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Thread: Is SMG an Automatic or Manual Transmission

  1. #1
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    Is SMG an Automatic or Manual Transmission

    Hello all,

    I am having a heated debate with my friend about whether SMG is an automatic or manual transmission. I say that it is a manual, while he says that because the driver does not have to engage the clutch, it is an automatic.

    What do you guys think it is?

  2. #2
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    It's a 7-speed manual transmission with an automated clutch by design.


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  3. #3
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    If you slap wings on that baby it would fly, does that make it a plane? It's an automatic if it shifts gears autonomously and automatically. The fact that it can also advance or decline gears progressively, on demand is simply a designed option of this type of automatic transmission.


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  4. #4
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    You're arguing semantics here.

    A torque converter and planetary gears sets make an automatic transmission.

    A clutch, with gears that are engaged/disengaged by shift forks makes a manual.

    By that definition, the SMG transmissions are manual gearboxes. It's in the name: Sequential Manual Gearbox



    If you want to call it an auto because it can change gears automatically, then call it whatever the hell you want. But it is a true, real, manual gearbox. It just has a hydraulic system to operate the clutch, and move the shift levers.
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    Semantics? By your definition the gearbox is whatever you want to call it. SMG describes one mode of operation of the box, and not its principal operating mode. The word "manual" indicates that not only does the gear selection require direct physical inputs of the driver but conscious mental choices as well. Down and up shifting non-sequentially, from 1st to 3rd or 5th to second, cannot be accomplished with an SMG automatic, without stepping through each intervening gear. Other shift requirements of each particular dynamic condition are manipulated by shift programs of a particular pre set driving mode. The automatic transmission and its programs are in charge of even operator directed shifts, they merely accomplish automatic sequential shifts on demand. It's not a true manual gearbox unless the driver has a manual clutch, manual shift lever, and complete and total control of the gear box.


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    You believe whatever you want to believe. Too bad you're wrong. There is no explanation you could ever give that would make you right. SMG is a manual transmission.
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  7. #7
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    Automatic is used for designating a transmission with a torque converter. Manual is for simpler transmission that utilizes a clutch. SMG is a manual transmission.

    Some automatic cars also have the + and - manual shifting lever. Does that make them a manual transmission LOL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sshivaram View Post
    Automatic is used for designating a transmission with a torque converter. Manual is for simpler transmission that utilizes a clutch. SMG is a manual transmission.

    Some automatic cars also have the + and - manual shifting lever. Does that make them a manual transmission LOL.
    Haha! Great point! By his definition, that's a manual!!!


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  9. #9
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    The SMG automatic was given the manual misnomer by a marketing executive, hoping to court those drivers only proficient with steering and throttle selection the fiction of mastering a manual transmission. Actually believing the SMG is a manual is being deluded.


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    So now it's an engineer's fault they call it a manual? Lol. You amuse me.


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    I say manual. Maybe it is only my car, but I can feel the clutch engaging. The very same feeling as driving a "standard transmission."

    I am not saying because I can feel the clutch, that that makes it a manual, but I always thought it was a manual with an electronic clutch. (Different from an auto)

    When you swap out the tranny fluid, you use "manual tranny fluid," again not saying that that alone makes it a manual, but there are enough tick marks on the manual side, vs auto, so I consider it a manual.

    As someone else said, call it what you want, doesn't really matter, what we can agree on is it is different than other manuals and autos on the road....

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    I guess when fully autonomous cars hit the highway, you guys will insist that you are driving them instead of being driven. Any transmission that shifts automatically is an automatic. Simple, isn't it? Adding a semi automatic sequential mode to the box doesn't change its primary purpose of removing the old fashioned chore of shifting from future cars along with throttle application and steering.


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  13. #13
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    When the first automatic transmission was put into production, the selling points were the driver had no gears to shift and no clutch to press.

    With the SMG, the driver no longer needs to work the clutch, but he still needs to make the gear selections via the shifter.

    Sure, there's the lame auto mode SMG offers. But claiming that feature makes it an automatic is like saying the ability to move the shifter to D to S or L on an automatic trans makes that a manual trans.

    Someone decided to call it SMG. It's not a manual trans where the driver handles both actions nor is it an automatic where everything besides the initial direction selection.
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    What is the difference between and SMG "manually shifting" transmission and the "manually shifting" transmission on my 2009 335i?

    And thank you all for your great answers.

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    Do you have a clutch pedal? If not, then you have an automatic transmission with paddle shifters. There is a torque converter and not a clutch.
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    Quote Originally Posted by White94RX View Post
    Do you have a clutch pedal? If not, then you have an automatic transmission with paddle shifters. There is a torque converter and not a clutch.

    So if the transmission has a clutch, it's a manual, correct? Even if that clutch is actuated by a computer pressing the clutch pedal for you? And the SMG does have a clutch, correct? It's more of an automated manual than an automatic, correct?

  17. #17
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    Yes that's the simplest explanation


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  18. #18
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    This is what's wrong with the world, common sense goes right out the window and obtuse explanations masquerade as truth. SMG is an automatic transmission modified to accept limited sequential inputs from the operator, while most of the operating parameters and art of this driving aspect are controlled automatically by computer.


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  19. #19
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    LOL!!!

    You just won't give up, will you?
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    It's not about giving up, it's about using your own brain to discern truth, not someone else's, or indeed our own prejudices on a subject. The SMG automatic has been designed to mimic a few rudimentary manual transmission aspects, but most other essential operations are beyond operator control. In a manual transmission, all essential inputs are operator controlled.


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  21. #21
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    We are talking about the "transmission" -- the one that houses the Gears that transfers power from the engine to the drive train.
    SMG is NOT an automatic.
    In an automatic transmission, the transfer of power is via a Torque Converter. In an automatic transmission, the gears change automatically and there is absolutely no loss of torque transfer during the gear change. One can step on the gas pedal and the transmission will continuously transfer power with zero slippage.

    In a manual transmission, a clutch is used (in BMW SMG, its an automated clutch, so no clutch pedal). You pull the clutch out, stopping the transfer of torque from the engine momentarily, while the gears are changed in the transmission. This is thus a manual transmission. Gears have to be changed manually and inside the transmission case, they do NOT change automatically. In BMW SMG, put it into Auto Drive D, step on the gas pedal. You will experience a brief power loss when gears are changed. You will not experience this in an automatic transmission where it will up shift without that hiccup.

    We are not talking about automated or manual shifting I hope, we are discussing , technically, the "transmission" part.
    Last edited by sshivaram; 07-01-2017 at 08:30 AM.

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    Well said. That guy just doesn't get what makes a transmission a "manual". It's not about pushing in the clutch with your foot, and moving the stick with your hand. It's about the transmission itself, and how it transfers torque from the engine (clutch vs. torque converter), and how it shifts gears (disengage clutch, move shift fork to disengage previous gear, and engage the next gear). It's really not complicated at all.
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  23. #23
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    I guess I'm that guy, the one with a brain that automatically rejects facts or definitions wholly made up to support an argument. Who made up the torque converter rule, your uncle or probably someone else trying to support your opinion. My definition doesn't depend on what parts do what, but on the one essential absent in your excuse, the intention and input of the operator. If the machine is making the choices outside of operator control it's an automatic, period. Your argument is infantile and wrong headed and based on facts that have nothing to do with the reality of the SMG automatic. It's operating principles preclude operating control of the gearbox. My mom told me not to waste time arguing with fools, I shoulda listened.


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    Yeah you really should have.


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    Looks like we should listen to your mom too. 😂

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