E30 Cracked Dash Restoration and Pocket Delete

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-06-2016, 12:55 PM

Being that my computer skills are rather dismal I accidentally started this thread in the E21 sub-forum and after a few PMs I was not able to find an E21 moderator to move it here. I followed suggestions to just copy that thread and start it here in the correct place. The only way I knew to do that was to copy the entire thread and paste it here. I removed the replies to the thread from the other forum to clean it up a bit.

E30 Cracked Dash Restoration and Pocket Delete
This is an offshoot of a build thread started by my son, E34DIYer, about a restoration on my car, titled "1991 325ic Restoration + engine swap." I did start the project with a '91 but found a better '89 325iC which that thread is about.

This will come as a real shock to most of you but E30 dashes have a tendency to crack as they age. Mine was better than most, with only a small crack on the passenger side which I repaired; however, you can still tell where it was. That led me to a determination to figure a way to make a good permanent repair. A new replacement dash was out of the question, as they have just now gone back in to production and are selling for around a grand!

I found a structurally sound but badly cracked dash to experiment with and while examining it I came up with another insane idea.....delete the dash pocket on the passenger side! I really don't care for it much as it is a catch-all for junk and dirt, and if a crack does pop up in there it is harder to repair.

First, a little about the dash itself. Everything I state is from my own personal observation so if anyone sees an error I welcome corrections. The dash seems to be made of a stamped metal frame covered on both sides by a fairly thin layer of dense foam. It is then covered with a thin layer of vinyl-like material. I do know that the covering is not some type of material that is glued to the foam, rather it is bonded directly to the foam so I assume that it is a sprayed on to form a vinyl-like coating. Apparently the foam substrate starts shrinking due to age and UV exposure while the outer layer becomes brittle. This is the source of the cracking. I did not take a picture of the complete dash but here are a couple of photos of some of the damage.

The first step is to make a fairly deep V groove in in the crack from end to end. Bevel the edges of the groove all around so nothing is sticking up. For the larger open damage clean out the center and bevel the edges. A Dremel tool with a coarse sanding drum attachment works great for this.

Now it is time to fill in the cracks. I started with a filler called Polyvance Padded Dash Filler. It looks like, smells like and works like Bondo Body Filler but I am hoping it might have a little elasticity since it is supposed to be formulated for padded dashes. It sets fast so it is best to mix it in small batches. For me I liked using about a teaspoon full at a time. Like Bondo you mix a catalyst with the compound to activate it. Follow the directions on the can and extrapolate down for smaller amounts. I used the T.L.A.R. measuring system. (That Looks About Right )

.

Fill in the grooves with the first coat and feather it thin past the edges (unless you enjoy hand-sanding body filler).

I used 100 grit sandpaper for the initial sanding on the filler. I also sanded the entire dash to remove any sheen and prep it for an undercoat. After sanding the repaired spots I applied a thin second coat and smoothed it out with a small plastic putty knife. Final sanding and feathering was done with 220 grit sandpaper. On a couple of the last cracks I repaired I used fiberglass and resin as the first filler. It seemed to me like the resin might soak in to the foam substrate better, and it seemed to work very well.

First I grooved out the cracks. Then I packed fiberglass matting in the groove, after which I filled the groove with resin.

When you pack the fiberglass in the groove you don't need to worry about a few strands of fiberglass sticking up. They will sand off quite easily when the resin sets. Next you use the Polyvance filler on top of the fiberlass to finish the repair.

One of the cracks ran at an angle across the ridge in the dash so I had to rebuild it where I made my groove. I used some wooden sticks that look like tongue depressors that I got in the crafts section at Wally World to sculpt the proper lines in the filler. It took a little sanding but I think it worked out OK.

Sneak peak at the repair above.

Now comes the fun part. Remember my crazy idea to delete the dash pocket? Well, here goes.

I really wanted to get rid of this...

So I started out by making a pattern using masking tape.

Then I cut out a thin piece of birch plywood as a filler plate. I trimmed the plate to fit the dash pocket and made a couple of supports to go under the plate to tie it to the dash.

I screwed the supports in place from the underside of the dash. Then I put glue on top of the supports and placed the filler plate in position with a weight to hold it in place while the glue dried.

After the glue dried and I was satisfied with the alignment I secured the edges of the filler plate to the dash with 2-part epoxy followed by a coat of Polyvance filler to start blending in the edges of the filler plate with the dash.

After that it was just a matter of sanding and filling until I was satisfied with a smooth transition from the filler plate to the dash. I was able to run my hand across the area and not feel any change in the surface all the way across.

After all the damaged areas are repaired and prepped I sanded the entire dash with 220 grit sandpaper. I used acetone to wipe everything down. It works great but will start dissolving the old dash if you rub too much for too long.

I probably could have applied the final finishing to the dash as it was but I wanted to completely coat it with a flexible base coat first. One of my options to finish the dash was a process called flocking. This is done by coating the dash with a thick coating of a flexible adhesive made just for that purpose. While the adhesive is still wet a coating of finely ground nylon fibers is sprayed onto the adhesive with an air gun or hand air pump. After the adhesive dries the excess material just brushes off and you end up with a soft suede-like finish. I bought a kit to experiment with and the finish was very nice but I decided against it because I was concerned that all kinds of dust particles would stick to the soft finish. I did, however, decide to use the adhesive in the kit as a base coat for my dash.

The adhesive I used is in the middle in the picture above. On the left is SEM Texture Coat which I did use, and the stuff on the right is a wall texture from Home Depot that I experimented with to see what textures I could create.

Flocking kits come in different colors with the adhesive and coating material in matching colors. Obviously I chose black, and is it ever just that! This is what it looks like after being applied with a brush.

Slick as glass! I think it made a good base coat because it is flexible and thick but it has to be roughed up and dulled down for the finishing coats. Back to sanding again. This project requires much patience. Anyway, after sanding everything to kill the gloss I applied the texture coat. I used the SEM Texture Coating which, like most products by SEM, seems to be good stuff. Many pro shops recommend their products. This coat is not a finish coat. Its sole purpose is to give the surface a texture. As such it will fill in and hide many small imperfections.

You can control the texture by holding the can further away from the surface for a coarser texture. I was holding it about two feet away for my finish. I found that it worked best for me to shoot it in short bursts. This stuff dries in seconds. I highly recommend practicing on a piece of scrap until you figure out what texture you like. It is really quite easy. One good thing is that you can come back later and touch up without having dry spots where they overlap. The next step is to apply a finish coat to your liking. I chose DupliColor Vinyl and Fabric Spray which is very flexible and made for automotive applications.

Here are the results so far:

I am now at the point of trying to decide whether or not to clear coat the finish, mainly to make it easier to clean. If I do clear coat it I plan to use a matte finish. I will be making some test samples on some scrap soon to decide. The glove box door and center consoles will need to be finished to match, but that should be an easy project.

I experimented with different products to see what textures I could come up with. Some of the results are:

The scratches on some of the samples are from where I was testing the durability by deliberately making scratches with an object. The three products that I chose as the final finish are the DonJer Suede-Tex Undercoat Adhesive, the SEM Texture Coating, and the DupliColor Vinyl and Fabric Coating. The Homax Wall Texture from Home Depot looked like it might have some possibilities but it goes on with a white, chalky texture and shows up easily if the top coat is scratched. The other three products are all black and hide scratches very well.
Last edited by JimBobs 91E30; Today at 01:24 AM.

erday, 01:56 PM
I had a suggestion to fill the empty cavity beneath the filler plate with Great Foam sealant to add more support and adhesion to the filler plate. That sounded like a good idea so I gave it a try. First I drilled four 5/16" holes across the underside of the dash pocket. I wanted the holes to be big enough to let the GS escape. Then I started filling the holes until foam started backing out. If you have ever used this nasty stuff before I am sure you know the magic words....latex gloves and acetone. I have seen this stuff move pvc pipe around as it cured so I wanted to make sure there was not too much pressure inside the cavity as it cured.
It would have made a good video because that stuff just kept coming out. I kept cleaning it off and it still kept coming out! 15 minutes later it is still oozing out! I think it is about done but it takes about 8 hours to fully cure.

It doesn't have that hollow sound anymore when you thump on top of the dash.
day, 11:06 AM

**kalib0y** · 12-06-2016, 01:55 PM

neat project

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-06-2016, 09:28 PM

The Great Stuff idea turned out to be a terrible idea!

It sounded good but, as I feared, the expanding foam created enough pressure to cause the filler plate to bow outward even with the holes I drilled beneath the dash, although there was only one small area of separation along the rear of the filler plate. The only option I had was to remove the filler plate and make a new one.

It turned out to be not all bad, though. It gave me the opportunity to see how strong the filler plate mod was. It was a bear to remove it! I wont go into all the details but it was really in there. It was more than strong enough without needing foam beneath it.

It also gave me the opportunity to try another approach that I had wished I had done to begin with. First I cut out another filler plate, sealed it in with epoxy, and then some body filler, just like I did the first time.

I had thought about covering the plate with fiberglass the first time so I decided to go that route now. I cut out a fiberglass cloth mat to cover the filler plate and overlap the edges.

Then I mixed up some resin and coated the mat and surrounding edges.

Tomorrow I will sand out this layer, trim the edges, and see if it needs another coat of resin. Then it is just a matter of leveling everything out with body filler and putting the texture coat and vinyl coat on. Since the rest of the dash is finished this should go fairly quick. I made some thick test strips of the Polyvance Padded Dash Filler and the Bondo Body Filler to compare them. They seem to be about identical in texture, strength, and amount of flex they will withstand before cracking and they sand and finish out the same, so I am going with the Bondo. I can get it at Wally World or the parts stores whereas I have to order the Polyvance, which also is more expensive.

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-08-2016, 09:04 PM

Well, I now have plenty of experience filling and sanding this dash so at least things are going much faster now. It only took me about three hours total to replace the filler plate with a new one and blend it in with filler.

Today I lightly sanded the first coat and then re-sprayed the SEM Texture Coating followed up by several coats of Duplicolor Vinyl and Fabric Coating (flat black) and finally I topped everything with several coats of SEM Low Luster Clear. I am pleased at how it turned out so far. I plan to let it sit a couple of days and harden before I test it for durability. I have a couple of samples I made at the same time for the "scratch" test.

No more dash pocket!

I guess I am my own worse critic but I kinda like the dash pocket delete idea. I wish I could recreate the original grain pattern but the texture coat finish ain't bad, just not original. Of course, neither is the dash pocket delete. Obviously this is not for the purist who wants a 100% original car but what about you who are into mods and upgrades? Any comments and criticisms are welcome and appreciated.

**Kershaw** · 12-08-2016, 10:24 PM

If you want a more OEM finish you could always wrap it in leather, lol.

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-09-2016, 01:11 AM

I have heard a little about the spray-on wraps that people have their cars done in and later they can peel them off if they want to change. Is there some type of wrap that looks like leather that can be sprayed on available? If so I wonder how durable it would be, especially if it could be peeled off? The type of finish I am using should be flexible and yet very durable because both the adhesive base coat and the final vinyl coat are flexible and designed exactly for the purpose for which I am using them.

OK, I realize your post was tongue-in-cheek, but I actually did a little research into the wrap business. I see that it is not actually a spray-on product but more of a big decal and for the most part it has a life expectancy of one to five years, so that is out. At least I have educated myself a little more about wrapping, as opposed to rapping.

**tomstin** · 12-09-2016, 08:16 AM

Thanks for pulling this together...no easy task to take the time to document. I've been trying to decide what to do with my dash. Its a real mess, but I'm afraid if I spend the money on a used crack free dash, what are the odds of it cracking in a year or so as they are all 30+ years old?

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-09-2016, 09:46 AM

That's right! I am thinking that if I restore a cracked dash maybe a lot of the stress caused by shrinkage will have been relieved and by coating it in flexible materials will prevent future ones. Today I am going to pick up a really super ugly dash that was donated to me for another experiment. I plan to carefully document that one from start to finish to show what really can be done.

BTW, new dashboards are now back in production , either by or authorized by BMW. You can be the proud owner of one of those for around a thousand bucks!

**franan** · 12-09-2016, 12:29 PM

Well done excellent.

- - - Updated - - -

Well done excellent.

2012 535i 6 speed
2009 X5 Diesel
2001 530i 5 speed
1986 325es 5 speed

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-10-2016, 02:16 PM

After drying and curing a couple of days the dash still looks great to me and seems like the finish is going to be quite durable. E34DIYer has a badly cracked dash in his E30 325ix so I think we are going to swap this dash in in and I can experiment on his old one. The filler plate mod is a big deal to me but I have not received many comments yet. I might try to do a poll soon.

After all of my experimentation on dash repair and refinishing I have narrowed it down into about six basic steps which work best for me.

1. Prep - Clean the dash thoroughly with a good degreasing cleaner followed by wipe down with acetone and then sanding completely with 100 grit sandpaper.

2. Crack repair - Groove out and bevel the cracks and fill the deeper ones with fiberglass packing with resin fill-in. Finish the crack repairs with a filler like Polyvance Padded Dash Filler, although I personally think Bondo type body filler works as well. Sand, blend and feather. If you are going to do the dash pocket filler mod, now is the time to do that.

3. Base coat - Brush on a self-leveling elastic adhesive coating, such as Suede-Tex and allow to thoroughly dry at least three days. Sand off the high gloss sheen with 220 grit sandpaper.

4. Apply SEM Texture Coating to create the texture desired. It dries very fast and can be sanded and touched up easily if needed.

5. Apply an elastic color top coat, like flat black Duplicolor Vinyl and Fabric Coating.

6. Finish with SEM low-luster clear coat.

I am still up on the dash filler mod and have been thinking about some other options. I wasn't too happy about Great Stuff foam filler but I got thinking about how strong and rigid it is when it dries.

I took an old flower planter base that did not look like it was being used (I hope

) and partitioned it off with a piece of cardboard. Then I used an entire can of Great Stuff to fill it in.
It was fairly level at the edges when I applied it so you can see how much it expanded.

I took a hand saw and cut the top of the foam off level with the edges of the planter.

What is left is a quite firm and fairly solid base. I plan to fill in the bigger holes and then top it off with fiberglass cloth and resin. If all that turns out OK I plan to try filling the dash pocket in my next experiment in the same manner.

Speaking of the next experiment..........This is about as bad as it gets and if I can restore this next project I am going to have to give myself a pat on the back!

**docleary** · 12-10-2016, 05:33 PM

although i like the dash as it is from the factory, i must say great work, that's an interesting idea and great looking finished product.

**Thecatmilton** · 12-10-2016, 06:48 PM

I don't mind the filled dash pocket. Its not like anything stays there after I turn anyways. Filling it looks like it makes the job easier and increases the probability of it coming out well since you don't have to worry about the extra curves.

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-10-2016, 10:33 PM

Thanks for the comments. My preference would be to have the same grain pattern as OEM but I have not figured out how to accomplish that yet. As far as deleting the dash pocket, I thought a smoother less cluttered look would be more attractive. It does make repairs a little easier as far as that goes but the extra steps in making, installing and finishing the pocket cover far outweigh the difficulties in repairing damage inside the pocket.

- - - Updated - - -

Well....I gave the foam and fiberglass thing a try. I sawed the foam piece as flat as I could and then sanded it a bit. Then I covered it with fiberglass cloth and resin. The result was this:

It was flatter than this when I started. It appears that the resin did not react with the foam but I think the heat produced by the resin curing may have caused the foam to warp. After the fiberglass resin cured it is very tough and flexible but the amount of filler that would be needed to make it smooth would defeat the purpose of the fiberglass in the first place so I think the best way to go to make the filler plate is the birch plywood covered by fiberglass.

I started repairing the test dash by grooving out the cracks with the Dremel tool with a coarse sanding drum.

Then I cut strips of fiberglass cloth to fill in the grooves.

The strips were packed in to the grooves and covered with resin. Make sure the resin coats the cloth all the way to the top of the grooves.

I like to mix resin in small batches. I use 2 oz cups and fill half full to make it one ounce. 10 drops of hardener is correct for that amount.

Use the Dremel tool to bevel the top edges of the grooves which will in turn trim the excess fiberglass off.

This dash was from an older E30 which had some sort of indicator mounted in the center of the dash. Someone told me it was the seatbelt light, but whatever it was it left a hole that needed to be covered.

At this point the dash is ready for the application of the filler. The fiberglass was used to seal the dash and prepare it for the filler; not to strengthen it. The dash is a metal frame covered by foam. The cracks are caused by stress to the foam itself. The foam becomes hard and brittle over time and starts to shrink, which in turn causes the cracks. This relieves the stress but leaves an ugly surface. With all the stress relief that this dash has, it should be about as mellow as a "comfortably numb" rock star.

I don't think shrinkage will be a problem now. Along with the filler I will be making the dash pocket plate next.

**1SGDHORN** · 12-11-2016, 08:19 AM

Great work and nice write-up.

I followed a similar process on my E24 dash, though I used fiber flex welding rods and a filler specifically designed for dash repair and really liked the outcome..... Until the dash when back in the car and the heat from the sun opened up two of the larger cracks that were filled. Have you had any problems with this?

I was warned that hot/cold cycles could open up the repaired areas.

http://bigcoupe.com/phpBB2/viewtopic...lit=dash+crack

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-11-2016, 10:29 AM

I have not had the opportunity to install the dash and test it yet but that is in the works. You might be referring to some of the same products that I was looking at, like the plastic welding rods and special filler. Polyvance, maybe? If you get a chance to check the whole thread you will see that I tested and compared a special padded dash filler with regular auto body filler and could not detect a difference. As far as the plastic welding sticks, it seems to me that you are trying to get melted plastic to stick to dense foam. It does not seem like there would be much penetration and you would only get some bonding at the edges where the two meet. That is one reason I am experimenting with fiberglass resin. It seems like it would soak in better. The flex welding rods look more like melting a plastic filler in the crack than sealing it. That is just my speculation because I have not actually tried that method. I just know it is difficult to get plastic to fuse with dissimilar materials.

The other issue is the same cracks opening up again. Either the filler materials are shrinking or the dash continues to shrink and draw away. I am betting on the latter guess. If the dash continues to shrink significantly there probably is nothing that will prevent new cracks but I am hoping that applying a thick elastic base coat over the entire dash will take care of that problem. The next coat is the textured coat, which is not a sealer but just a coating not unlike coarse sand which is not a solid coat and should not crack at all. I also use a flexible final coat specifically made to flex so I hope the combination will work, but again, this is all experimental and new ground for me.

Another thought that just came to me is if you are starting to repair a dash that is just beginning to develop significant cracks, and if you are going to re-finish the entire dash anyway, it might be a good idea to go ahead and make deep grooves from front to back every 6 - 8 inches first to relieve and prevent future stress. The ugly dash that this post is about already has that done naturally!

It seems like it has done all the cracking it can do. If I get another test dash to experiment with I am going to seriously consider this approach.

One final thought....I am considering a solid layer of fiberglass on the top of the dash before applying the other coatings. Usually the only part of the dash that cracks is the top, especially where exposed constantly to sunlight. Look at all the old discarded or neglected fiberglass boats sitting around, or old RV's with fiberglass siding. You sometimes see some crazing on the surface in extreme cases but there usually are not wide cracks. Fiberglass is tough and flexible and probably would work great. You probably would want to cover the flatter, more open sections of the dash and not the ridges at the back, near the defroster vent slots. It would not be that hard to prep the fiberglass surface for the other coats.

As I type this the wheels in my head are turning!

I am thinking about the following sequence:

1. Prep - Fill in cracks (Done)
2. Cover main body of dash (top only), including instrument cluster hood top, with fiberglass cloth and resin.
3. Sand fiberglass and apply Suede-Tex flexible adhesive base coat.
4. Apply SEM texture coat.
5. Apply Duplicolor Vinyl and Fabric Coating
6. Clear coat with SEM low luster.

That ought to keep me busy for a while.

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-11-2016, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by 1SGDHORN

Great work and nice write-up.

I followed a similar process on my E24 dash, though I used fiber flex welding rods and a filler specifically designed for dash repair and really liked the outcome..... Until the dash when back in the car and the heat from the sun opened up two of the larger cracks that were filled. Have you had any problems with this?

I was warned that hot/cold cycles could open up the repaired areas.

http://bigcoupe.com/phpBB2/viewtopic...lit=dash+crack

I just took a look at your thread and you did a really nice job! To me the only reason a crack would reappear in your case is because the foam substrate on your dash continues to dry, shrink and harden. If that is the case you might see more of the same over time. The USC coating you used is the same company that makes Polyvance that I used; same product under two different names. I also discussed the difference in filling with fiberglass versus flex weld but I doubt that one has an advantage over the other because the surrounding foam that either product attaches to is still going to be hard and brittle and will break away easily if shrinkage continues. My logic tells me that if we can't find a way to stabilize the dash and cover it with a solid surface resistant to cracking we will continue to face the same problem. That is why I am going to try the approach I mentioned by relieving stress through grooves, solidifying the surface with fiberglass, and finishing with flexible base and final coatings. Only time well tell....

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-13-2016, 09:58 PM

I wanted to try all my ideas on this particular experiment so I proceeded with covering the top of the dash in fiberglass. I divided the top in three sections.

The first was the rear dash skirt behind the defrost vents. I trimmed a piece of fiberglass cloth to extend across the back.

Then I applied the first coat of resin. The covering goes all the way to the lower edge of the skirt

The next section was the passenger side dash top. I had made my dash pocket filler plate as described previously, then I covered that side in fiberglass cloth and resin.

The last section was the drivers side. I wanted to cover that side in one single piece if possible. The coarse weave fiberglass cloth I was using conformed easily to the shape of the instrument cluster hood and it was no problem to flow out the resin without causing bubbles.

Now the entire top of the dash is laminated with fiberglass excluding the defrost vent openings. This covers the areas most susceptible to cracking. After this coat is sanded a second coat of resin will be applied as smoothly as possible.

**hotdish** · 12-13-2016, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by Thecatmilton

I don't mind the filled dash pocket. Its not like anything stays there after I turn anyways.

I really only use the dash pocket' edge as a handle for double autox runs and not much else

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-14-2016, 01:58 PM

My main purpose to cover the dash pocket is not to make it easier to repair or cover damaged areas. . It is all about aesthetics...something a little different. I like the smooth look and I was wondering what others think.

**JimBobs 91E30** · 12-15-2016, 05:21 PM

I finished sanding the second coat of fiberglass resin and used some body filler to smooth the transitions. It looks kinda rough since you can see all the repair work through the opaque resin coating but it is actually quite smooth.

Then I applied the first coat of Suede-Tex flexible adhesive coating. It goes on thick and is self-leveling (to a point

). I will give it at least three days to dry before sanding and applying the second coat. That will be followed by the texture coating and spray-on vinyl coating.

**Kershaw** · 12-20-2016, 10:46 PM

Nice progress. It looks a little more high class maybe. Or maybe just more modern.

**1SGDHORN** · 12-22-2016, 01:48 PM

I like the idea of covering the dash in fiberglass. I wonder over time how the glass/resin will stay adhered to the original dash substrate? It makes sense that the fiberglass will help hold the dash together and hopefully prevent cracking.

Me personally, I like the coin pockets but, on my E24 M6 these were not on the original 1987 leather covered dash. I left them there when I redid my dash and am ok with that even though it isn't original.