leak around onto the cover and the. Down the mounting bolts to the VC.

Thanks. I will look into that.

Theres a rubber seal that goes around the oil filler neck that you might be missing.

#14 on this image:
MzI5MzlfcA==.png

PN is 11127526447

thanks. Still have that rubber seal present. maybe I should buy a new one.

Now that we all understand you're not talking about your actual cylinders... I would try to re-create the problem with a bucket or a hose and try to track down how it's getting in there.

I still don't understand how it's physically possible for water to travel over the valve cover to get in that spot.

Dude,... if the actual cylinder was filled with water, the engine would be hydrolocked and Id have broken valves or bent rods... also, removing the coils would not remedy that situation. Use just 0.00001% common sense here. And yes, its driving me crazy. Thanks.

Yes, and I remember that being a PITA to get back in place and seated properly when I had to replace my plugs recently. It could easily have fallen out and been forgotten when the cover was previously
removed.

the seal is still there, but maybe its been deformed over the years. I will see if a new one helps the situation. thanks.

[gingerELITE]

Dude,... if the actual cylinder was filled with water, the engine would be hydrolocked and Id have broken valves or bent rods... also, removing the coils would not remedy that situation. Use just 0.00001% common sense here.

When you say "cylinders 5 + 6 fill up with water" I assume that means that cylinders 5 and 6 fill up with water. lol Don't blame us for the confusion.

[bluptgm3]

Is this a Coupe? Vents along aft edge of hood? Liner on inner side of hood? Any tears or penetrations?


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[mmark.]

The "water in the cylinders" response is not helpful.
The OP describes how he remedies the misfire.

Understand that water does not compress.


m

[m3j0n]

When you say "cylinders 5 + 6 fill up with water" I assume that means that cylinders 5 and 6 fill up with water. lol Don't blame us for the confusion.

Thanks for the continued helpful posts. so done debating this with you - spark plug tubes of cylinder 5 + 6. Obviously common sense eludes you and you choose only to quote part of my post...

Is this a Coupe? Vents along aft edge of hood? Liner on inner side of hood? Any tears or penetrations?


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yup, 95 e36 m3 coupe. checked the seals and liners thoroughly. No tears or penetrations. No signs of water intrusion at all.

The "water in the cylinders" response is not helpful.
The OP describes how he remedies the misfire.

Understand that water does not compress.


m

.....

[Ex36]

Apparently "isturning over a new leaf" isn't accurate. I've never witnessed a post from you that doesn't degenerate into you being extremely combative. Quickly. Your for sale threads I've stumbled upon are epic, and tragic....

[Jab31169]

Oddly enough jon, your old car did the same thing on 5 and 6, but it was due to the slots in the hood. Trashbag over the engine when it gets washed is the only thing that keeps the water out. I had the hardest time trying to figure out why the #5 spark plug was rusted when I pulled it out. Check the screws that were mentioned up above, also make sure that the seals up top are in place real good and not rotted somewhere. You might try pulling your wipers and that whole cowl to see if you can really see where its coming from.

[m3j0n]

Apparently "isturning over a new leaf" isn't accurate. I've never witnessed a post from you that doesn't degenerate into you being extremely combative. Quickly. Your for sale threads I've stumbled upon are epic, and tragic....

cool. thanks for your help.

Oddly enough jon, your old car did the same thing on 5 and 6, but it was due to the slots in the hood. Trashbag over the engine when it gets washed is the only thing that keeps the water out. I had the hardest time trying to figure out why the #5 spark plug was rusted when I pulled it out. Check the screws that were mentioned up above, also make sure that the seals up top are in place real good and not rotted somewhere. You might try pulling your wipers and that whole cowl to see if you can really see where its coming from.

yeah, that car has a vorstiener vented hood, although, I rarely had that car in the rain, nor was it ever parked outside, so I never experienced a problem with that. yeah, I am going to do that as soon as I get a free second. Thanks. Hope all is well!