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Thread: Chikinhed's Mini Build

  1. #376
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    That is true if he always wants to run 25 psi. I know I don't. I had an 8374 with just a 45mm external gate on the twinscroll steed before and had uncontrollable boost and was not happy -- with a 5 psi spring I had 23 psi by 6000 and it was still climbing. 9180 should be better but no one knows by how much on this ts mani. Maybe if the mani was modded for a 60mm wg, boost could be regulated a little better on an efr 8374 or 9180.

  2. #377
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    95 M3, 03 E55, 07 335I
    How about 8374 dual gate, is t available?
    Old set up: 520RWHP & 500RWTQ @ 20PSI 1/4 mile as of 7/26/15 12.5 @ 125MPH - 19PSI
    New set up: Steedspeed Twinscroll, Wiseco Pistons 8.8:1 CR, K1 Rods, Blueprinted and Balanced, ARP Main Studs, o-ring block, GTR 12mm head studs, GT35R with 86mm HTA billet compressor wheel (GT3586RHTA) TwinScrol 1.06 exhaust housing, Nick G custom tuning, 6 Speed Transmission, UUC Twin Disc Clutch, UUC EVO III, UUC DSSR 109mm, EVO 6 Speed Driveshaft, HFS-6 W/M injection, Zeitronix data logger, 3" SS full exhaust, Rallyroad strut bar, X brace, Race coilovers.

  3. #378
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    Sure. 0.92 IWG 8374 plus ewg on ts steed. But instead of buying new 0.92 IWG 8374 housing to replace 1.05 EWG 8374 housing, I bought 0.92 IWG 9180 and run it with EWG on TS steed because response is still very good with 9180 and it should make 700 rwhp on 93 pump plus meth.

  4. #379
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matutino View Post
    You had me at hello...
    No problemo.

    if one valve is latent or one is early make sure the signal (pilot) pressure out of the T is equidistant to the WG and routed like you are building a low resistance exhaust system. Within the limitations of what you can do though. If you cant avoid a restriction on one add it to the other.

  5. #380
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    Twin turbo LS E36 M3
    Even if he ran the external gate only for just testing
    328i Sedan Twin s366's, 6.0LS, TH400, MS3 Ultimate
    9.20 at 150 on 22psi

  6. #381
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    Quote Originally Posted by dburt86 View Post
    Even if he ran the external gate only for just testing
    Then he would be 25+ psi with no options to run lower.
    1996 332IS
    Built 3.2
    CES/Steed TS Precision 6466, spraying a "$π!℅" load of meth.
    Technique Tuning 80# tune.
    1/4 mile 10.84 @ 136.72
    Your 1 and only stop for all your BMW performance needs
    WWW.CESMOTORSPORT.COM

  7. #382
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    Twin turbo LS E36 M3
    But if it doesnt taper, then he knows its the IWG and not something else
    328i Sedan Twin s366's, 6.0LS, TH400, MS3 Ultimate
    9.20 at 150 on 22psi

  8. #383
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    Quote Originally Posted by dburt86 View Post
    But if it doesnt taper, then he knows its the IWG and not something else
    Without both gates, he will be at min of 25psi. At all times. Yes, I agree, he could easily disconnect the IWG and try it.
    1996 332IS
    Built 3.2
    CES/Steed TS Precision 6466, spraying a "$π!℅" load of meth.
    Technique Tuning 80# tune.
    1/4 mile 10.84 @ 136.72
    Your 1 and only stop for all your BMW performance needs
    WWW.CESMOTORSPORT.COM

  9. #384
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    Problem could be EWG or IWG. Either one could be the issue. We are using the better Turbosmart actuator for the IWG. There have been issues with the stock one.

  10. #385
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    I get that, but thats speculation at this point. Alot of factors go into creep and i doubt his and Phils car are identical.

    But evenif they are and even if he did 1 3rd gear pull with just the tial, he would know right away if the IWG was the cause of his taper issue.

    - - - Updated - - -

    So is there only 1 boost control solenoid operating both the IWG and EWG?
    328i Sedan Twin s366's, 6.0LS, TH400, MS3 Ultimate
    9.20 at 150 on 22psi

  11. #386
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    Our cars are pretty close -- both built S52 with Schricks, 3.5 exhaust, 0.92 IWG EFR9180 with TS IWG actuator and TS45 EWG. Difference is he has an AMS boost controller and I have an Eboost2. Also, I have not gone as high as chikinhed yet on the boost so we do not yet know whether I will have the same problem.

    From the diagram he sent me, he is using only 1 mac valve. I am also using only one mac valve. Chikinhed is using both ports on both actuators, whereas I am venting the top port on the EWG and the bottom port on the IWG to atmosphere (this is correct -- EWG and IWG actuator ports differ). I know the mac valve can be used differently, and have the eboost2 instructions and know how I am doing it and what the options are, but do not know who the AMS works or the options for setting it up.

    Certainly isolating one is a good way to test the other. The 9180 is not out of steam at 25 psi on a 3.2L I6. People have made over 800 rwhp out of the 0.92 IWG 9180.

    My first thought was that the single mac valve may not pass enough air to pressurize 2 actuator ports sufficiently, but my eboost2 instructions show a single mac valve being used on twin turbo cars to control 2 wastegates via a tee fitting.

  12. #387
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    The AMS-500 uses two control solenoid valves as 'increase solenoid' and 'decrease solenoid'.

    Being that the system is a closed system (aside from the waste gate diaphragm movement) the valves should provide enough volume to control the WGs. A leak such as a torn WG diaphragm could cause this issue as well.

    My plan is to apply pressure to the IWG to see what pressure it opens at. It's an attempt to not remove the IWG if I can as it's not in the most convenient location. The EWG will get removed and springs checked as well as checked to see what pressure it opens at.
    '97 M3, Estoril blue, 2 dr, euro 6-spd, EFR 9180 divided T4 .92 IWG, RK tuning, CP 8.5:1 pistons, Eagle rods, Schrick cams, L19 11 mm ARP studs, O-ringed block, Supertech stainless/inconel valves, Supertech springs & Ti retainers, ported head, S54 oil pump/pan, 80 lb. injectors, OBD1 intake manifold, Steedspeed twin scroll T4, 3.5" SS exhaust, eBoost2 EBC, HFS-4 W/M injection, AEM Failsafe, Zeitronix data logger, Racelogic TC, OpenOBC w. ethanol %, Ireland Eng. engine mounts, UUC black tranny mounts w. enforcers, UUC twin disc feramic, ARC-8's, MCS 2-ways, Z3 rack, Rallyroad strut bar, X brace, Eibach sway bars, Ground Control LCAB bushings, Bimmerworld RTAB's, Powerflex subframe bushings, 210 4-clutch LSD, Stoptech BBK, titainium shims, steel braided lines, brake cooling ducts.

  13. #388
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    I originally thought that because each gate would require different amounts of DC to achieve a certain boost, that it wouldnt work, but thinking about it more, the system should be essentially averaging what each of them needed and adding DC as boost is tapering off.

    Can you see if the controller is adding DC as the boost is falling? Like its trying to maintain target
    328i Sedan Twin s366's, 6.0LS, TH400, MS3 Ultimate
    9.20 at 150 on 22psi

  14. #389
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    Could the flow of air to the WG be less with the Tee'd lines from the solenoid? Meaning the springs will yield sooner and you cannot go as far past rated spring pressure with the boost controller as you might otherwise? This is probably engineering, maybe fluid dynamics, and I was an english major. But normally you can go to about double spring pressure with a good electronic boost controller. Maybe with the dual wastegate fed through one mac valve (even if it returns through a second mac valve), you can go to only 1.5x spring pressure.

  15. #390
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    2 gates typically work fine with 1 solenoid. My car is setup like this and it works great. Ive seen 24lbs on a 8psi spring. But its all in how you have it plumbed.

    Im willing to bet that its probably something to do with the IWG preload/adjustment
    328i Sedan Twin s366's, 6.0LS, TH400, MS3 Ultimate
    9.20 at 150 on 22psi

  16. #391
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    I've set the preload per Turbosmarts instruction and double checked it just to be OCD. In the EFR instructions they say that not enough preload will cause low boost control issues. I'm still thinking that it's a wrong spring issue, I just haven't had the time to check yet. I may have a window of time tonight if I don't fall asleep first.
    '97 M3, Estoril blue, 2 dr, euro 6-spd, EFR 9180 divided T4 .92 IWG, RK tuning, CP 8.5:1 pistons, Eagle rods, Schrick cams, L19 11 mm ARP studs, O-ringed block, Supertech stainless/inconel valves, Supertech springs & Ti retainers, ported head, S54 oil pump/pan, 80 lb. injectors, OBD1 intake manifold, Steedspeed twin scroll T4, 3.5" SS exhaust, eBoost2 EBC, HFS-4 W/M injection, AEM Failsafe, Zeitronix data logger, Racelogic TC, OpenOBC w. ethanol %, Ireland Eng. engine mounts, UUC black tranny mounts w. enforcers, UUC twin disc feramic, ARC-8's, MCS 2-ways, Z3 rack, Rallyroad strut bar, X brace, Eibach sway bars, Ground Control LCAB bushings, Bimmerworld RTAB's, Powerflex subframe bushings, 210 4-clutch LSD, Stoptech BBK, titainium shims, steel braided lines, brake cooling ducts.

  17. #392
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    Quote Originally Posted by chikinhed View Post
    I've set the preload per Turbosmarts instruction and double checked it just to be OCD. In the EFR instructions they say that not enough preload will cause low boost control issues. I'm still thinking that it's a wrong spring issue, I just haven't had the time to check yet. I may have a window of time tonight if I don't fall asleep first.
    Wondering if you have had a chance to test drive it yet... need your input re EFR9180.
    Im debating the following ones:
    EFR 9180
    EFR 8374
    GTW 6265
    Precision 6466
    Old set up: 520RWHP & 500RWTQ @ 20PSI 1/4 mile as of 7/26/15 12.5 @ 125MPH - 19PSI
    New set up: Steedspeed Twinscroll, Wiseco Pistons 8.8:1 CR, K1 Rods, Blueprinted and Balanced, ARP Main Studs, o-ring block, GTR 12mm head studs, GT35R with 86mm HTA billet compressor wheel (GT3586RHTA) TwinScrol 1.06 exhaust housing, Nick G custom tuning, 6 Speed Transmission, UUC Twin Disc Clutch, UUC EVO III, UUC DSSR 109mm, EVO 6 Speed Driveshaft, HFS-6 W/M injection, Zeitronix data logger, 3" SS full exhaust, Rallyroad strut bar, X brace, Race coilovers.

  18. #393
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    Quote Originally Posted by Butters Stoch View Post
    Without both gates, he will be at min of 25psi. At all times. Yes, I agree, he could easily disconnect the IWG and try it.
    What ever happened with your testing of Tial vs TS? Did you figure out if the Tial works better?

    Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

  19. #394
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    Yes, tial mvr44 works better. Butters posted picture of valve opening further. But still not enough to get low boost with responsive turbo on TS steed. I think jgs 50 might be good choice if you cut SAP tray and relocate ac lines; supposedly it fits a 44mm flange.

  20. #395
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
    Yes, tial mvr44 works better. Butters posted picture of valve opening further. But still not enough to get low boost with responsive turbo on TS steed. I think jgs 50 might be good choice if you cut SAP tray and relocate ac lines; supposedly it fits a 44mm flange.
    I meant more like a back to back comparison installed on the manifold.

    I know he posted a pic of the valve lift, but want to know if that truly equates to pressure control

    Sent from my SM-T707V using Tapatalk

  21. #396
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    He also tested back to back on the same manifold same turbo and got less creep with the tial, but I don't recall the exact numbers and am not sure how low he can get.

  22. #397
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    96 332IS 6466 turbo
    With the turbosmart in 4th and 5th gear boost shot right up to 20# + on a 11# spring.
    With the Tial it holds 12# for a good bit then will slowly creep up but nothing like the turbosmart. With the Tial gears 1-3 pretty much hold what you want. Where the turbosmart in 1-3 would shoot up as well. The turbo smart is a pos compared to the Tial. I really like turbo smart products, but the Tial is way better.
    1996 332IS
    Built 3.2
    CES/Steed TS Precision 6466, spraying a "$π!℅" load of meth.
    Technique Tuning 80# tune.
    1/4 mile 10.84 @ 136.72
    Your 1 and only stop for all your BMW performance needs
    WWW.CESMOTORSPORT.COM

  23. #398
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    So I just got my Steed 8374 IWG setup running and this is what I have so far..

    I have the turbosmart external gate Teed to the turbosmart internal gate only, no boost controller.

    The internal gate has a 14 spring and apparently the external gate has a 7 (the box said 14, but the guy I bought it from told me 7, so I guess he put the 7 spring in while i was assuming he was mistaken). I intended to have them both at 14 psi, but now I have two mismatched wastegates.

    The car hits about 10 psi and it tapers down to 7 as RPM increases. It runs awesome and feels plenty fast for me and I stupidly actually competed in a hillclimb this weekend with it even before I ensured the AFRs were 100% correct. It leans out approaching 6k then richens back up, but I cant seem to get some good data, so I guess I just need to go to the dyno to do it properly.
    96 328i ITR Racecar
    95 M3 blk/blk - hillclimb project - http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1798796 - Retired to street duty after two awesome seasons!
    2002 325XiT - daily


  24. #399
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    At least you have the wrong spring in the gate that is easier to change.

  25. #400
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    Lol, yeah im pretty sure i have to pull the motor to get to the iwg spring


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    96 328i ITR Racecar
    95 M3 blk/blk - hillclimb project - http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1798796 - Retired to street duty after two awesome seasons!
    2002 325XiT - daily


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