1994 E34 525i Trans Program Message

**vinceinIL** · 02-28-2017, 04:08 PM

Hi....I looked through 8 or so pages and didn't see any recent posts about this...

I'm driving a '94 525i automatic as a daily beater, the car has 225k and some rust, but is otherwise fairly presentable and easy to fix.

A few days ago I stopped at a store, and when I got out to head home, the car was running in limp mode, with no up/down shifting and the Trans Program message came on. I limped it about 15 miles home. It continues to have the same problems even after sitting overnight. But it will usually shift from 1 to 2, but not into third, and it won't go into limp mode or show the TP message all the time.

I haven't checked codes yet with my Peake Reader, not sure how much help it will be (I had a 750iL once...). I've read a lot of the old info on E34.net, but it seems inconclusive. So I'm wondering if this is sounding more like a fluid issue (last changed about 70k miles ago), or a mechanical issue (solenoids, trans wear?) or an electrical issue? I'm planning to get into the car this weekend and would like to have a good idea of which angle to tackle first and what to have on hand.

Thanks!
Vince.

**shogun** · 02-28-2017, 04:55 PM

The Peake will not help for this. First of all check the transmission fluid level at the correct temperature http://www.europeantransmissions.com...MWtechinfo.htm

**vinceinIL** · 02-28-2017, 05:12 PM

Shogun! The same Shogun from the old E32 Forums.....what a surprise! Thank you for the tip, that's exactly the kind of info I was looking for.

Vince

**whiskychaser** · 02-28-2017, 05:53 PM

A couple of things to check:
Shift cable adjusted correctly
Dash display reflects gear/mode selected

What happens when you drop the lever back from D to 3 and try to set off?

**vinceinIL** · 02-28-2017, 06:13 PM

Whiskey, thanks for the questions. I will see what happens when I move the lever back from D to 3 tomorrow. Same with the dash display. When I have time this weekend and can work on the car I'll be able to check the cable adjustment

**whiskychaser** · 03-01-2017, 10:01 AM

You may find that in 3, it only changes up to 2 just as it does in D. If you find that the ATF level, cable adjustment and display are all fine, you will want to know if the problem is with the 3rd clutch itself or the control circuits. Ideally, you need to have the fault codes read. If you disconnect the TCM plug and manually select second gear, it actually engages third. If that works, you have a reasonable indication that the issue is not the clutch itself. I'd suggest it is more likely to be the 2-3 shift solenoid but let's not get ahead of ourselves

**95525ibob** · 03-01-2017, 11:15 AM

Drill a hole in it and put it in your boat for a anchor. Manual swap and super chip it.

**vinceinIL** · 03-02-2017, 12:15 AM

Whiskey, I checked the shift selector button, and the dash display correctly reflects gear/mode selected. Tomorrow I'll hopefully remember to see if the car takes off differently in D and 3.

**vinceinIL** · 03-02-2017, 12:22 AM

Only problem with that is that the car is not worth the extra effort, and I already have an E34 Touring with a manual swap, needing a new rear hard brake line. And for swap fun, I have an E39 Touring waiting for me to put another engine with a manual in it.

**BennyBMW** · 03-02-2017, 04:14 AM

Originally Posted by vinceinIL

Only problem with that is that the car is not worth the extra effort, and I already have an E34 Touring with a manual swap, needing a new rear hard brake line. And for swap fun, I have an E39 Touring waiting for me to put another engine with a manual in it.

Swap the tps from your E34 touring into this one and see if the problem resolves itself. Swap the dme relay as well. These are two key points from e34.net. They will only take 5 minutes to do.

And no this is not a fluid issue. And if your trans control unit is in the engine bay, it is easy to test the solenoids and sensors through the harness clamp if you need to check them. That can come after the tps and relay check.

**shogun** · 03-02-2017, 08:29 AM

Originally Posted by BennyBMW

Swap the tps from your E34 touring into this one and see if the problem resolves itself. Swap the dme relay as well. These are two key points from e34.net. They will only take 5 minutes to do. And no this is not a fluid issue. And if your trans control unit is in the engine bay, it is easy to test the solenoids and sensors through the harness clamp if you need to check them. That can come after the tps and relay check.

Can you explain to me why the DME relay should be changed? The engine is running.

**m735is** · 03-02-2017, 09:04 AM

Check battery voltage at rest and charging. If everything is OK, do a reset- remove battery cables and hook them together. I didn't even hook them together and it fixed my limp mode on my 92. If that doesn't work, then I would dig deeper.

**whiskychaser** · 03-02-2017, 09:26 AM

Originally Posted by m735is

Check battery voltage at rest and charging. If everything is OK, do a reset- remove battery cables and hook them together. I didn't even hook them together and it fixed my limp mode on my 92. If that doesn't work, then I would dig deeper.

Checking the battery/charging system is a good call. If the TCM gets less than 9v it will throw in the towel. As it doesn't do it all the time, it may be difficult to confirm without reading the TCM fault codes. Incidentally, the TCM will store a boat load of faults but unless they are current it will ignore them.

**vinceinIL** · 03-04-2017, 11:23 PM

Okay, here is the update so far....

Charging system is fine. I tried disconnecting the battery, but it made no difference. Connecting the cables together also made no difference. Cable seems to be adjusted okay, no sticking.

With the car up on jackstands and running in Park, I removed the fill plug and nothing came out. I could fill it with about half a quart of new Dexron before it started running out the fill plug hole. All put back together and back on the ground, I took the car for a drive. No difference, still not shifting into the upper gear. Also no difference shifting manually.

Tomorrow I'll see if I get any interesting readings with my code reader and try checking other electrical things mentioned..

Thanks for all the useful replies!

**whiskychaser** · 03-05-2017, 09:20 AM

Just for info, what happens if you put it in D and switch the mode to winter (M)?

**vinceinIL** · 03-05-2017, 10:19 AM

Hi Whiskey, thanks for asking. I did try that yesterday, too. Putting it in M makes no difference now and didn't before I added the fluid.

**whiskychaser** · 03-05-2017, 11:33 AM

Yep. That's about what I expected. FWIW, there are two solenoids which manage the change up from 2. One is the obviously the 2-3 shift solenoid and the other is 1-2/3-4 solenoid. The first one is powered down in 3rd and both are powered down in 4th. It could be that either is lazy or the valves they operate are gummed up. Now you could say 'how come I get 4th gear when it goes into trans prog then?' I'd suggest that may be because when it goes into that mode, the pressure regulator is powered down too so you get all the pressure the pump can muster. I'm not about to encourage you to go and spend your hard earned cash. I'd be keen to learn if the TCM fault codes support the theory

**vinceinIL** · 03-05-2017, 12:31 PM

That's an interesting point about Trans Program. I drove it around yesterday and it was clearly not functioning properly (not shifting up at 35-40 mph), but the Trans Program did not come up, and it started off regularly from a stop. I'll be checking the TCM codes this afternoon.

**vinceinIL** · 03-05-2017, 10:49 PM

The only code I get with the Peake reader is 45, a knock sensor fault. Soooo, time to figure out how to check the solenoids and the TPS and DME relays.

**whiskychaser** · 03-06-2017, 03:52 AM

Unless the knock sensor fault is current, you can ignore it. You are going to have a problem finding a fault with the TPS and DME relays because your Peake reader says there are none. As Shogun says above, the Peake will not read the TCM fault code memory. It is possible but a bit unlikely that the TCM is not receiving the TPS signal from the DME. But you need to read the TCM fault code memory to confirm this or any other fault. (You would probably find code 11).

Ohms reading I have for solenoids etc are below. The difference in ohm in values is for cold to hot:
1-2/3-4, 2-3 shift and TC lock up solenoids: 14-22 ohms
Band: 6-20 ohms
Pressure reg : 2-6 ohms
Temp sensor is 25k at 75 deg F

TCM socket pins (refer to EWD):

48,43 and 38 are shift valves and TC solenoids. Connect meter between the appropriate pin and ground at pin 54
45 is band. Connect meter between this pin and ground at pin 54
40 and 41 are for pressure regulator
22 and 17 are for temp sensor

The pin numbers are usually stamped in the TCM socket. Worth remembering that you will be looking at a mirror image as you will be testing at the holes in the plug.

**vinceinIL** · 03-10-2017, 08:47 PM

Okay, update time...... I switched the TPS sensor with a known good one from another car. No difference. I then switched the DME relay with a known good one from another car, and again, no difference.

Thank you Whiskey for the Ohm Reading info for the solenoids. Now I need to find and figure out which pins to check on the solenoid connectors and the transmission computer connector.

**shogun** · 03-10-2017, 08:56 PM

whiskychaser will probably have the data, I only have for ZF transmisssions.

**whiskychaser** · 03-11-2017, 10:36 AM

Amended post above so you have readings and pinouts in one place. HTH

**locknload** · 03-11-2017, 09:03 PM

Do you still have the TCM from the touring? That would be a simple swap and is what I did to rid myself of an intermittent limp. Pretty sure the replacement TCM would need to be same year or newer though.

Something else easy to check, but may not be applicable. Put a meter on the kickdown switch and make sure it isn't shorted and functions properly.

**vinceinIL** · 03-14-2017, 07:32 PM

First, many thanks for all the replies and info. I've finally been able to read through all the very helpful and interesting PDFs, and today I checked the Ohms at the pins of the TCM installed in the car (uh oh, should I have been testing at the holes in the plug? If so, I'll do it tomorrow). Engine still warm from driving, but cooling off. Ignition off, no key in switch. Using the Ohms side of the digital tester, at the 2000k scale, Black probe went to ground at pin 54, Red probe was used at the following pins:

Pin 48 - 46
Pin 43 - 26
Pin 38 - 20

Pin 45 - 1 (no reading)

Pin 40 - 26
Pin 41 - 1 (no reading)

Pin 22 - 27
Pin 17 - 1 (no reading)

I checked each pin with no reading more than once in case I was missing something.

So, let me know if I should have been testing at the plug, or I've done anything else wrong.

Thanks again for taking me on this journey though the unknown.

Vince