fix sun roof or lose it altogether

[BMWNTHZST]

My sunroof needs a refresh. The seal is shot, there are two small rust spots that need to get repaired and the inner roof panel no longer works when opening the sunroof (I need to do this manually). I hardly ever use the sunroof in the first place and have been thinking about removing it altogether. Putting cost aside what would you do?

I don't plan on selling this car anytime soon (or at all) however if I did and it didn't have a sunroof do you think that would hurt my resale value? Honestly the only person who is going to buy a car like this would be an enthusiast and may want it relitivly stock (wouldn't they)?

I look forward to your comments.

[cartoonz]

fix it. Rebuild the lift mechanisms with new gates, racks, and arms. Properly address the rust spot of buy a new lid, they aren't that expensive.
"Removing it" is way more involved than you might think

[dukegrad98]

Timely topic for me. My project 8 needs a full headliner replacement, as well as a full repaint. The sunroof works, but the seals don't look great and it's not quite aligned to my satisfaction. I've given just brief thought to deleting it as part of the restoration. It's really only been a passing thought up to this point.

I have an E36/8 M Coupe with the sunroof deleted at the factory, and I can say that I don't miss having one at all. Also, it actually makes that model a bit more desirable to enthusiasts. In my daily driver, I can't remember the last time I opened the sunroof, or even the interior moonroof panel. It's only there because it was standard on the vehicle.

Cheers, John

[rockytt]

Before you go the "delete" route - make sure you can source the new/special headliner. I've been told that the last one was purchased a couple of years back...

[BMWNTHZST]

Before you go the "delete" route - make sure you can source the new/special headliner. I've been told that the last one was purchased a couple of years back...

As for the headliner, I'm not worried. I deal with an amazing upholsterer and he will make me a new headliner. As a matter of fact, sunroof delete or not I was also thinking about redoing the headliner and pillars in black Alcantara!

[rockytt]

The sunroof delete uses a different piece altogether that restores that lost headroom - not just a matter of re-upholstery
Black is nice - CSIs came that way IIRC

[Prometheus]

Hardtops are boss.

ditch it.

[PabloRock]

I don't use mine all the time, but I do have to say, when I do, it's really nice. With the lack of a B pillar, opening everything up really gives that almost convertible feel. But that's just me.

[barry8108]

When i bought my car i removed the inner panel and have never had a problem with the sunroof. The inner panel seems like a waste of time.

[adamnur]

I would fix it. Well, I did. But did not replace trolley gears and found after recovering the liner, installing new gates, toothed racks, guides, that the liner gear was slipping. So I did the same as above and just removed the liner and toothed racks.

I will at some point do Frankie's manual liner conversion though, makes for a more finished look. Apart from the automatic function of the liner, it seems that the sunroof mechanism is really not all that bad.

[TxGR8White]

I am the one that bought the last sunroof-delete headliner for the Diamond Black car that I welded the sunroof shut. Doing it again to one of the white ones. Much nicer interior and no worries about leaks or rust.
I don't believe it would hurt the resale of any normal 8.

[radlaw]

...I welded the sunroof shut.

Could you describe how you did the sunroof delete?

[TxGR8White]

Could you describe how you did the sunroof delete?

Basically, I purchased a new steel sunroof panel (the old one had too much rust on it), and used 1/8" steel rods as the "filler" between the panel and the roof. After it was all MIG welded, the seal was filled, sanded and primed and painted. I was fortunate enough to purchase the very last OEM sunroof-delete headliner from BMW in Germany. It came out perfect, but unfortunately the ex got that car in the divorce...

[rogbmw]

And Steffen got that headliner because I ordered it to do the same thing, then decided not to and returned it to BMW...Funny how small the world is. I think the biggest challenge would be making a headliner from one for a regular sunroof. But...if Steffen could just snitch that one from his Ex we could have a template made....just sayin'!!!!

[Sniff38]

If you have the ability to delete it properly so it looks good inside and out and doesn't break the bank, then I say go for it. There are plenty of E31's out there with working sunroofs and plenty of them out there that have issues. There aren't many that are sunroof delete.

FWIW, I never use mine and the previous owner spent $1500 on a sunroof rebuild a couple years back. I'm just waiting for the time when one of those uber expensive plastic bits fails and leaves me stranded with an open roof (perhaps that's why I don't use it). I've often thought BMW needlessly overcomplicated some things in the E31, so if you have a chance to simplify something (and increase reliability) and it makes you happy, then all the better.

[blanz]

When i bought my car i removed the inner panel and have never had a problem with the sunroof. The inner panel seems like a waste of time.

After buying two new racks for the sliding inner panel, and working for two days to get it to work nice nice with the sunroof, I removed it from the roof, walked out to the edge of the woods by my house, and proceeded to throw it as hard as I could. Then grabbed a beer, found the panel, and pissed on it!
The sunroof is a nice option to keep. The inner panel and related mechanism was the biggest piece of crap That ever came out of the hallowed halls of BMW.

[TxGR8White]

And Steffen got that headliner because I ordered it to do the same thing, then decided not to and returned it to BMW...Funny how small the world is. I think the biggest challenge would be making a headliner from one for a regular sunroof. But...if Steffen could just snitch that one from his Ex we could have a template made....just sayin'!!!!

I heard that the car may come up for sale...
I think even if I offered $100,000, it wouldn't be for sale to me, not that I would want to drive anymore anyway.

[dragon850]

After buying two new racks for the sliding inner panel, and working for two days to get it to work nice nice with the sunroof, I removed it from the roof, walked out to the edge of the woods by my house, and proceeded to throw it as hard as I could. Then grabbed a beer, found the panel, and pissed on it!
The sunroof is a nice option to keep. The inner panel and related mechanism was the biggest piece of crap That ever came out of the hallowed halls of BMW.

Oh boy! LOL, I don't blame you one bit...took tremendous discipline and phone support from cartoonz for me not to take it to fursideup's ranch and use it for target practice!

[Timm]

You mean you didn't run over it with the car? You're slacking!

[radlaw]

Basically, I purchased a new steel sunroof panel (the old one had too much rust on it), and used 1/8" steel rods as the "filler" between the panel and the roof. After it was all MIG welded, the seal was filled, sanded and primed and painted.

I imagine with the delete headliner, the mechanism is removed. What about leaving the mechanism in, keeping the sliding panel and using a "sunroof" headliner, since the delete ones are NLA?

[radlaw]

As for the headliner, I'm not worried. I deal with an amazing upholsterer and he will make me a new headliner. As a matter of fact, sunroof delete or not I was also thinking about redoing the headliner and pillars in black Alcantara!

If you convert from sunroof to sunroof delete, don't you also have to replace the foam backing and/or board between the headliner and the roof? It has the same sunroof opening the headliner has and allows for the sunroof mechanism. Once the sunroof & carriage is gone, doesn't the foam and board also need to be replaced with a "sunroof delete" foam/board?

[dukegrad98]

I have considered both a welded-in steel option as discussed above, or having something like a Lexan panel cut to fit the sunroof cutout. After removing the mechanism and inner panel, and recovering the existing headliner, I would think that you could accomplish a decent-looking "permanent moonroof." I haven't studied the curvature of the roof enough to think about whether the plastic would have to be shaped to continue the curve without being a big flat spot on top -- but that issue extends to the metal solution as well. I would think that the existing sunroof panel could serve as a mold to heat-bend the plastic to match its shape fairly easily. I'm equally comfortable with welding and bonding -- but welding things shut will require precautions to avoid burning anything unintentionally. With all the sunroof-delete headliners gone, replacement will just require fab work from a good interior guy -- whether just to fill the hole in the sunroof headliner or to recreate something closer to the delete headliner.

Cheers, John

[garylafortuna]

Anybody remember this? Carbon fiber roof details

[TxGR8White]

If you convert from sunroof to sunroof delete, don't you also have to replace the foam backing and/or board between the headliner and the roof? It has the same sunroof opening the headliner has and allows for the sunroof mechanism. Once the sunroof & carriage is gone, doesn't the foam and board also need to be replaced with a "sunroof delete" foam/board?

No, because the sunroof delete headliner does not have the hole in it. You get rid of the complete sunroof cassette and the inner panel - they are not required anymore. The sunroof delete headliner also sits closer to the underside of the roof structure and is very flat. It is also missing the sunroof switch and motor protrusion as well.

[rockytt]

Yeah - I remember seeing Yu's cf roof. I loved the look and thought about doing it a few times. Haven't seen him since he did the roof and wonder how it has held up.