What HG to use? 87mm s52 built O-RINGED block

[bwabbit18]

What to do? I have an s52 w figure8 copper wire & OEM HG w forged pistons & rods pushing ~530whp on 20lbs out of a GTX35R. About a month ago the HG went at WOT midway up thru 4th gear due to what i think was head lift between cylinder 4&5 (taking the head off ARP studs between 4&5 were 60-65 tq'ed meanwhile the rest were 85?).

I know having my block grooved for that figure 8 is old school technology & thats not how its done nowadays but i just dont see it to trash my block pull it out strip it down get a new block machine it and put it back together and put it back in when my block is fine. Thats alot of time and money i really dont want to spend.

Anyway should I go with another OEM HG & stainless o rings? Or try maybe a max psi or a cut ring HG from one of the companies and set the rings on the block w the HG over it instead of laying the HG first and then the rings over it? Please help!! This is a daily driven street car, low boost 12 lbs 450hp high boost 20 lbs ~530hp i want to make it bulletproof this time around. Thanks!

[bwabbit18]

Anyone?

[GT35Rm3]

At your power level, a stock gasket with copper rings should hold just fine.

You should not be blowing head gaskets at your level. The differing apr torque numbers is not your answer. You need to figure out what's up.

What compression are your pistons? 20psi on straight pump is a lot for even for 8.5:1. What tuning do you have?

[bwabbit18]

@gt35rm3 thanks for the response. Wiesco Low compression pistons 8.5:1. When i did the compression test cyl 4 & 5 gave me 0 compression & when i pulled off the head right where 4&5 meet the HG was toast as was even the copper wire.

[bwabbit18]

What tuning do you have?

running TRM tune, once i put it back together I'll be going with RK tune. Does different oil viscosity have anything to do w an HG failing? Curious.

[m3boost]

elring

[someguy2800]

Like he said ^^^ back in the day people used to oring motors all the time and it was found Elring brand oem headgaskets worked the best. I would put it back together with copper orings and a new Elring headgasket. Poeple have made twice as much power as that with stock head gaskets and orings.

[Butters Stoch]

Maybe use copper wire and a cutring gasket and be done with it.

[bwabbit18]

Maybe use copper wire and a cutring gasket and be done with it.

i thiught i couldnt use the cutring HG due to the block being grooved for o rings?

[Butters Stoch]

i thiught i couldnt use the cutring HG due to the block being grooved for o rings?

Copper would squish down.
Jimmy aka SM3 is doing this as well.

[bwabbit18]

Copper would squish down.
Jimmy aka SM3 is doing this as well.

What do you mean? i was looking into using stainless o rings... the triple cut ones...

[Butters Stoch]

What do you mean? i was looking into using stainless o rings... the triple cut ones...

I would look into putting the copper wire back in, and run a cutring gasket over it. The rings should be wider than the copper.

[chikinhed]

I have been running an Elring HG with SS o-rings (figure 8's) for a long time now without issue. I initially used copper and it failed. The copper is too soft IMHO, I've even reused the SS after an extreme over boost on pump gas.

I'd only recommend SS o-rings since you already have grooves. If you didn't then I'd say cut ring.

[SM3]

Copper would squish down.
Jimmy aka SM3 is doing this as well.

I went 4 years and 40K+ on stainless o-ring figure 8 style. I cannot complain. I spoke with a few big hp turbo builders and they think even though im not seeing knock at that 700whp level the head gasket takes alot of abuse on 93 octane and 50/50 water meth.

Ill be testing this setup out copper wire with cut ring gasket this time around and im also going to a better fuel. I think it will work great.

[m3boost]

I have been running an Elring HG with SS o-rings (figure 8's) for a long time now without issue. I initially used copper and it failed. The copper is too soft IMHO, I've even reused the SS after an extreme over boost on pump gas. I'd only recommend SS o-rings since you already have grooves. If you didn't then I'd say cut ring.

same here.. same setup...2 years already and holding strong

[bwabbit18]

I have been running an Elring HG with SS o-rings (figure 8's) for a long time now without issue. I initially used copper and it failed.

I'd only recommend SS o-rings since you already have grooves. If you didn't then I'd say cut ring.

if you are doing figure 8 style o rings where are you gettig the wire? I was looking at individual rings per cylinder. And the OE Elring HG is 87mm? Thought elring HG bore size was stock?

[chikinhed]

The stock Elring will work. 0.5 mm is not very much difference. I used 0.041" stainless steel lockwire. I'm an aircraft mechanic so I have this stuff laying around but even Harbour Freight sells it.

[GT35Rm3]

Uhh, how about we help this kid figure out why he is blowing head gaskets?

[Butters Stoch]

Uhh, how about we help this kid figure out why he is blowing head gaskets?

Arp's were loose I guess.

[bwabbit18]

Thanks a lot guys i appreciate the help! I dont see it any other way then those ARPs being loose thats the only thing i came up with pulling the head off

- - - Updated - - -

The stock Elring will work. 0.5 mm is not very much difference. I used 0.041" stainless steel lockwire.

Im getting the head resurfaced, the thickness on the HG wouldnt be an issue when putting it all back together? Thanks on the harbor freight tip ill stop by today to see if i grab some

[milKt]

Uhh, how about we help this kid figure out why he is blowing head gaskets?

GASKET (S) ? pLURAL?

[cragg56]

As others have mentioned. Stock elring and ss wire

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[milKt]

As others have mentioned. Stock elring and ss wire

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DITTO

years @ 16-20 psi - 84.5mm bore

[e30polak]

May want to add water meth to the system at 20 psi.