Building an E23 CoilOver Kit On a Budget - Questions? Need Some Direction!

[mpvibes]

Hey everybody, I've been doing some extensive research on building a custom coil over kit at a budget friendly price but, I want to know if I have all the right parts before I start this project. I've looked at a couple e28 and e24 forums on this subject, I've looked at Dunit coilover setup but, i still have some questions. Do I have to use bilstein shocks or are there cheaper shocks/struts for our cars?

Please let me know if what I'm getting is correct and if I'm missing any other parts. I'm trying to go as low as possible without rubbing the tires on the fenders and scraping the oil pan.I would like a stanced look. Thanks for any input!
My List:

AAF-ALL64151_xl.jpgQTY: 4 AllStar Performance 2.5" Coil-Over Kit - http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aa...4143/overview/
eib-06002251600_xl.jpgQTY: 2 "Front" Coil-Over Spring, Red Powdercoated, 400 lbs./in. Rate, 2.5 in. Inside Diameter, 6 in. Length
eib-06002251600_xl.jpgQTY 2: "Rear" Coil-Over Spring, Powdercoated, 2.5 in. Inside Diameter, 8.000 in. Length, 325 lbs./in.Spring Rate

shopping-2.jpeg QTY 2: E23 Bilstein Sport Shocks for the Front
shopping.jpeg QTY 2: E28 Bilstein HD Struts for the Rear

[750i]

You can use any shock. The Bilstein sports are better for lowered cars because the shock itself is shorter.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

[mpvibes]

You can use any shock. The Bilstein sports are better for lowered cars because the shock itself is shorter.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

I see...Ok, thanks. Do you know what size shocks and struts or brands that are cheaper than Bilstein but, are of good quality? Are there any part#'s?

[750i]

In general, you get what you pay for. If I was making my own coilovers I would find a Koni "Gas-A-Just" cartridge to suit your application so you have adjustable damping.

I believe people have used VW Corrado strut inserts in shortened housings for the front on the E28 to lower. The thought process is that you can shorten the strut housing itself, so you can use a shorter cartridge and still have a full stroke, vs using stock housings and cartridges and you only have maybe 3" of stroke in the shock.

You can do the same for the rear, since you're using 2.5" springs.

This all depends on how low you want to go and requires measuring and cutting and measuring some more to do properly.

How are you planning on addressing the change in suspension geometry? The front is fairly easy with adjustable strut mounts, but the rear is more difficult and you may have to slot the subframe.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

[mpvibes]

In general, you get what you pay for. If I was making my own coilovers I would find a Koni "Gas-A-Just" cartridge to suit your application so you have adjustable damping.

I believe people have used VW Corrado strut inserts in shortened housings for the front on the E28 to lower. The thought process is that you can shorten the strut housing itself, so you can use a shorter cartridge and still have a full stroke, vs using stock housings and cartridges and you only have maybe 3" of stroke in the shock.

You can do the same for the rear, since you're using 2.5" springs.

This all depends on how low you want to go and requires measuring and cutting and measuring some more to do properly.

How are you planning on addressing the change in suspension geometry? The front is fairly easy with adjustable strut mounts, but the rear is more difficult and you may have to slot the subframe.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

Ok, thanks for the advice. I've also heard of people that have e24's using e30 KYB GR-2 Inserts for the fronts. I was following DUnit's recommendations when he did his own coilover kit on his E23. Here is what he stated on a post regarding coilovers for E23:

Assuming you will need to get new struts and shocks anyways, a basic coilover kit should set you back about for nearly the same price as springs. UNFORTUNATELY for me, I spent more because I had to experiment with different springs rate, lengths, top hats, etc.

If someone wants to learn from my mistakes and buy a basic coilover kit, I'd suggest this....

e23 Billy Sports for the front, e28 Billy HDs in the rear (perch does not matter since the threaded sleeve sits on top)

(4) AllStar Performance 2.5" Coil-Over Kit - http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aa...4143/overview/
(2) front Eibach Elite Series Coil-Over Springs - 6" length, 2.5" ID, 300-350lbs (If you want a softer spring rate, you may have to go to a 7 or 8" spring length instead)
(2) rear Coil-Over Springs - 8" length, 2.5" ID, approximately 10% more than fronts

(4) x 40 = 160
(2) x 60 = 120
(2) x 50 = 100
TOTAL = $380

- - - Updated - - -


Also, I was looking at this set up on a fellow who was doing the same thing but had an e28:

photobucket-39462-1356757281094.jpg Front shock tower
photobucket-7247-1356757276691.jpgFront shock tower
photobucket-38722-1356757277741.jpg Front shock tower
photobucket-28930-1356757282432.jpg Rear shocks


Since Bilsteins "all-around" are a bit more expensive, I would most likely get these BMW E30 KYB GR2's/ Excel G-2 for the front Part#364021 (not sure if these would fit with the coil over sleeves from summit racing, I'm just throwing this out there) Let me know your thoughts:

s-l1600-2.jpg Cost for two brand new: $$80 on TireRack


For the rears??? Anyone know of a rear shock that is comparable to the Billy Sports HD for the E28??? And that is much cheaper and of good quality??? Part# would be great!

- - - Updated - - -

Will I have to get new custom front strut bearings like these to make the custom coilover kit work or can I just use my old stock strut bearings?

Attachment 571075 Custom Front Strut Bearings Cost: $295 a pair WTF!!!


If I have to get this to get the job done then this might be a deal breaker for me!

[750i]

KYBs are available for the rears as well. I think RockAuto carries them. They're fairly inexpensive. In general they ride harsher and do not last as long as Bilstein which is why many people say KYB=Keep Your Bilsteins.

I would personally look into Konis once you have your sizes figured out, as they make some with adjustable damping.

You dont NEED adjustable top mounts for the front, but you will have excessive camber without them. There is no provision to adjust camber from the factory.

You also need to look into the rear suspension. Depending on how low you go, without work in the rear you will have excessive camber and toe which is a recipe for eating tires.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

[mpvibes]

KYBs are available for the rears as well. I think RockAuto carries them. They're fairly inexpensive. In general they ride harsher and do not last as long as Bilstein which is why many people say KYB=Keep Your Bilsteins.

I would personally look into Konis once you have your sizes figured out, as they make some with adjustable damping.

You dont NEED adjustable top mounts for the front, but you will have excessive camber without them. There is no provision to adjust camber from the factory.

You also need to look into the rear suspension. Depending on how low you go, without work in the rear you will have excessive camber and toe which is a recipe for eating tires.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

LOL!!! KYB=Keep Your Bilsteins! I never heard that one before! Thats funny!

I looked at the Konis and they were pretty expensive!

When you say look at the rear suspension and the excessive camber what exactly are you referring too? Is it the type of shocks being used?

Thanks for the info!

- - - Updated - - -

So I was browsing around the forums to see if I could find more info on coil overs for the E23 and I stumbled upon a statement from D Unit and he stated in a thread "Are you able to source BC coilovers? If he could do it over again, he would have just purchased the e28 BC Coil overs and retrofitted those to fit. Since the rears would've fit already, all you would have to do is modify the fronts".

http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...-745i-82/page3

So, technically speaking I can use coilovers from an e28 on my e23??? It doesn't matter what brand it is? Correct if I'm wrong....

[750i]

He bought e28 coilovers, which fit in the rear but will give you a big drop, as they are designed to lower an E28 which has shorter rear shocks to begin with.

For the front he welded the coilover tube to the spindle, as you are planning to do. He just used the pieces that came with the front coilovers instead of purchasing them separately. Like this:



Here's a badass E23. He built bags, but the concept is the same:

http://www.stanceworks.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=23100

The rear suspension is not adjustable, and lowering the rear brings excessive toe and camber into play. Depending on how low you go, you will need to find a way to adjust the rear suspension.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

[mpvibes]

He bought e28 coilovers, which fit in the rear but will give you a big drop, as they are designed to lower an E28 which has shorter rear shocks to begin with.

For the front he welded the coilover tube to the spindle, as you are planning to do. He just used the pieces that came with the front coilovers instead of purchasing them separately. Like this:



Here's a badass E23. He built bags, but the concept is the same:

http://www.stanceworks.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=23100

The rear suspension is not adjustable, and lowering the rear brings excessive toe and camber into play. Depending on how low you go, you will need to find a way to adjust the rear suspension.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

Ok, I see! I understand now! Thanks for the info and pic. Oh yeah, I know negative camber! He had a bad ass e23! Thats why I dont wanna spend too much on coilovers. The air ride suspension is what I really want but, thats in the future.

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[Hit Man X]

KYB is junk, if you want to waste money... you can just send it to me and I can squander it on Miller Lite and lap dances.

[timgal1234]

Lol Kyb isn't the best option imo either i put new Sachs in my car from fcp euro they were on close out for like 60$ a piece.

[mpvibes]

KYB is junk, if you want to waste money... you can just send it to me and I can squander it on Miller Lite and lap dances.

ROFL!!! Ha Ha!!!

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[750i]

Keep in mind that if you build a good coilover set up, all you will have to do is replace your fixed spring with a universal bag... So it makes sense to spend the money now.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

[D Unit]

Hey everybody, I've been doing some extensive research on building a custom coil over kit at a budget friendly price but, I want to know if I have all the right parts before I start this project. I've looked at a couple e28 and e24 forums on this subject, I've looked at Dunit coilover setup but, i still have some questions. Do I have to use bilstein shocks or are there cheaper shocks/struts for our cars?

Please let me know if what I'm getting is correct and if I'm missing any other parts. I'm trying to go as low as possible without rubbing the tires on the fenders and scraping the oil pan.I would like a stanced look. Thanks for any input!
My List:

AAF-ALL64151_xl.jpgQTY: 4 AllStar Performance 2.5" Coil-Over Kit - http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aa...4143/overview/
eib-06002251600_xl.jpgQTY: 2 "Front" Coil-Over Spring, Red Powdercoated, 400 lbs./in. Rate, 2.5 in. Inside Diameter, 6 in. Length
eib-06002251600_xl.jpgQTY 2: "Rear" Coil-Over Spring, Powdercoated, 2.5 in. Inside Diameter, 8.000 in. Length, 325 lbs./in.Spring Rate

shopping-2.jpeg QTY 2: E23 Bilstein Sport Shocks for the Front
shopping.jpeg QTY 2: E28 Bilstein HD Struts for the Rear

Just for the record, I could not get as low as I wanted to on that particular setup (except I used rear e28 Billy Sports and 375-400lbs 7" springs). To achieve my current ride height, I bought a used set of e30 325ix Billy HDs and had them custom revalved at Bilstein in Poway). I basically told the tech to revalve the struts to handle my 350 lbs spring rates and he came up with the rest of the specs. Since the e30 325ix Billy struts were much shorter, I had to section out 2-3" from the strut housings and reweld them back together. Lastly, I called IE to make me some custom camber plates and am now running a very conservative -1.0 of camber in the fronts.

For the rears, the e28 Billy Sports with coilover kit work great IMO. I know Eric Q said there wasn't enough suspension travel for them, but honestly, I haven't run into any issues for my car's daily driven application. Eric Q also suggested to run 15% stiffer in the rear so that's why I selected a 350/F and 400/R. That being said, I am at -3.0 camber in the rear. I can't remember my rear toe but I do have the info at home somewhere.

My ride height is low yet practical. If you plan to get stanced, you will literally be driving millimeters from the oil pan.

[mpvibes]

Just for the record, I could not get as low as I wanted to on that particular setup (except I used rear e28 Billy Sports and 375-400lbs 7" springs). To achieve my current ride height, I bought a used set of e30 325ix Billy HDs and had them custom revalved at Bilstein in Poway). I basically told the tech to revalve the struts to handle my 350 lbs spring rates and he came up with the rest of the specs. Since the e30 325ix Billy struts were much shorter, I had to section out 2-3" from the strut housings and reweld them back together. Lastly, I called IE to make me some custom camber plates and am now running a very conservative -1.0 of camber in the fronts.

For the rears, the e28 Billy Sports with coilover kit work great IMO. I know Eric Q said there wasn't enough suspension travel for them, but honestly, I haven't run into any issues for my car's daily driven application. Eric Q also suggested to run 15% stiffer in the rear so that's why I selected a 350/F and 400/R. That being said, I am at -3.0 camber in the rear. I can't remember my rear toe but I do have the info at home somewhere.

My ride height is low yet practical. If you plan to get stanced, you will literally be driving millimeters from the oil pan.

Hey D Unit, thanks for chiming in and taking the time out of your schedule to give detailed advice and tips on your experience with custom coilover setups. I see this may be a bit costly after everything is done. I guess for what I want I should probably hold off for now.

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[mpvibes]

Keep in mind that if you build a good coilover set up, all you will have to do is replace your fixed spring with a universal bag... So it makes sense to spend the money now.

Sent from my Chroma Nexus 6

Yes true, but I believe negative camber did this and he did not like it because it was not low enough. So, I believe he got a universal air strut from bag riders and cut the hub assembly and welded the air strut on.

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[bigperm206]

KYB is junk, if you want to waste money... you can just send it to me and I can squander it on Miller Lite and lap dances.

That's funny right there