Seat twist fixed

[indy525]

Finally got around to fixing my passenger seat for the chronic seat twist issue. Mine not only effected seat recline, but height rear height adjustment as well. My first plan was to remove the seat from the car and remove the car and loosen the motors to get the cables out. However there were two problems. 1. my height adjustment problem wouldn't let me raise the seat enough to remove the seat belt and 2. once looking under the seat and how tight it is, it would be a major pain to get to the bolts for both of the motors near the front of the seat. Because I really didn't want to bother possibly breaking either of the seat trim trying to get it off to access the motors easier, it left me with two options:

1) cut mid cable and reattach

or

2) using a mini torch to heat up the connectors while still attached to the motor, pull the cables out, trim, and then replace them in the motor.

I choose #2, and it didn't end up being that bad. I used a mini butane torch, heated the connectors on the end of the cable for about 5sec, then pulled them out. Best to use needle nose pliers, on the first one I didn't and sliced my hand open because of the sharp metal under the seat. Then I trimmed about 1/2 inch off the cable insulation, the re-heated the connector (while it was still connected to the motor) and pushed back into the motor.

A couple of tips: I used a small pipe cutter to cut the insulation around the cable-this made a super clean cut. Because of the tight space under the seat, the mini torch worked well directing the flame on just the connector. Be careful because if it's directed too much on the cable insulation, it will melt it quick.

One more thing-I removed the rear seat cushion which put the seat at a better angle to have better access.



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[geargrinder]

Fully agreed. Good stuff. I use a heat gun to keep flames away from stuff. Works just as well IME, even if it's a bit big to point in the right directions, being not quite as disasterously hot as a flame means you're not quite so worried. Yep there's sharp cutty bleedy stuff in there for sure.

[amancuso]

I think I understand what you did. You used the mini torch on the bowden cable while it was still in the motor, then used pliers to pull it out, cut, reinsert and reheat to reform the seal?

[geargrinder]

Correct that's what he's saying. Guys have tried / advocated that using lighters... I don't like that option myself, I think its way better to pull the seat and then loosen the motor/cable bolts if at all possible (contrary to a lot of shitty writeups the motors don't have to come out remotely, a few bolts just need to be loosened enough that the cable retainer can be slipped...) , but if it is not, then the mini-torch (being SUPER careful obv) is a reluctant solution.

[indy525]

Today im in the process of doing the drivers seat. Let me just say there was a few times i thought about just putting a for sale sign in front of it instead of dealing with the seats anymore.

I did my usual heat the metal piece at the end and yanking the cable out. Went smoothly until i couldnt get the cable back in. So now i thought since i have the seat out, ill just loosen the motors and pull the little metal coupling out and then reattach as one piece. Great idea in theory, but the screws to loosen the motos are almost impossible to get to on one side. Ive aeriously been messing with this damn seat for hours

[XAlt]

I've done it with a mini-torch.

I didn't level out the seat properly, so it's not perfectly straight but fully adjustable and the lot. I don't want to spend the time wrestling with those jesus bolts again, so it's been like that for a while.

10\10 build quality

[geargrinder]

Today im in the process of doing the drivers seat. Let me just say there was a few times i thought about just putting a for sale sign in front of it instead of dealing with the seats anymore.

I did my usual heat the metal piece at the end and yanking the cable out. Went smoothly until i couldnt get the cable back in. So now i thought since i have the seat out, ill just loosen the motors and pull the little metal coupling out and then reattach as one piece. Great idea in theory, but the screws to loosen the motos are almost impossible to get to on one side. Ive aeriously been messing with this damn seat for hours

They are hard but aren't that hard? Do you have some offset wrenches? Don't need to be out , just loose...

[geargrinder]

I've done it with a mini-torch.

I didn't level out the seat properly, so it's not perfectly straight but fully adjustable and the lot. I don't want to spend the time wrestling with those jesus bolts again, so it's been like that for a while.

10\10 build quality

The trick is using a cordless drill to adjust the sides. I use 2 methods. I look at the gears and try to match teeth position in both sides. But I also think you have to sit in the seat to final confirm it feels good. The outside bolsters can sometimes be trashed by PO fat asses lurching in and out of the car slamming on them and in that case it "feels straight" to have one side a hair off.

[indy525]

Ok so the main problem i had today is the "mini torch method" of fixing the seat twist didnt work because the cabke wouldnt stay in the motor-meaning when i heated the coupling back up to shove the trimmed wire back in the motor, the insulation on the cable wouldnt catch.

So i got to try method #2, the "loosen the motors" method and i have to say this was damn near impossible probably because i didnt have any offset wrenches. After a couple of hours messing with screws that are just about impossible to get to, i was finally successfull in getting the cables and couplings out. Thought i was in the home stretch. I couldnt for the life of me get bracket moved enough (had the front 2 out completely and the back 2 almost ready to fall out) to get the cable back in on the most forward cable-the one that controls height adjustment. So that leads me to...

Method #3, the "the cut the cable" method. Once the cable was out this was easy. I just cut the cable, re-inserted in the motors. This allowed me to get that section of cable i couldnt get into the motor in method #2 back in. I didnt have anything to reattach the two ends of the cable.

While i had the seat out i changed out the seat switch, and then the height adjusment didnt work. I would just hear a click of the motors. So i pulled the cable out of the side opposite of the motor and the swich worked fine. Then i used my drill for the other side and my drill adjusted the height just fine. What i think was causing the issue is that since both ends of the cable insulation are not attached, it allows the cable to torque and not allow the seat to move. I think what ill do is get some fuel hose and reattach both ends with some zip ties.

Really long day but now i can adjust my seat!

[geargrinder]

I think people try to take the wrong screws out. You're not trying to / don't need to take ALL the motor screws out! It's a couple of screws on each side, just enough play to wiggle the cable out of the "U" retainer. Ok it's not SUPER easy, but it's not as hard as all that...

And yeah - the reason "only lighters and torches" are a bit tricky is the cable can get forked up by it if you overdo it. You clearly overdid it. Which is why "just torching" not the best method. Get the cable end out mechanically. Use minimal heat needed only to pull the ferrule off. Minimal heat needed to replace it. No more no less.

And yeah the cut the cable method also has downsides. You also might not have taken enough cable out. When it works for a bit but then stops again it's often not enough sheathing removed.

[berndtj]

I did the mid cable cut this weekend. I used 10 gauge wire strippers to cut the cable sheath. I cut about 1/2-3/4" of the sheathing and slid over some shrink tube. I think it should hold up just fine. Hardest part of this job was getting the front covers off the seat track since I couldn't fully raise the seat (twist). I'm not putting those covers back on!


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[Chisum]

I did the seat twist fix on the passenger seat of my touring a few weeks ago and used the same method. I used a butane torch my daughter bought to make creme brulee.

Chisum

[geargrinder]

Yeah, if the seat wont lift its a huge hassle. Pretty dramatic engineering fail. Most other cars I've had have had 'stand alone' end-trims that cover end-exposed bolts that mount the seat, so that its very very unlikely you can block the mounting bolts in the event of power out or failure. Like in my Audis, yes it can happen but only if the seat is really far fore/aft, and, the trim isn't some kind of ridiculous chinese puzzle to remove that itself can be blocked by the seat being too far down - the trim pops right off easily.

Once you get the hang of it installing/removing trim isn't such a big deal either but half of the battle is arriving w/ the right tools - for the @(*#$&% inboard torx screw I use a micro ratcheting bit driver w/ torx bit.
This sort of thing although not exactly one I have, but random innerwebz pix.



I can see not putting that inner front trim back on for sure, but the outer one I'd replace, because you do see it and it is more finished/proper with the trim there.

[indy525]

I think people try to take the wrong screws out. You're not trying to / don't need to take ALL the motor screws out! It's a couple of screws on each side, just enough play to wiggle the cable out of the "U" retainer. Ok it's not SUPER easy, but it's not as hard as all that...

And yeah - the reason "only lighters and torches" are a bit tricky is the cable can get forked up by it if you overdo it. You clearly overdid it. Which is why "just torching" not the best method. Get the cable end out mechanically. Use minimal heat needed only to pull the ferrule off. Minimal heat needed to replace it. No more no less.

And yeah the cut the cable method also has downsides. You also might not have taken enough cable out. When it works for a bit but then stops again it's often not enough sheathing removed.

I still stand behind the "mini-torch" method-I think I ended up cutting off too much of the cable sheath which made it harder to get the insulation to reattach to the cable end. I don't think there is much risk involved in that method overall.

You don't have to take all the screws out, you have to at least get the front 2 off and loosen the back two to the point where they are almost all the way out. Even then it was very hard to get the cable ends to slide out of the motor.

Edit- Now I'm talking about the cables on the inboard side for both seats, if I had to access the door side it may be easier. I did have the trim off anyway to replace a bad seat switch.

I think I know what you are saying-If I loosened the bolts on both sides of the motors it would make it much easier to move the motors around...I just messed with one side.