E36 LSX - dry sump roll call - would like your input

[Demon Speed]

I'm rebuilding my LS2 engine due to oil starvation/cavitation and failed lifter.
I was running a hybrid dry sump system, factory pump for pressure and 2 stage external scavenge pump.
Oil pressure would fall off by ~20psi at higher rpm's above 6k. I suspect cavitation but was not able to determine root cause prior to pulling the motor out (lifter broke).

If you are running a dry sump could you tell about you set up. Include part numbers, specs or any detailed info you have. See below.

System type: hybrid or all external pump?
If hybrid what pressure pump, GM model#, Melling or other? ported or non ported?
Oil pump feed line size
Oil tank location
Oil weight
RPM limit
Oil pressure at idle
Oil pressure at 6400rpm

If you have pictures to share even better.

I'll update this post later today with all my system specs/part numbers and planned changes. I'm planning to relocate the oil tank from the trunk to engine bay. Also changing to Melling pump.

[OKsweetrides]

Call ARE or aviaid; they are one of the best for LSx dry sump kits. I've had a 4 stage kit + 3 gallon tank in trunk installed on my race car (C5Z) for going on 10+ years. You'll need a pinned crank as well. The scavenge pump fits nicely where the AC compressor would mount. The lines can be tucked up real close to the block for easy routing. I've destroyed 2 pans from con rods pogosticking, but easy repair and replace. Gary knows his stuff.

Lines: Depends on where you mount tank, and how you want them run. I ran aeroquip with aluminum fittings, and thermal protected all hoses where exposed to header heat.

Mount the tank in rear, and since it's hot oil, you can isolate it as well in a box. If you make a firewall'd connection underneath the tank, you can allow for easy oil draining. Make sure you dump your vent can from time to time, it'll build up nasty congealed oil.

Oil: Mobil1 Racing 0-30 is fine.
Pressures: I'm about 60psi after 6K rpm, even at sustained 1.3+g's.
Idle when cold: 50psi, idle when hot is low 30's, and when really hot, 20's. My oil get's bubbly and frothy when cold, similar to coffee, til it's warmed up enough. I don't run an additional pressure pump, stock style for mine.

You can have a secondary switch setup that will simply crank the starter without waking up the PCM and allow the system to prime vs just turn-n-go like a stock setup.

edit: what hybrid were you running before? A LS7 setup?

[Demon Speed]

Call ARE or aviaid; they are one of the best for LSx dry sump kits. I've had a 4 stage kit + 3 gallon tank in trunk installed on my race car (C5Z) for going on 10+ years. You'll need a pinned crank as well. The scavenge pump fits nicely where the AC compressor would mount. The lines can be tucked up real close to the block for easy routing. I've destroyed 2 pans from con rods pogosticking, but easy repair and replace. Gary knows his stuff.

Lines: Depends on where you mount tank, and how you want them run. I ran aeroquip with aluminum fittings, and thermal protected all hoses where exposed to header heat.

Mount the tank in rear, and since it's hot oil, you can isolate it as well in a box. If you make a firewall'd connection underneath the tank, you can allow for easy oil draining. Make sure you dump your vent can from time to time, it'll build up nasty congealed oil.

Oil: Mobil1 Racing 0-30 is fine.
Pressures: I'm about 60psi after 6K rpm, even at sustained 1.3+g's.
Idle when cold: 50psi, idle when hot is low 30's, and when really hot, 20's. My oil get's bubbly and frothy when cold, similar to coffee, til it's warmed up enough. I don't run an additional pressure pump, stock style for mine.

You can have a secondary switch setup that will simply crank the starter without waking up the PCM and allow the system to prime vs just turn-n-go like a stock setup.

edit: what hybrid were you running before? A LS7 setup?

I was running the Aviad LS-B system. I was also running 20w-50 oil which I suspect could have caused or exasperated
the cavitation problem. My oil tank was in the trunk, -16 feed line. Crank pulley was pinned.

I'll to add all my specs to the first post.
.Screenshot_2017-02-22-09-33-01.png

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[OKsweetrides]

Your oil weight should be find if your running loose tolerances. Feed line is good sized, it's either aeration or cavitation. If your having significant pressure drop off, then going with the melling is a good choice to flood with oil volume and that'll compensate for lack of lubricity.

Have you looked into a spintric air/oil seperator? That should help cut down on the bubbling to a large degree in the return to tank. That'll help calm down the frothiness; I have to have my oil nice and toasty for it have a significant decrease in aeration.

I'm almost thinking that your scavenged oil is highly aerated then doubly compounded by reduced high rpm flow.

edit: lifter failure is not uncommon with LSx's. How are your main bearings looking? Those would be the first indicator of oil starvation based failure.

Either way, to your original question, your pressure decrease can be assisted by an oil/air seperator and a higher volume high-rpm friendly pump.

[Maynor]

I posted a thread on here a while ago with my setup including pics. Don't have time to find the link but its not hard to search for.

In short, I'm running an ARE setup using the stock internal pump. 55 psi at idle. 100 - 120 psi at redline. Way too high but I haven't had a chance to figure out why and correct. Oil pressure is damn hot so I change it pretty often.

It's strictly a race car so the motor spends all its time above 4,000 rpm unless I'm staging. Been running this setup since 2010. First on a 416 ci LS2 and currently on a stock LS3. Can't remember why the LS2 let go but it was not oil pressure related.

[Demon Speed]

Your oil weight should be find if your running loose tolerances. Feed line is good sized, it's either aeration or cavitation. If your having significant pressure drop off, then going with the melling is a good choice to flood with oil volume and that'll compensate for lack of lubricity.

Have you looked into a spintric air/oil seperator? That should help cut down on the bubbling to a large degree in the return to tank. That'll help calm down the frothiness; I have to have my oil nice and toasty for it have a significant decrease in aeration.

I'm almost thinking that your scavenged oil is highly aerated then doubly compounded by reduced high rpm flow.

edit: lifter failure is not uncommon with LSx's. How are your main bearings looking? Those would be the first indicator of oil starvation based failure.

Either way, to your original question, your pressure decrease can be assisted by an oil/air seperator and a higher volume high-rpm friendly pump.

I was not running an air/oil separator. I'm trying were I saved/wrote down the clearance specs but I believe they were not specifically set up "loose".
The lifters were Comp Cams short travel race lifters. I pretty sure the valve springs were not stiff enough for the cam ramp profile I was running. I should have that issue resolved with the new build though.

The mains were scuffed up pretty good for only 2500 miles. I'll post some pics of them tonight.

[Demon Speed]

I posted a thread on here a while ago with my setup including pics. Don't have time to find the link but its not hard to search for.

In short, I'm running an ARE setup using the stock internal pump. 55 psi at idle. 100 - 120 psi at redline. Way too high but I haven't had a chance to figure out why and correct. Oil pressure is damn hot so I change it pretty often.

It's strictly a race car so the motor spends all its time above 4,000 rpm unless I'm staging. Been running this setup since 2010. First on a 416 ci LS2 and currently on a stock LS3. Can't remember why the LS2 let go but it was not oil pressure related.

I did read all your post about your set up and I believe we talked before about it.

Specifically what internal oil pump are you running? Stock, stock ported inlet, etc or Melling std or high pressure/volume.

What oil weight are you running?

I saw your tank is in your trunk too so that shouldn't be my problem.

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[Maynor]

Running stock LS3 pump. 20W-50 oil.

[Maynor]

By the way, if you're not exceeding 6500 rpm, I doubt cavitation is your issue. Just the same, it would interesting to see if you have a kinked o-ring on the oil pump inlet tube. Check that when disassembling