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Thread: Engine weights, current figures: 351w, 302, m20. NEED: ls1, m60, m42, 1jz/2jz

  1. #1
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    Engine weights: 351w, 302, m20, m42, m52, Ls (Al/Fe), need: m60, 1jz/2jz 56K WARNING!

    *update 3/24/16* - M52 weight added. It's official folks, the LS is finally getting its boat anchor status revealed

    So as some of you may know, I'm doing a 351w swap on my car. I decided to weigh everything so that I could know how much heavier the 351 is vs a 302, because science or whatever

    Once I yank my m50 out, I'll have that weight figure too, but it would be nice to have LS and other swap figures as well. If anyone wants to donate some pics of their other swap engine weights I'm sure the community would appreciate it

    I wish I had the forethought to take these pictures in some semblance of order, but I didn't so... we're gonna deal with it as-is, reorganizing everything will be too much of a PITA

    edit - I also realized after scrolling for 30 seconds I'm gonna lose most people without doing a TLDR version for the weights

    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, UNCONFIRMED
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    m50b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs



    351W

    CAMSHAFT - 8lbs



    PRESSURE PLATE/CLUTCH - 20.5lbs



    FLYWHEEL - 10lbs



    '94-95 MUSTANG WATER PUMP - 3lbs



    ALUMINUM HEADS, INC ROLLER ROCKERS AND HARDWARE - 32lbs x 2



    3G ALTERNATOR - 12.5lbs



    ALUMINUM OE VALVE COVERS - 6lbs



    SPIDER TRAY AND ROLLER LIFTER RETAINERS - .75lbs



    8 HYDRAULIC ROLLER LIFTERS - 2.125lbs x2



    CAM/CRANK GEAR + DOUBLE ROLLER TIMING CHAIN - 2lbs



    CAMSHAFT RETAINER PLATE - .25lbs



    HIGH VOLUME OIL PUMP + OIL PUMP DRIVESHAFT - 4.5lbs



    SPARK PLUG WIRES - 1.5lbs



    ALTERNATOR BRACKET - 2lbs



    TIMING POINTER - .125lbs



    OIL PRESSURE SENSOR ADAPTER - .5lbs



    FUEL PRESSURE REGULATOR - .75lbs



    OIL FILTER RELOCATER - 1.125lbs



    AIR FILTER ASSEMBLY - 1.5lbs



    PUSHRODS, HARDENED - 1.5lbs



    DISTRIBUTOR, COILLESS GM HEI STYLE - 4lbs



    CARBURETOR - 7lbs



    OIL PAN W/KICKOUTS, BAFFLES AND PICKUP - 14.5lbs



    HEAD STUDS - 4lbs



    POWER STEERING PUMP + DIY BRACKET - 5.5lbs



    COMPACT STARTER W/SOLENOID - 6lbs



    '94-95 5.0 TIMING COVER - 1.5lbs



    FULL SET OF GASKETS, STILL IN PACKAGING - 2lbs



    THERMOSTAT - .25lbs



    TRANS PLATE - 2.5lbs



    SHORTY HEADERS - 5lbs x 2



    HARMONIC BALANCER - 7.5lbs



    T5 TRANSMISSION, INC BELLHOUSING, FLUID AND SHIFTER -97lbs




    351W SHORTBLOCK, MINUS WEIGHT OF LIFTING CHAIN - 251lbs






    351W INTAKE MANIFOLD - 15lbs




    TOTAL 351W WEIGHT - 572.5lbs

    302

    In the past I basically did the same thing with an old 302. I will not be posting every single picture from those measurements, as the 302 shares many parts with the 351w

    302 BARE BLOCK - 105lbs




    302 50 OZ IMBALANCE CRANKSHAFT - 35lbs



    50OZ HARMONIC BALANCER - 7.5lbs



    302 MAIN CAPS - 7lbs




    302 OIL PUMP + DRIVESHAFT - 2.5lbs



    302 GM HEI STYLE DISTRIBUTOR - 3lbs



    302 INTAKE MANIFOLD - 16.5lbs



    302 OIL PAN + PICKUP - 6lbs



    302 PISTON + CONNECTING ROD - 2.25lbs x 8



    302 HEAD BOLT - .125lbs x 20



    302 WEIGHT - 475lbs


    M20 WEIGHT, COURTESY OF VORSHLAG - 497lbs




    LS STUFF

    The general consensus is that an aluminum blocked LS weighs in the ballpark of 600lbs with a t56. Guys with iron blocked LS swaps are probably more so around 700lbs, based off of this block weight difference found on ls1tech
    http://ls1tech.com/forums/generation...ls-blocks.html

    LS1 ALUMINUM BLOCK - 105lbs


    LS IRON BLOCK - 215lbs


    LS1 + T56 COURTESY OF VORSHLAG


    M42 + TRANS COURTESY OF VORSHLAG





    M52B25

    Finally got my engine out. For reference, the dials of the scales I'm using max out at 300lbs, but are rated for a little bit more I think







    It all adds up to 548lbs, but I subtracted 4lbs for the chains. This seems right, as I think I remember someone on r3vlimited years ago that a m5x combo was about 50lbs heavier than a m20 combo

    Last edited by jalopi; 03-24-2016 at 07:54 PM.
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  2. #2
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    I can tell you the OEM CTS-V flywheel I took off is 50lbs.... I also found this for the LS1 (mt weight is with flywheel) Total dressed engine mass (wt.) dry
    457.6 lb. automatic
    497.2 lb. manual

    - - - Updated - - -

    and google also has this

    351W.
    The 351 Windsor, built from 1969 to 1996, adds 0.5" to the stroke of the 302. It is of considerably stouter construction. Engine weight is 510 lbs.

  3. #3
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    i mean, i've seen tons of advertised weights on the internet, but some of them are so off that i just can't believe them, i was hoping for first-hand weights

    your google ls1 weights are probably fairly close - for instance, in my old thread on r3vlimited, one of the guys who sells ls1 swap kits for the e30 weighed his aluminum blocked ls1+trans at 604lbs, though that included an AC compressor

    http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=358052

    that 351 weight off of google is soooooo bullshit though. super misleading. that figure can't include accessories or anything, can't forget that they also came with iron heads and (sometimes) iron intake manifolds from the factory, so that's an extra 50lbs minimum

    which is exactly why i made this thread. non-bs engine weights FTW
    Last edited by jalopi; 03-23-2016 at 12:27 PM.
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  4. #4
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    Awesome! I'm really interested to see what the M50 weighs. One of my biggest regrets is not measuring the weight of the S52 before I sold it off.

  5. #5
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    m52 weight added, mostly dry engine
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  6. #6
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    Maybe just put the weight in text instead of a pic?? might save some time lol.
    If I ever take my 1jz out of the e28 I'll weigh some stuff
    instagram @andyitslit

  7. #7
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    oh trust me, i don't like spending as much time as i have taking pictures of what my stuff weighs rain man style... but without any sort of concrete evidence i'd have the LS fanbois of the internet feverishly posting about how there's no way that an iron block 302 combo is over 100lbs lighter than an aluminum block LS combo, they'd call me crazy for saying that a LS swap can add between 70-290lbs to the weight of their cars. it's happened in the past, but i didn't have the pics to prove it back then. been trying to kill this "lightweight" LS swap myth for years now
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalopi View Post
    oh trust me, i don't like spending as much time as i have taking pictures of what my stuff weighs rain man style... but without any sort of concrete evidence i'd have the LS fanbois of the internet feverishly posting about how there's no way that an iron block 302 combo is over 100lbs lighter than an aluminum block LS combo, they'd call me crazy for saying that a LS swap can add between 70-290lbs to the weight of their cars. it's happened in the past, but i didn't have the pics to prove it back then. been trying to kill this "lightweight" LS swap myth for years now
    If it's to prove it to doubters then I understand. I on the other hand will just take your word for it.
    instagram @andyitslit

  9. #9
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    What does that LS1/T56 vorshlag picture say? I can't read their scale in the pic

    - - - Updated - - -

    Nevermind, I found the TLDR version. Any idea what swap that came out of? There can be a +-30lb+ difference in that weight depending on what clutch/flywheel it has in it,

  10. #10
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    no idea, but they specifically mentioned that it's a ls1 and it doesn't have the batwing oil pan, so i guess a camaro/transam?
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  11. #11
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    I have an M62b44 on the stand with everything except fuel rails/injectors, starter, and an alternator I think. I can try to get a weight on that beast if you want.

  12. #12
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    oooh that would be cool to have, i'm sure the internet would (hopefully) appreciate it
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  13. #13
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    i know it's not a "popular swap" (or ever been done?) but what about an M30b35? I can't remember how much those things weigh, but i have one that i've been thinking about stuffing in my E36 just to be different.
    13 Grand Cherokee Limited V8 - Daily Driver - Wife
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    90 BMW 535i/5 - i should probably work on this again...

  14. #14
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    i was initially gonna do that too, but then protomor yelled at me for wanting to put old engine tech into a newer car. so, naturally, i decided to go for a carb'd small block ford :P

    from what i gathered during my time at r3vlimited, the m30 weighs about as much as the m50, though this is something i read about YEARS ago

    the biggest flaw that i can think of with the m30 (from reading kamotors' swap thread on r3v http://www.r3vlimited.com/board/showthread.php?t=225271 ) is that clutch options are very limited for the m30. there's also the issue of the oil pan sump - to my knowledge, there are no rear sump m30 pans.

    but man do those things make some stupid power with a turbo and stock internals (albeit the same could be said about the m50, lool)

    i'll see if i can't dig up some real numbers just for hahas
    Last edited by jalopi; 04-05-2016 at 07:32 PM.
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  15. #15
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    yeah. i realize its quite a step backwards in tech with minimal power gains. the E30 guys do it, but that makes sense since it's just a larger M20. Only reason i kick the idea around from time to time is because i have a motor and they're torque monsters. plus there's always the hate factor from the rest of the E36 crowd to fuel my swap desires
    13 Grand Cherokee Limited V8 - Daily Driver - Wife
    97 Z3 2.8 Roadster
    95 325i Sedan - Project #ebayE36
    90 BMW 535i/5 - i should probably work on this again...

  16. #16
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    yeah if you could figure out a solid solution for the oil pan then it'd be a pretty cool swap
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  17. #17
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    Since I still haven't allocated an hour or two to getting the M62b44 (non-VANOS) off of the engine stand for weighing, I thought I would make sure you knew about this extremely accurate and reliable component weight information for M62b44TU (single VANOS) engines:

    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...5#post27798475

    The 4.4 bare block with the main bearing caps weighs 77.5 Lbs.
    The crank weighs 43.2 Lbs.
    Pistons weigh 2.45 Lbs. (each, with rods and cap)
    The heads weigh 55 Lbs. (each) with vanos and cams

    - - - Updated - - -

    Do you happen to know off hand how much extra a strong 302 block weighs compared to a light weight "splits in half at 500hp" 5.0 block?
    Last edited by tptrsn; 09-04-2016 at 08:51 PM.

  18. #18
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    good to know! maybe we'll have the full weight soon, though if i had to guess it's somewhere in the 1UZ ballpark of 400-450lbs

    i don't think the 302 blocks are that much stronger than the later model roller blocks, even the mexican blocks that people love to look for. i think the mexican blocks have a bit more beef in the webbing, but at those power levels its the main caps that really show their weakness on the 302. which nothing short of a dart block with 4 bolt mains will fix that issue, but a dart would add 50lbs to the weight. and a t5 would never survive behind 500whp, so you'd need a TKO, so add another 50lbs to the weight, then you're pretty much in LS territory. sub/around 300whp though, it's hard to beat the SBF
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  19. #19
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    Yeah, I think you're on the money there. I had a carburetted SBF years ago that was in the 386-400 crank horsepower in various iterations (engine dyno with only water pump and alternator, and with 1 5/8" dyno headers). It used a slightly overbored 85 roller block, and it was a real nice combo with a T5. I only lost third gear in them every once in a great while, and that was before there were a lot of easily accessible "World Class" T5s around. Not too bad for T5 life, haha.

    My favorite setup had flat hydraulic lifters in it and probably a bit too much cam, 236/244 @ .050" on a 108 LSA IIRC, and slightly more lift on the intakes than the exhausts. It's something Don Walsh hit on at Roush Racing way back when. That combo really liked to rev, and made nice power, 9:1 compression ratio on flat top hypereutectic pistons with flycuts for the 2.02/1.60 valves in the first generation Dart windsor heads. Block never fell in half, which was nice. I'd like to have that one back...
    Last edited by tptrsn; 09-05-2016 at 11:45 AM. Reason: Trying to be accurate

  20. #20
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    it's only too much cam when the engine can't idle... at all


    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  21. #21
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    Aaaaaaymen, brother jalopi!

  22. #22
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    I think I might actually be getting closer to finally weighing an M62, but probably not until spring at this point. I'd like to weigh it in as complete a state as possible to increase accuracy, and the one I have on the stand just keeps getting less and less complete...

    Did you ever run across any semi-accurate appearing weights for 2JZ or 1JZ?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by tptrsn View Post
    Did you ever run across any semi-accurate appearing weights for 2JZ or 1JZ?
    Too late to weigh mine now
    instagram @andyitslit

  24. #24
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    All the speculative figures I've seen on the internet seem to say something in the ballpark of 700lbs for a stock engine. But turbos and cast iron manifolds are heavy, so I'd guess that a single turbo setup with a pipe manifold is in the ballpark of 600lbs
    Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
    M42 + trans - 427lbs
    302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
    m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
    m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs

    351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
    LS,
    aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
    LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
    http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalopi View Post
    All the speculative figures I've seen on the internet seem to say something in the ballpark of 700lbs for a stock engine. But turbos and cast iron manifolds are heavy, so I'd guess that a single turbo setup with a pipe manifold is in the ballpark of 600lbs
    according to this it weighs 496lbs
    I'd say from removing the twins they were ballpark 40-60lbs. I've still got them so I can throw that on a scale tonight
    Last edited by Press22; 01-11-2017 at 02:59 PM.
    instagram @andyitslit

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