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Thread: V12 twin turbo kits and Manual trans kits

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by alex840 View Post
    very very interesting setup.
    Two words lol: boost leaks
    Not to mention: turbo lag

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by dragon850 View Post

    Two words lol: boost leaks
    Not to mention: turbo lag
    There's gonna be pros and cons to any setup. I figured turbo lag but did a little research on the setup and its reported to not be that bad. Turbo leaks, you should pressurize the system before a final install

  3. #53
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    temps and convenience of design and amount of plumbing matter. the rest of the issues can be solved if everything is done right. i think it's a great idea Khan, never thought of implementing it into a BMW. no intercooler necessary, either!

  4. #54
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    Khan850i,

    If you had estimate, what would be the cost of the implementation of this on an E31?

    Thank you for sharing.



    Quote Originally Posted by Khan850i View Post
    There's gonna be pros and cons to any setup. I figured turbo lag but did a little research on the setup and its reported to not be that bad. Turbo leaks, you should pressurize the system before a final install

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by alex840 View Post
    Khan850i,

    If you had estimate, what would be the cost of the implementation of this on an E31?

    Thank you for sharing.
    In just parts? 2-3k depending on the quality of your turbos, I even thought about getting and rebuilding a set of bmw turbos because....bmw

  6. #56
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    Khan850i,

    I am very interested in this setup. John DC Supercharger setup is great, but a little pricy and from what I heard there is a lot of tweaking and tuning that need to happen. A friend of mine has one in his car and has rebuilt everything in his car for things to work flawlessly.

    Steve Dinan never called back, as I am sure he is a busy man.

    Quote Originally Posted by Khan850i View Post
    In just parts? 2-3k depending on the quality of your turbos, I even thought about getting and rebuilding a set of bmw turbos because....bmw

  7. #57
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    if had an 840, id supercharge for sure. Plenty of options there that are tested and running on 5/7 series cars.

    the STS setup is the way to go with the V12'S...I see no reason to generate the extra heat a conventional setup would cause.

    I know the company had filed for bankruptcy a while back...not sure of their status
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  8. #58
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    What about the danger of running that heat back to the front with are low slung gas tank and minimum space to hide more piping, I was thinking this route too a while ago, Even experimented but I ran into not enough under carriage room, Maybe someone else has a better route for the piping? Would be interesting to see it done and remain clean beneath the car.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #59
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    The turbos actually run cooler in the back. Shielding is pretty easy if one really is concerned about the heat...it really isnt that big of a deal tho. Never had an issue with heat or heard of anyone else having problems.

    These setups sound AMAZING too

    Not sure where that picture is from but thats absolutely not how to do it :p
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  10. #60
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    They do sound amazing and would be nice to see one on a E31, Could save a bundle also and I know exactly how several examples look like, Plenty showed up at Irwindale Speedway many of nights, Mostly Vettes, That there was a shady tree experiment that does pretty good on a 50's pick up before STS set ups existed.) I think we could get a system together much easier with a single sts kit and shielding would be essential back there imo but can be done.
    Last edited by 8eights; 03-04-2017 at 09:51 PM.

  11. #61
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    Yeah this type of setup is popular in the Vette crowd. the die-hard conventional turbo guys hate them....but numbers dont lie.

    shielding is more for the physical protection from the elements...E31 fuel tanks are pretty far from the muffler area if thats a concern

    They do however take a bit of tuning and design work to properly match the turbo(s)....

    - - - Updated - - -

    ....Ive blown up one of my engines in spectacular fashion b4
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  12. #62
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    Well, I contacted them and its very inexpensive but there needs to be some bending and piping to do. The owner actually has it on his vette as Driftgirl mentioned.

    I think I am going with it, the only problem is find a local to do dyno tuning on the car......

  13. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by DriftGirl View Post
    I see no reason to generate the extra heat a conventional setup would cause.
    What extra heat? Seems to me that an engine is going to produce the same amount of waste heat at a given power output no matter how you are producing that power. Turbochargers being thermodynamic devices comes to mind as one good reason to mount them as close to the heat source as possible. Where under the hood is impossible, or in this case just difficult and expensive, of course remote mounts have a place -- but every remote application I've ever seen was a case of "because I had to," not "because I wanted to." My "conventional" twin-turbo M70 has no issues with heat rejection, running a tune just shy of 600hp. I've been sorely tempted to drop the same setup on my E31, but haven't sorted out whether I can maintain the factory gauges with an aftermarket ECU, etc. The E31 has proven itself to be an incredibly low-priority project this year, but I'll get traction on it one of these days!

    As for the status of STS, it takes about ten seconds to find the answer -- but the answer leaves open as many questions as it resolves. The website says the company "preparing to re-launch," BUT...the last date referenced in the original owner / buyer's update is nearly two years ago at this point... I'd do my due diligence before I plunked down any money, given the history. https://www.ststurbochargers.com/sts-turbo

    Cheers, John

  14. #64
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    Does anyone on the forum have this kit installed and running on their car?

  15. #65
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    Update, got the quote for complete Generic Setup. Cost is reasonable.......for a 3 psi system with intercoolers and piping. Install not a big deal. Big problem is when you have it installed, it will need custom chips installed. I am guessing some sort of live dyno mapping per one of our vet. members here.

    At that point it might expensive: so TT vs SC continues.

    I don't want much more power, just 60-12 hp and updated to today's standard of HP. I am done getting smoked by other updated M cars

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by alex840 View Post
    ...for a 3 psi system with intercoolers and piping. Install not a big deal. Big problem is when you have it installed, it will need custom chips installed. I am guessing some sort of live dyno mapping per one of our vet. members here.

    I don't want much more power, just 60-12 hp and updated to today's standard of HP. I am done getting smoked by other updated M cars
    3psi? Wow, that's...unremarkable. My "conventional" twin turbo is set up at around 10.5-11psi, and it's making full boost by around 3000rpm, dumping the extra. (I hear that a good set of head studs would let me turn up the wick quite a bit more, but in a 2200lb car, I'm making plenty as it is.) I'm sure you could do the math on how much power 3psi would get you, and if your target gain is only 60, maybe that's enough. I can say with dyno confirmation that 11psi doubles the factory-rated output of the M70. To me, you need numbers like that to justify the cost and hassle. Be forewarned...I don't think that adding 60hp is really going to keep an E31 from getting smoked by much of anything in a drag race. It probably is enough to improve the "butt dyno" driving experience, though. (When it comes to butt dynos, a differential might accomplish the same thing at a much lower cost and with a lot less work. If you've already done that, I've lost track of it in this thread, sorry.)

    I concur with you that the challenge would be engine programming / control -- an area where my knowledge is admittedly weak. I use (and a friend set up / tuned) an Electromotive TEC3R for my M70TT. I don't know enough about the multiple Motronic chips that BMW used to even guess at how you would burn a set to handle the engine in an otherwise-stock E31. I wish there was something like a MegaSquirt that could interface with OEM gauge clusters, etc. That would change the game on modifying and modernizing these engines in stock setups, at a much more reasonable cost.

    Cheers, John

  17. #67
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    John,

    Yes, 3 PSI its just meh meh.....but probably wouldn't need an intercooler. That whole kit out the door is $2k, not bad right. Going to a 5psi with intercooler and other goodies looking at 3600i$h. I do agree if spending that much on an upgrade might as well go bigger.

    Again my goal was not to get 700 hp, but just updated to today HP standard. Your right most of "M" cars today are 450HP without tune. We do have hand full of members here that are capable of doing custom chip builds in Europe and here in Bay Area that can even build a custom box, but this would take significant amount of time. I looked into installing the piping and turbos not that hard at all. Tuning it where your getting the car to do what you want is another........

    Come on, 60HP is more than just butt Dyno. When I drive my S70 vs M70 car, there is a significant difference.

    The car has a 3:15 LSD in it form a 750iL. Tried every Chip that is out there: Alpina, Wokke I, Wokke II, Dinan DMEs, Turner 6 speed specific DMEs (I settled for Alpina EML & Turner DMEs).

    TT was just an interest in the beginning but I had a 340 Dinan Loaner car, and I ended up calling in sick to work so I can jus keep driving it. The woooooosh sound is addicting.

    Options as of now:
    1) Keep digging into this for the M70
    2) Look at options for the S70 (Maybe John DC SC)
    3) Do nothing and go pick up a Dinan car


    Quote Originally Posted by dukegrad98 View Post
    3psi? Wow, that's...unremarkable. My "conventional" twin turbo is set up at around 10.5-11psi, and it's making full boost by around 3000rpm, dumping the extra. (I hear that a good set of head studs would let me turn up the wick quite a bit more, but in a 2200lb car, I'm making plenty as it is.) I'm sure you could do the math on how much power 3psi would get you, and if your target gain is only 60, maybe that's enough. I can say with dyno confirmation that 11psi doubles the factory-rated output of the M70. To me, you need numbers like that to justify the cost and hassle. Be forewarned...I don't think that adding 60hp is really going to keep an E31 from getting smoked by much of anything in a drag race. It probably is enough to improve the "butt dyno" driving experience, though. (When it comes to butt dynos, a differential might accomplish the same thing at a much lower cost and with a lot less work. If you've already done that, I've lost track of it in this thread, sorry.)

    I concur with you that the challenge would be engine programming / control -- an area where my knowledge is admittedly weak. I use (and a friend set up / tuned) an Electromotive TEC3R for my M70TT. I don't know enough about the multiple Motronic chips that BMW used to even guess at how you would burn a set to handle the engine in an otherwise-stock E31. I wish there was something like a MegaSquirt that could interface with OEM gauge clusters, etc. That would change the game on modifying and modernizing these engines in stock setups, at a much more reasonable cost.

    Cheers, John
    Last edited by alex840; 03-11-2017 at 12:07 AM.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by dukegrad98 View Post
    What extra heat? Seems to me that an engine is going to produce the same amount of waste heat at a given power output no matter how you are producing that power. Turbochargers being thermodynamic devices comes to mind as one good reason to mount them as close to the heat source as possible. Where under the hood is impossible, or in this case just difficult and expensive, of course remote mounts have a place -- but every remote application I've ever seen was a case of "because I had to," not "because I wanted to." My "conventional" twin-turbo M70 has no issues with heat rejection, running a tune just shy of 600hp. I've been sorely tempted to drop the same setup on my E31, but haven't sorted out whether I can maintain the factory gauges with an aftermarket ECU, etc. The E31 has proven itself to be an incredibly low-priority project this year, but I'll get traction on it one of these days!

    As for the status of STS, it takes about ten seconds to find the answer -- but the answer leaves open as many questions as it resolves. The website says the company "preparing to re-launch," BUT...the last date referenced in the original owner / buyer's update is nearly two years ago at this point... I'd do my due diligence before I plunked down any money, given the history. https://www.ststurbochargers.com/sts-turbo

    Cheers, John
    The E31's run hot as hell in stock form. My entire car has extra heat shielding. Turbos add to that...touch one if u dont believe me joking aside, yes they obviously raise under hood temps.

    BTW, Ive been running a (built in my garage) rear mounted setup on one of my Lexus SC's for MANY years now...the other SC: 2JZGTE, my SR20 S13's... I dont blow smoke.

    If someone is thinking about this, its a bit more than mounting a turbo and running random pipe up front. It's a balancing act that can have poor or disastrous results if not calculated right.
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  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by alex840 View Post
    Does anyone on the forum have this kit installed and running on their car?
    yes, but not on an 8 series...
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  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jamespolow View Post
    Wondering how many people would be interested in complete twin turbo kits for the 850i and complete manual transmission kits before I start supplying these kits. Not sure on price tags for the kits but they will be affordable for what you get. They will be based off of the Dinan TT kits that they used to make. Will be offering other parts for these cars as well. Any input is greatly appreciated. Thank you!

    Are you producing twin kits for 1996 750iL?

  21. #71
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    Any news here?

  22. #72
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    Yeah, i have a cast manifold for the drivers side. found a way to do it economical. I got screwed out of the car that he got. FURIouS!

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by cer54467 View Post
    Yeah, i have a cast manifold for the drivers side. found a way to do it economical. I got screwed out of the car that he got. FURIouS!
    So what now?

  24. #74
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    Im doing this as well, i have the 560g trans. Im looking for a pair of manifolds made to shoot forward, and be collected for a single charger. I own a turbo repair and sales shop so the charger will be the easy part to match up. Just hoping these manifolds can be made, or if i should try to engineer a set of my own... Being in a resto project, id like to focus my build time on the restoration bit, and not the fabrication of said manifolds.

  25. #75
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    Arthas -- it's well less than ideal, but you could look at whether you can flip the existing manifolds over so the output is upwards, then run custom plumbing from there. It's been too many years for me to remember off-hand, but I feel like it was possible to just flip the existing cast parts. You might also have to put them on the opposite side of the engine? I forget, but I remember experimenting with it at the time. I wound up keeping the OEM manifolds with downward exhaust routing / custom tube from that point on. Anything can be made, but it comes at a premium of cost and time. I had a bunch of stainless pieces cut on a water-jet to match the exhaust ports and manifold bolt pattern for a possible custom solution, and just came to the conclusion that it wasn't worth it on my application.

    Cheers, John

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