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Thread: 99 E36 M3 STU/ GTS2-3 build #thesilvercar

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotoriousJJE View Post
    Man it sure looks like fiberglass but Mike said it wasn't. I can't tell what it is. I will take close up pics of the underside and post them.
    From the look of the spot of damage you showed in your pic above, the area in question is definitely fiberglass. When you cut the hole for the hood vent if the dust from the cut was white, then I'd say the whole hood is fiberglass. If it was carbon, the dust and the fibers/strands in that damaged area would be black.

  2. #102
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    And fiberglass has a very distinctive smell when cut. Takes me days to get the smell out my head/nose.


  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakermac View Post
    From the look of the spot of damage you showed in your pic above, the area in question is definitely fiberglass. When you cut the hole for the hood vent if the dust from the cut was white, then I'd say the whole hood is fiberglass. If it was carbon, the dust and the fibers/strands in that damaged area would be black.
    Definitely not carbon. I just remember Mike saying that it was a different cloth than fiberglass. Weird. Been around boats long enough that I should know it when I see it. When I cut it, I didnt get it all in my arms and hands like I usually would with fiberglass but it definitely could be.

    So after I fixed the motor, I got back to trying to diagnose what was going on with the brake lines. The lines themselves were fine, the leak was coming from two of the fittings adapting the stock hardlines to the stainless lines going to the firewall. The problem has to be coming from the flares.

    This exposed a fundamental flaw with the way I plumbed it. In order to fix a problem in the brake lines, I have to drop the motor. This is a terrible problem and really shortsighted on my behalf. So I decided I need to re-plumb them.

    Dropping the motor with the whole subfram is about eleventy billion times easier than the other way. We did it an hour.

    IMG_8961[1] by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    Revisiting the brake lines, the access here sucks. To avoid problems in the future, I am going to eliminate all the junctions in this area.
    IMG_8963[1] by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    First step is going straight from the master to the firewall. I should have done this from the beginnig.
    Next step is flaring the rear hard lines in a better spot (underneath the car) and running ne hard line from underneath the car to the firewall.
    The last step is replumbing the front lines all together. I am going to go from the bimmerworld brake lines to new stainless lines all the way to the firewall.

    The AN stff is sealing great and is fairly easy to do. GOing to try and stick to it.

    Thoughts?
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotoriousJJE View Post
    Definitely not carbon. I just remember Mike saying that it was a different cloth than fiberglass. Weird. Been around boats long enough that I should know it when I see it. When I cut it, I didnt get it all in my arms and hands like I usually would with fiberglass but it definitely could be.
    Most likely S-glass. A lighter more advanced version of fiberglass.

  5. #105
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    back in town and parts ordered.

    Getting the itch to go racing.
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotoriousJJE View Post
    Finally got around to working with the Mashaw hood. First step was to weight it: 16lbs. Not bad. Second step cut the hole for the louvers.

    Cutting the hole was easy enough. Need to send the Louver out to get powder coated and then I can glue it onto the Fiberglass hood.


    IMG_6296[1] by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    I was impressed enough with your hood and vent combo that I purchased both items for my car. Just received the hood yesterday - nice and light and appears to be well made. I noted that the reinforcing braces on the underside are not bonded to the hood skin. Was your like that? Any idea why Shaw didn't do the bonding prior to delivery?
    Last edited by fbirch; 06-15-2018 at 05:14 PM.

  7. #107
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    You mean at all?

    Man that's interesting, if I remember correctly, mine is glood in several spots.
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  8. #108
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    It's bonded around the perimeter, but the X brace in the middle isn't bonded. Apparently, you're supposed to heat cycle it multiple times before gluing to avoid imprinting the X on the hood as the glass cures. So I plan to drive mine around a few times before gluing the X brace.

    Got it installed today. It weighed 13 lb, compared to 40 lb for the stock hood. I was a bit diasappointed there are no attachments for connecting a hood strut. I'll probably just rig a prop rod of some sort.

    Shaw advised me not to run it at very high speeds until the X brace is glued. I'll cut the hole for the vent after gluing the brace. Then have it painted. The overall process is a bit more drawn out than I anticipated, but 27 lb off the nose of the car (and relatively high up) is a nice weight loss. Fitment is pretty good too.
    Last edited by fbirch; 06-24-2018 at 01:35 AM.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    It's bonded around the perimeter, but the X brace in the middle isn't bonded. Apparently, you're supposed to heat cycle it multiple times before gluing to avoid imprinting the X on the hood as the glass cures. So I plan to drive mine around a few times before gluing the X brace.

    Got it installed today. It weighed 13 lb, compared to 40 lb for the stock hood. I was a bit diasappointed there are no attachments for connecting a hood strut. I'll probably just rig a prop rod of some sort.

    Shaw advised me not to run it at very high speeds until the X brace is glued. I'll cut the hole for the vent after gluing the brace. Then have it painted. The overall process is a bit more drawn out than I anticipated, but 27 lb off the nose of the car (and relatively high up) is a nice weight loss. Fitment is pretty good too.
    Man, that is weird. Looked at mine yesterday and it was glued. I agree, that seems drawn out.


    I ran new brake lines. We are now leak free and much less cluttered. They feel rock solid and I'm pumped.

    We dropped the motor back in yesterday and got the car running.

    Now I can focus on the little details.

    Only problem is that is is about 150 degrees down here and not very motivating to go to the race track. Might take my time and wait till September/ Octoberish for the first run.
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  10. #110
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    We havee progress!

    New and improved brakeline routing. Should make it much easier to service and replace if needed. Live and learn and get better!

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    Junction sits behind the plastic holder for the wheel speed sensors:
    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr



    Only thing I dont like is how mushy the pedal feels. I think a brake booster delete is in the cards for me next. Is there an easy way to do that? I wish someone sold a ready kit plug and play.

    I gave up on wiring it myself and took it to Crucial Motorsports for the wiring job. Aaron knocked it out in a couple of days and everything works.

    While it was there they fabbed up a weightbox for the car. The whole box bolts right up to the factory seatholes. THen I can add weight as needed. I wanted it done this way because I can run it in STU with SCCA with added weight or give it a whirl in GTS3 with NASA without the box.

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    I also finished the hood install with vent and aerocatch. I actually had fun installing the aerocatch. They work great, they look good and fairly straightforward to do once you plan it out. The trick is to find the spot that give the catch enough room under the hood. I glued the panel down on the mashaw hood with 3M panle adhesive. That thing is not going anywhere.

    Still have tiny details pending. Just finishing up with the splitter, adding some vynil, and a couple of small things. THe car is pretty much ready to race. I am pumped. Oh and its finally back home:

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  11. #111
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    I believe MassiveLee sells a booster delete for the e36

  12. #112
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  13. #113
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    Your hood and vent came out great. Mine are being painted and powder coated as we speak.

  14. #114
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    Here it is:

    20180929_140018.jpg

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    That looks great man! Good looking car!!!
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  16. #116
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    Finally ran the car!

    After all the trials and tribulations I got it ready to run with SCCA in STU at the last Regional Race of the year at the Sebring short course. It's Sebring but with a crossover so we don't use the front and back straights. Never ran it that way but it was a ton of fun because you never get a break you are always doing something. It was a perfect shakedown of the car to see what else needed to be done. Since we aren't using the big straights, the speeds are never over 120 or so. Perfect time to test the brake system. I had triple checked everything but I was a little nervous running into the hairpin with brake lines I made myself.

    To get it ready for the event, I had a laundry list of things to do with two main ones.

    First of these was fixing the exhaust merge between the headers and the 3 inch pipe. Ordered a custom Burns unit and I can't speak more highly of those guys. Top notch customer service.

    Before
    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    After
    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    Second undertaking was making a splitter. Since it was the first one, I made it out of plywood to get the shape right and figure out how to mount it.

    I installed the Hard Motorsport splitter mounts in order to keep my brake cooling ducts. Those are nor enough to hold a splitter. They are actually quite flimsy in my opinion. Their splitter ends right behing the bumper or 24" from the splitter edge. That doesn't help me a my rules allow a splitter to go all the way back to the centerline of the wheels.

    Thought about it for a little bit and figure out that if I use spacers underneath the subframe, I could avoid the sway bar and give a good sturdy mount to the chassis.

    I had some old school sway bar bushings that were the perfect height laying around.

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    M8 Rivnuts into subframe

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    THis is the shape of the splitter. I made copies of the shape that I can transfer to other mediums.

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    Finished product:

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr



    Now on to the race.

    Qualified on pole.
    Swept the weekend
    Most of the big boy cars were at Runoffs, but it was a great shakedown of the car. There were 5 STU cars running and I just wanted to get a gauge of wher ethe car was.

    Car was on rails. I aligned it before going down there unloaded it and just ran it. Tire temps were perfect 160 outisde 180 inside after a cool down lap. Motor felt great, and the wing and splitter helped. Biggest difference by FAR was the ABS system. It is awesome. Took me a while to trust it, but once I did, it was a joke. Felt like I could outbrake Miatas.

    I'll upload vid later but a couple of pics:


    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr


    Amazing weekend. Plus I had the best pitcrew:

    Untitled by NotoriousJJE, on Flickr
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  17. #117
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    Congrats on the great result! Sounds as if your car is dialed in very well. How much better do you rate the performance of the MK60 ABS system compared to the native E36 ABS? At some point I'd like to upgrade mine.

  18. #118
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    Car is looking fabulous. Love the splitter mounting. I'm totally gonna steal that idea.

    Is your car having a brand identity crisis?

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    Congrats on the great result! Sounds as if your car is dialed in very well. How much better do you rate the performance of the MK60 ABS system compared to the native E36 ABS? At some point I'd like to upgrade mine.
    It is hard for me to quanitfy the difference. My stock ABS system stopped working and I had no ABS for quite some time. Car was braking at or above 1G's from the data and once I started trusting the brakes, I was braking deeper than I remember.

    From a feel perspective, I find hard to regulate the brakes with the stock booster and I was locking up quite a bit before this system.
    I find the pedal feel to be awful with this setup. It is quite soft. My next modification and it is going to happen ASAP is a boosterless setup with the MK60 system.
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakermac View Post
    Car is looking fabulous. Love the splitter mounting. I'm totally gonna steal that idea.

    Is your car having a brand identity crisis?
    Thanks! Just repping everything we sell!
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  21. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotoriousJJE View Post
    It is hard for me to quanitfy the difference. My stock ABS system stopped working and I had no ABS for quite some time. Car was braking at or above 1G's from the data and once I started trusting the brakes, I was braking deeper than I remember.

    From a feel perspective, I find hard to regulate the brakes with the stock booster and I was locking up quite a bit before this system.
    I find the pedal feel to be awful with this setup. It is quite soft. My next modification and it is going to happen ASAP is a boosterless setup with the MK60 system.
    I agree 100% that the E36 doesn't do a good job of conveying impending lockup through pedal feel. I fought an intermittent ABS problem for a year, during which I ruined quite a few tires. Fixed it by replacing the hydraulic actuator/solenoid block, and -like you - it took me a while to trust it again. My car has always had a pretty firm brake pedal, however. What I find weird is that the car decelerates well up to the point where I'm just beyond the ABS intervention threshold. If I go "really deep" past that threshold (i.e., pedal pressure that greatly exceeds the point at which ABS kicks in) it seems that the rate of deceleration isn't as good.

  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    If I go "really deep" past that threshold (i.e., pedal pressure that greatly exceeds the point at which ABS kicks in) it seems that the rate of deceleration isn't as good.
    Interesting. Is that with ABS engaged? So in other words, once ABS is engaged, the car doesn't decelerate like it was before ABS engaging?
    99 M3 STU/ GTS3 Project

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by NotoriousJJE View Post
    Interesting. Is that with ABS engaged? So in other words, once ABS is engaged, the car doesn't decelerate like it was before ABS engaging?
    Not much change in deceleration just before ABS kicks in to just after it kicks in. If I panic brake - i.e., mash the pedal MUCH harder than needed to activate ABS - it seems to lose some deceleration. I haven't done any controlled tests where I look at longitudinal G's to quantify it. Maybe during the next event.

  24. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    Not much change in deceleration just before ABS kicks in to just after it kicks in. If I panic brake - i.e., mash the pedal MUCH harder than needed to activate ABS - it seems to lose some deceleration. I haven't done any controlled tests where I look at longitudinal G's to quantify it. Maybe during the next event.
    I agree with this perception. And, in fact, I ran without ABS for about a year, and data showed that in straight braking zones, max G's were a touch higher without ABS. I actually got to enjoy the challenge/learning the car without ABS, felt like a different car. I added a proportioning valve to help with rear tire lock-up, but, still too many inside rear tire lockups while trail braking/bumps/etc, so ABS is fixed. I do have a switch to turn it on / off.

    I'm convinced E36's benefit from a prop valve even WITH ABS.

    Wish there was a turn-key modern (not too crazy expensive) ABS for the E36.
    Last edited by aeronaut; 10-30-2018 at 01:56 PM.

  25. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by fbirch View Post
    Not much change in deceleration just before ABS kicks in to just after it kicks in. If I panic brake - i.e., mash the pedal MUCH harder than needed to activate ABS - it seems to lose some deceleration. I haven't done any controlled tests where I look at longitudinal G's to quantify it. Maybe during the next event.
    FWIW, i get the same feeling in my car. I also have nothing to prove that the car isn't slowing at the same rate but it def gets a bit scarier when it happens.

    Quote Originally Posted by aeronaut View Post
    I do have a switch to turn it on / off.
    How did you go about wiring this? Interested in doing the same in my car.

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