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Thread: "If I had to do it again" 325i m50 turbo build

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hova View Post
    What clutch where you running? Usually when the clutch is on backwards it will stall instantly when the clutch is released. At least that's been my experience.

    Idle issues, start with the simple stuff:
    CEL codes
    Spark plug gaps
    Vacuum leaks
    MAF, blow through? Make sure the contacts are clean and working.
    Alternator/battery, engine chassis ground.
    clutch is gripforce stage 4 still reused everything just had it installed wrong and as far as the poor idle I was able to figure out that a rubber plug I had on a fitting thats on my maf pipe fell off and so I just welded a washer onto a nut and tightened it up and no more issues I'm hoping to take it for its first real test drive today so i'll report back once that happens




    Quote Originally Posted by SilburE36 View Post
    LOL, same thing happened to me when I put my first M52 back together! Couldn’t figure out wtf that noise was.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    you live and you learn lol hopefully nothing like that happens again but lucky for me was able to figure it out pretty quick

  2. #27
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    Been going into work early and staying late trying to get the car back to roadworthy still having a tough time driving the car but after I installed the innovate scg-1 it at least helped me with checking other things so here’s all the info I have so far

    Stock m50tub25 (internals and valvetrain)
    ARP head studs
    CES Motorsport headgasket combo .140
    60lb injectors
    Miller war chip with turbo base tune
    Walbro 255lph
    4” exhaust
    Tial 38mm wastegate
    Tial 50mm bov
    Mishimoto radiator w/ 16 “ 2200 CFM fan


    Cold start : cranks and starts but will need some assistance staying on by way of pressing accelerator slightly my AFR around 12 to 13 but if I don’t press the pedal and help it it will eventually start leaning and die out

    Operating temperature: cranks and starts idles smooth with no interruptions AFR sits at 11 revving will fluctuate between 11 to 14 with no issue

    As soon as you try and drive it within the first 5 feet the car is bucking bad AFR spikes to 22 but goes right back to 11 after pushing clutch back in and idles without fault

    Looked into a few things so far :
    •Fuel pressure is good (46psi?)
    •Vacuum readings are -20hg at idle (sprayed around engine bay chasing vacuum leaks and have found nothing)
    •Voltage to the battery is a strong 14.47
    •Coolant temperature sensor works properly
    •Fuel pump works (Have a strainer that is a little too large and folds on its self not sure if this is a problem)
    •Checked base tune and found o2 sensor was turned on so loaded the o2 sensor off tune and it seemed to help the idle but not driving
    Checked gap on spark plugs they were a little tight at .21 so I bumped them out to .24
    No CEL codes at all

    So anyways not sure where to look at this point but I’m close but I’ve been keeping the car at my job but my higher ups are not happy about it so I’m trying to finish before I have to get it outta there but will probably be tomorrow if I can’t figure it out and then I’ll have to find a place for it that’s not conveniently close to me so updates will slow down I’ll get back to you guys and let you know when I can
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 01-17-2019 at 09:19 AM.

  3. #28
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    Found the air intake book was cracked replaced with bimmerworld unit Messed around with the car more didn’t really run right just went ahead and replaced the ignition coil boots since I had them already ran some maf cleaner on on the maf and threw some more gas in it and it fired up and FINALLY took it for a spin down the road and man was she feeling good didn’t push it hard but it finally drove and everything seemed good but unfortunately my fun was cut short. Because I mistakenly drove with the hood not completely shut and it flew up on me bent the bracket welded to the chassis and the hood but windshield was safe gotta replace the hood and bend the bracket back gonna see what I can do with that every good comes with a bad lol update y’all later
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 01-25-2019 at 04:19 PM.

  4. #29
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    Cool

    Updating thread

    Since my last post the car has been to 2 different places since I just couldnÂ’t figure it out. The first was Renn welt in Fredrick MD who was at least able to get the car drivable on my miller ecu by changing my crank dampener and adjust timing from what I was told. Renn welt suggested I switch over to megasquirt since the miller ecu was pretty outdated. I purchased a kdfi based on a recommendation from another e36er who is running the same ecu successfully. Took the car to the same person mentioned who helped me to get the car started on the ms2 which he did but it wouldnÂ’t idle told me the tuner should be able to take care of that so I dropped it at the tuner and he tells me after a few days that the car never started again after I dropped it off. So now hereÂ’s where IÂ’m at

    Car cranks but wonÂ’t start with ms2 or my miller ecu any tips for proper diagnosis is appreciated I also have a datalog file for anyone interested in helping I’ll report back with my finding I am learning as I go so updated may be slow
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 01-12-2020 at 08:03 PM.

  5. #30
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    Should have done a factory ECU tune, unless you are knowledgeable about tuning and installing aftermarket ECU.

    I’d bypass the turbo, revert to the stock ECU and get the car running. Then do what you want with tuning and boost.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    Should have done a factory ECU tune, unless you are knowledgeable about tuning and installing aftermarket ECU.

    I’d bypass the turbo, revert to the stock ECU and get the car running. Then do what you want with tuning and boost.
    I do have a factory 413 and maf still but I don’t have the factory Injectors will this be a problem just to get the engine up and running ?

  7. #32
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    Everything has to match. Looks like you have committed yourself to tuners who aren’t mechanics and mechanics who aren’t tuners, both of whom want to get paid, and you can’t tell either of them that you brought them a perfectly running car. This situation is often an expensive frustration.

    If you can improve your DIY skills or find a local owner with whatever system you are running to help you for free, that is your best option to get out of this situation.

  8. #33
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    Hit me with a pm and I’ll hook you up on stock ecu hardware/tune.

    Should get you fixed up.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    1989 535i - sold
    1999 M3 Tiag/Dove - sold
    1998 M3 Turbo Arctic/black - current
    2004 Built motor TiAg/Black - Sold
    2008 E61 19T Turbo-Wagon - current
    2011 E82 135i - S85 Swap - current
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    1998 Turbo: PTE6870 | 1.15 ar | Hp Cover, Custom Divided T4 bottom-mount, 3.5" SS exhaust, Dual Turbosmart Compgates, Turbosmart Raceport BOV, 3.5" Treadstone Intercooler, 3.5" Vibrant resonator and muffler, Arp 2k Headstuds | Arp 2k Main studs | 87mm Je pistons | Eagle rods | 9.2:1 static compression, Ces 87mm cutring, Custom solid rear subframe bushings, Akg 85d diff bushings, 4 clutch 3.15 diff, , Poly engine mounts, UUC trans mounts W/ enforcers, 22RPD OBD2 Stock ECU id1700 E85 tune, 22RPD Big power Transmission swap w/ GS6-53

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumdogJay View Post
    Updating thread

    Since my last post the car has been to 2 different places since I just couldnÂ’t figure it out. The first was Renn welt in Fredrick MD who was at least able to get the car drivable on my miller ecu by changing my crank dampener and adjust timing from what I was told. Renn welt suggested I switch over to megasquirt since the miller ecu was pretty outdated. I purchased a kdfi based on a recommendation from another e36er who is running the same ecu successfully. Took the car to the same person mentioned who helped me to get the car started on the ms2 which he did but it wouldnÂ’t idle told me the tuner should be able to take care of that so I dropped it at the tuner and he tells me after a few days that the car never started again after I dropped it off. So now hereÂ’s where IÂ’m at

    Car cranks but wonÂ’t start with ms2 or my miller ecu any tips for proper diagnosis is appreciated I also have a datalog file for anyone interested in helping I’ll report back with my finding I am learning as I go so updated may be slow
    Also hit me up. I live and Frederick and can assist with getting things sorted.
    Capital Driving Club Car # 102
    How to turbo your car:
    Step one. Install ecu and learn to tune and or have it tuned.
    Step two. Install injectors and retune.
    Step three. Install turbo parts and bits. get it running with out leaks. DO NOT DRIVE IT. Idling should be ok
    Step four. Retune car
    Step five enjoy

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    This situation is often an expensive frustration.
    fair assesment for sure and I agree on improving the DIY skill and all your guys advice is helping me get there



    Quote Originally Posted by vollosso View Post
    Hit me with a pm and I’ll hook you up on stock ecu hardware/tune.

    Should get you fixed up.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I really should have researched more on the engine management before pulling the trigger on the miller stuff oh well. Vollosso i'll keep you in mind when I can afford to swap engine management again But I would like to make what I have work for now


    Quote Originally Posted by euro2fast4u View Post
    Also hit me up. I live and Frederick and can assist with getting things sorted.
    Hey i'll take any help I can get I'm in the Stafford area let me know how we move forward

  11. #36
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    Did a little diagnostics with the composite logger today and I'm not seeing anything on the the tooth logger or the composite logger so I tested the crankshaft position sensor per the bentley across terminals 1 and 2 and got a resistance of 6.51 ohms with my rinky dink multimeter bentley says 1280+- alldata says 540 ohms Am I measuring this correctly ?

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumdogJay View Post
    Did a little diagnostics with the composite logger today and I'm not seeing anything on the the tooth logger or the composite logger so I tested the crankshaft position sensor per the bentley across terminals 1 and 2 and got a resistance of 6.51 ohms with my rinky dink multimeter bentley says 1280+- alldata says 540 ohms Am I measuring this correctly ?

    When I tested my sensor I got 523 ohms (brand new Mahle sensor from FCP euro) I'd replaced the sensor.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by E30s50dude View Post
    When I tested my sensor I got 523 ohms (brand new Mahle sensor from FCP euro) I'd replaced the sensor.
    If I understood this correctly you tested the mahle sensor it had 523 ohms and you replaced it with a bmw sensor is that correct ? I had a new sensor I believe inter brand and the car was running then. When I took it to renn welt they put a used bmw crank sensor (to rule out that the problem was that) I didnt have any issue with starting until recently so I'm wondering since it was used that it just happened to fail. I believe the reading I got would point to the sensor failure.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumdogJay View Post
    Did a little diagnostics with the composite logger today and I'm not seeing anything on the the tooth logger or the composite logger so I tested the crankshaft position sensor per the bentley across terminals 1 and 2 and got a resistance of 6.51 ohms with my rinky dink multimeter bentley says 1280+- alldata says 540 ohms Am I measuring this correctly ?
    You have noted a few things of concern so far with regards to this. An engine needs a few items, Air, fuel, spark.

    Why did the first company replace the engine dampener and what did they replace this?
    (If a non OEM is installed, this can throw off the timing of spark and fuel)

    If they replaced the dampener with a non oem, what cps did they use?

    Is it OBD1 or OBD2?

    What MS2 did you purchase? PNP?

    Are you sure its not MS3?


    Now to diagnostics:

    Step one, verify spark.
    Assuming you dont have spark we need to determine why. It can be a various amount of items.
    Make sure a CPS is installed correctly.
    Make sure the CPS is plugged in
    Verify the wiring from the cps to the ecu. Ohming like you are is perfect. Start at the sensor and go all the way back to the ecu. The change in resistance should be minimal
    Verify CPS is not broken as you are and yours appears to be.
    If CPS is damaged, replace with new.
    Once you have all of this completed, you should be able to review and see the tooth logger working correctly as you crank the engine. Note, pull fuel pump fuse.

    Step Two, verify you actually have spark
    Pull coil, throw a spare plug in, ground and crank over. Turn off fuel pump relay or pull fuse
    If you have spark great, if not repeat step one.

    Step three, you have spark and you have RPM on MS.
    Verify your map sensor is work. when you turn the key on you should be around 101kpa.
    As you crank the engine, the map should drop to anywhere from 40-80.

    Step Four.
    Plug fuel pump fuse back in or turn relay back on. (depends on ecu question above)
    Attempt to start the car and keep it running.
    Allow the car to get up to temp. Do not Drive, do not rev above 2k. Depending on wide band installation, we may have you adjust to closed loop control to not flood the engine too much.

    Step five, If all of the above is done
    Now we need to make sure the timing is set correctly. What this does is sync the engine to the ecu. DIY has a great page on this.
    https://www.diyautotune.com/support/...r/base-timing/

    Step Six,
    Go get it tuned, once the car starts every time.
    Capital Driving Club Car # 102
    How to turbo your car:
    Step one. Install ecu and learn to tune and or have it tuned.
    Step two. Install injectors and retune.
    Step three. Install turbo parts and bits. get it running with out leaks. DO NOT DRIVE IT. Idling should be ok
    Step four. Retune car
    Step five enjoy

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumdogJay View Post
    If I understood this correctly you tested the mahle sensor it had 523 ohms and you replaced it with a bmw sensor is that correct ? I had a new sensor I believe inter brand and the car was running then. When I took it to renn welt they put a used bmw crank sensor (to rule out that the problem was that) I didnt have any issue with starting until recently so I'm wondering since it was used that it just happened to fail. I believe the reading I got would point to the sensor failure.
    I bought that sensor new and out of the box I had 523 ohms. I was just giving you an example of what I know your crank sensor should be around if its still good. You stated you had 6 ohms which is nowhere near were it should be (bently ohm reference is not correct) and I would suspect that your sensor is what needs to be replaced.

  16. #41
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    Step 1:
    Verified CPS was installed and plugged in correctly using bentley as reference
    Rechecked sensor and confirmed sensor was bad using new sensor as reference (by the way ordered BWD brand through carquest and I got a factory stamped bmw crank sensor)
    Pulled Fuel pump relay and confirmed tooth logger was now reading correctly

    Step 2:
    Verified there was actually spark when cranking

    Step 3:
    Found there was now rpm reading on MS and also verified MAP sensor reading matched with information provided

    Step 4:
    reinstall fuel pump relay crank engine and it started and ran for a few minutes up to operating temperature found vehicle wont idle but it now runs.

    Thank you all for helping out now to answer some questions for euro2fastu

    It was an obd1 sensor but you now know that the fault was the sensor
    To be honest I really can't remember why they said the dampener needed to be replaced I trusted that it was needed but it is OEM
    Lastly the unit I have is an PNP MS2/MSextra firmware

    Quote Originally Posted by E30s50dude View Post
    I bought that sensor new and out of the box I had 523 ohms. I was just giving you an example of what I know your crank sensor should be around if its still good. You stated you had 6 ohms which is nowhere near were it should be (bently ohm reference is not correct) and I would suspect that your sensor is what needs to be replaced.
    Thanks for the clarification I was scratching my head for a bit wondering why bentley was showing such a high amount of ohms also measured about 520 ohms on my replacement sensor

  17. #42
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    Now that I got the car running I need to just really get everything back in its final resting place like my ecu, fuel pump cover and etc. that I had apart for diagnosis move on to diagnostic on the idle. Looks like some engine has got some oil leaks though so gotta make sure to deal with that also.

    I plan to start by measuring the idle control valve it buzzes and everything when I have the key on but I just want to be sure. Also I recall a tech/coworker of mine tried helping with diagnosis a WHILE back but I remember he said he messed with the idle set screw on the throttle body? best way to check this ?


    By the way I know this isn't the classifieds but If anyone is interested in a Miller war chip and the MAF both working fine with an extra factory red label 413 shoot me a pm
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 01-16-2020 at 05:39 PM. Reason: gotta fix that idle

  18. #43
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    Are you having and idle surge issue or will the car not idle at all i'd look for vacuum leaks since it sounds like you've taken the car apart quite a bit?

    ICV will energize will key on like you said, if irc you can adjust the tension on the throttle cable right below the throttle body. There should be two cables running there top for pedal cable and lower for crusie control cable you adjust them (at least the pedal cable) by turning the plastic nut left or right to adjust throttle plate. You can remove the intake elbow and see the plate move as you loosen or tighten the adjusting nut.

  19. #44
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    Now that its up and running and starts every time, id get the leaks fixed and take it to get tuned. Glad you got it up and running! Send me a pm, prefer to assist over via messenger as im not on bf much.
    Capital Driving Club Car # 102
    How to turbo your car:
    Step one. Install ecu and learn to tune and or have it tuned.
    Step two. Install injectors and retune.
    Step three. Install turbo parts and bits. get it running with out leaks. DO NOT DRIVE IT. Idling should be ok
    Step four. Retune car
    Step five enjoy

  20. #45
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    now this covid thing has been going around work has been slow (essential lol) anyways I still haven't got this idle thing sorted out. My tuner cancelled my appointment due to the virus so he wont be able to help for a while. I'm wondering if anyone can review my msq and msl files to see if there is something going on with the tune that is causing the car to shut off. So basically whats happening is the car will only start if I have the throttle pressed slightly and the only way to keep it running is by holding the throttle. The moment I let go the car shuts off. No vaccum leaks , ICV was working but swapped it anyway checked throttle cable tension and it seems fine. In my free time I'm studying the megasquirt to become more familiar with it as I am a novice to the system so hopefully I come across something that helps me. I'll report back when I come up with something

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlumdogJay View Post
    now this covid thing has been going around work has been slow (essential lol) anyways I still haven't got this idle thing sorted out. My tuner cancelled my appointment due to the virus so he wont be able to help for a while. I'm wondering if anyone can review my msq and msl files to see if there is something going on with the tune that is causing the car to shut off. So basically whats happening is the car will only start if I have the throttle pressed slightly and the only way to keep it running is by holding the throttle. The moment I let go the car shuts off. No vaccum leaks , ICV was working but swapped it anyway checked throttle cable tension and it seems fine. In my free time I'm studying the megasquirt to become more familiar with it as I am a novice to the system so hopefully I come across something that helps me. I'll report back when I come up with something
    PM Sent
    Capital Driving Club Car # 102
    How to turbo your car:
    Step one. Install ecu and learn to tune and or have it tuned.
    Step two. Install injectors and retune.
    Step three. Install turbo parts and bits. get it running with out leaks. DO NOT DRIVE IT. Idling should be ok
    Step four. Retune car
    Step five enjoy

  22. #47
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    Brought the car to the shop to fix a few small things like a p/s leak,oil leaks, relocating coolant reservoir because I hate how it is now but still haven't nailed down this idle issue so far what I've checked

    Set the engine to TDC and performed smoke test starting at intake boot and found absolutely no leaks

    Tested coolant temp sensor (blue) for DME at roughly 68 degrees and found 1.xk ohms bentley says 2-2.9 so I replaced it with Bosch seems a little better now but after about 30 seconds or so it dies out

    Checked ICV again even though I just replaced it and verified it is working correctly

    I'm gonna check the Throttle position sensor, intake manifold air temp sensor, camshaft position sensor for faults and report back also ill try to get some pics of the coolant reservoir relocation

    I have a wideband but needed the replacement o2 sensor usps held it at the office and I just picked it up
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 04-25-2020 at 09:31 AM. Reason: usps is confusing

  23. #48
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    Ok got the wideband installed and found its choking itself with fuel but still couldn't figure out why

    pulled the plugs and of course soaked in fuel. I found this thread on bimmerfest about cylinder washing causing this kind of poor idling issue and it got me thinking that could help so I drained the oil and it reeked of gas did the oil change cleaned the plugs and put a small amount of oil in the combustion chambers cranked the engine with the fuel pump relay off first to coat the walls reinstalled plugs and relay. Started it up and it seemed to run a lot longer now even though it was smoking its ass off due to the oil I had put in. Now that it was running longer I was able to get out and go under the hood and I decided to pull the tps plug and boom it started idling great ! Ordered one for tomorrow so I'll install and check back with you all tomorrow. In the meantime here's my coolant reservoir made with some scrap metal laying around the shop



  24. #49
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    Is the expansion tank secured to the bracket or just laying in-place?

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Thomas View Post
    Is the expansion tank secured to the bracket or just laying in-place?
    So its just laying in place but I didn't want it to move around so I cut some small fuel hose in half and put it around the inner border of the bracket and seriously it doesn't move at all its actually a little hard to get out of the bracket if you tried to tug on it

    New update on the idle issue I installed the tps started it up and let run but after about a minute or two I noticed while I had it revved up around 2k (bleeding the coolant system) rpms would drop and check engine light comes on it will still idle but now if I rev it up and keep it at 2k or any rpm for that matter it will start to drop on its own while I have the accelerator in the same position so that's weird I'll keep trying to figure this out but I'm happy it is at least idling on its own. Working on getting fluids and stuff back in the car car needs a thermostat so should have another update tomorrow

    BTW I have a suspicion that my idle screw is not set properly does anyone know how to check this ? I know someone messed with this before and I have no idea how to set properly
    Last edited by SlumdogJay; 04-27-2020 at 04:37 PM.

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