Mason Engineering Z3 Clutch Pedal Review

[Vintage42]

The bushings should take some effort to press into the pedal; you want the bushings to rotate on the pedal mounting pin, not spin in the pedal bore. I would get another set of bushings, or carefully apply some red flavored Loctite (271 or equivalent) between the pedal bore and the bushing exterior surface. 600 series Loctite would be best, but you can find 271 at most auto parts stores.

My new bronze bushings are 3 years old. I wonder if another set of bushings would be any different. It seems more likely that the bronze bushings have not changed, but the bore of the Mason pedal has been enlarged. The UUC solid plastic bushings also take no effort to push in, and if they had the weight of the bronze, they would fall out, too. The OE plastic bushings only take effort to push in because they are made larger than the bore and and are slit and compress as they are inserted.

If I was to glue the bronze bushings to the powder coated bore, would not epoxy be better than Loctite?
Should glue be used on the solid plastic bushings, too?

I don't think either the solid bronze or the solid plastic bushings should be glued, but rather should be greased on both sides like the slit OE bushing. The gap where the the bushings meet inside the bore will allow grease inside the bushings to move to the oustides, anyway.

Or maybe it would be better to avoid the solid bronze and solid plastic bushings, and use the slit compressible OE bushing which is clearly made so its concave cylinder walls and huge slit will hold a lot of grease and move it around inside and outside the bushing.

[Vintage42]

I suggest measuring the pivot bushing bore diameter of your pedal.
I just measured my OEM pedal bore, which calipered at 17.3mm.
If your pedal bore is much larger than that you might consider contacting Mason Engineering.

My Mason pedal bore is 18.3mm. Just under halfway between 18 and 19 on my crude little pocket caliper. Perhaps Mason increased the bore in the second group buy in order to accommodate the bronze bushing, which did not fit in the earlier Mason bores.
I wonder what other people are doing, what bushings they are using.

[Vintage42]

I suggest measuring the pivot bushing bore diameter of your pedal.
I just measured my OEM pedal bore, which calipered at 17.3mm.
If your pedal bore is much larger than that you might consider contacting Mason Engineering.

Just me? What about the other 20+ buyers?
The bronze bushings would not fit into the previous Mason pedal bores without being sanded down. Now they fit. Evidently the new pedals have a larger bore, about 1mm. Perhaps that is to accommodate the bronze bushings (and the solid plastic UUC bushings which are the same size).
Should the bronze and solid plastic bushings be inserted into the new Mason pedals with their outsides loose, or greased or glued? Three different choices.
Or should we just use the default -- insert the OE slit bushings with grease all over them, as Mason furnished?

[Vintage42]

The I.E. bronze bushings did not fit until I mildly relieved the pedal bushing bore. I still needed to use my Big Ass® bench vise to press in the bushings; I'm pretty sure the I.E. bushings are tapered.

My Bimmerbum bushings made by AKG are not tapered. The caliper slides from one end to the other unchanged.
http://shop.bimmerbum.com/products/5...al-bushing-set
https://www.akgmotorsport.com/produc...or-bmw-bronze/

So we have tapered bushings made by Ireland Engineering (harder to make) and straight bronze bushings made by AKG? And if I get bronze bushings from IE, I can press them in without Locktite or epoxy?
That is interesting, as is what I tell my eBay buyer when I sell my AKG bronze bushings.

[Eurospec]

To set the record straight... the pedal was designed from the get-go to accommodate and run the OE, slotted bushings (plastic). No alterations have been made to the pedal to accommodate anything but the STOCK bushings-- hence why they are provided with the pedal.

If you choose to upgrade from stock and don't want to deal with the brass type, then delrin is the way to go. From my experience (garagistics/ UUC) both are plug and play.

[Vintage42]

To set the record straight... the pedal was designed from the get-go to accommodate and run the OE, slotted bushings (plastic). No alterations have been made to the pedal to accommodate anything but the STOCK bushings-- hence why they are provided with the pedal. If you choose to upgrade from stock and don't want to deal with the brass type, then delrin is the way to go. From my experience (garagistics/ UUC) both are plug and play.

The bronze and the delrin bushings that I have are identical in size and fit. The bronze are so heavy that they can drop out. Why should there be any difference in "dealing with" the bronze or the delrin?
Why not just grease them up and put them in, either one?
Edit: The OE slotted plastic bushings are so springy that they could fit in a wide range of bore diameters. They squeeze shut as they are inserted.
Edit: This started because someone said the bronze bushings should be Locktited. Aside from the question of locktiting a slip fit, what is the matter with greasing the whole bushing of any material before inserting it?

[deni2s]

So any decent reviews on how noticeable is improvement and what improved, what's changed, what got worse, apart from usual "greatest thing happened to my car" which means nothing as probably all car mods got this comment at some point?

Would like to read more opinions while waiting for my delivery...

[tq3z]

So any decent reviews on how noticeable is improvement and what improved, what's changed, what got worse, apart from usual "greatest thing happened to my car" which means nothing as probably all car mods got this comment at some point?

Would like to read more opinions while waiting for my delivery...

It's a lot more natural/sporty to operate three pedals that are at the same height. This is a huge issue I had with the coupe.

What changed? I didn't notice much more pressure to operate the clutch, but the obvious is the clutch pedal height lowering. Nothing got worse, total upside for me (You may have different results). There's not much else going on here other than that. This item doesn't need a formal review - it's straightforward as it gets.

I have not had any issues with the bushings noted above.

[Vintage42]

... I have not had any issues with the bushings noted above.

Me neither, but that is because I have three kinds of bushings and have not decided which ones to install ;-) Which bushings did you install?

- - - Updated - - -

... keeping the clutch depressed for extended periods at stop lights required noticeably more effort...

Holding the clutch depressed and the transmission in gear at stop lights? I thought was to be avoided, and at every stop I shift to neutral and release the clutch.

[E.Hands]

I find clutch work to be the fastest and easiest part of the gear change. It's hard for me to imagine that there is that much room for improvement in clutch feel with a pedal change. I think I would try one of the improved shifters from CAE, RTD or Coolerworx first.
My 2 cents

[Vintage42]

... It's hard for me to imagine that there is that much room for improvement in clutch feel with a pedal change. I think I would try one of the improved shifters from CAE, RTD or Coolerworx first...

The Mason kit is to replace a clutch pedal that has a dry, worn bearing that makes it squeaky, stiff and wiggly.

[tq3z]

Me neither, but that is because I have three kinds of bushings and have not decided which ones to install ;-) Which bushings did you install?

- - - Updated - - -

Holding the clutch depressed and the transmission in gear at stop lights? I thought was to be avoided, and at every stop I shift to neutral and release the clutch.

Delrin!

[Vintage42]

That would be the UUC pedal bushing.
My concern over habitually holding the clutch depressed during long stops is the throwout bearing.

[BimmerBreaker]

European driving tests will fail you for not holding in gear when stopped. The logic being if you are rear ended its better to end up in gear and thus stalling instead of rolling into the intersection. I shift into N as well, but some may not consider that proper

[deni2s]

European driving tests will fail you for not holding in gear when stopped. The logic being if you are rear ended its better to end up in gear and thus stalling instead of rolling into the intersection. I shift into N as well, but some may not consider that proper

Maybe depends on country, never heard anything like that. Leaving your foot on clutch pedal while not shifting is considered bad practice.

[chemicalviper]

Kind of bumping this out the dark - Bought the pedal online.

Has anyone paired this pedal with a SS clutch line kit?/CDV delete? Just wondering if I should delete the CDV at the same time when replacing the clutch line. I bought the rogue engineering one.
clu_04_450b.jpg

[rf900rkw]

Can't delete what you don't have. First off, need to understand that it is not a delay valve. It's an anti-abuse valve. Next, understand that the M's never had one. What they do have is a line with one end slightly smaller than the other. The M owners decided that this was some sort of magical valve and must be deleted. I figure it's just CDV envy.

[95maxrider]

Is the GD still ongoing? I think I want in after reading through this whole thing!

[CMM3]

Mason Pedal, Gargastic Bushings, Regular e36 M3 clutch return spring in my car. Might make the clutch effort a little too heavy for S&G everyday driving. But the engagement is so much more predictable and the pedal is rock solid.

[raubritter]

Update: After about 3 hours driving with the pedal I got pretty much used to it. I feel like it was a positive upgrade overall, though expensive. The clutch pedal feel is now very solid, direct, connected... though a lot of that also comes from the bronze bushings.
---------
Extremely long review follows, but here's the end result:



After first reading this thread a few months ago, I got excited about fixing the flimsy sloppy squeaky clutch pedal feel in my car and ordered the Mason Pedal and AKG bronze bushings. Also I figured since I would have the pedals out, I would also put on metal pedal covers (I got the stainless AKG ones... end result is nice, but I had to file down all the sharp edges and also bend them in a vise to make them match the form of the pedals. So be prepared to finish the manufacturing of these pedal covers yourself if you get them). Here are my thoughts and experiences:

First, if I had to do it over again I would first just replace the flimsy plastic stock bushings with bronze AKG bushings. I think this will solve most of the problems with the stock clutch pedal. I didn't realize until I had already bought the Mason pedal and then took the stock pedal out that the stock pedal is a very rigid plastic. From the flimsy feel I had thought the pedal itself was flimsy, but it's not. So I think the sloppy feeling comes mostly or completely from the flimsy plastic bushings (note that the problem is the design of the bushings, not the durability of the material: the stock bushings are apparently indestructible-- unlike many other plastic parts in the Z3, the clutch and brake pedal bushings both looked and felt like new when I took them out).

On the topic of bushings, since I also had to take the brake pedal out to put on the new grommets and the pedal covers, I also replaced the brake pedal bushings with another pair of bronze AKG bushings. Both pedals have the same bore size for the bushing to fit into, and the 2 pedals + bushings slide onto identical diameter pins in the pedal support structure in the car. So the AKG bushings worked perfectly for the brake and clutch pedals of my 3.0 (can't speak for other models).

The Mason pedal came with the bore hole pre-filed (very roughly... after painting) to a larger diameter. The AKG bushing fit fine in one side, but I had to file a little bit of metal from the other side to get the bushing to go in. A worse issue would show itself later- the flanges on the AKG bushings covered the recess for the clip that secures the whole assembly (pedal and bushings) onto the pin.

So I had to file off some paint blobs and some metal from the sides of the Mason petal where the AKG bushing flanges touch. The positive to this is that I filed off only enough so that the clip could fit really tightly so there's no side-to-side play possible, and also that the AKG bushing flanges fit nice and flush to the pedal. Not a big deal, but something to be prepared for if you get the Mason pedal.

Unlike the pedal bushings, the return spring grommets for brake and clutch pedals were all in various states of decay. I couldn't get them locally and the only place online that had them in stock was Pelican parts. Waiting for these parts added about a week to this project, so if you're planning to work on your pedals it would probably be best to assume yours are destroyed and order new ones in advance.

For the 3.0, the brake return spring grommets are 35-41-1-113-728 and the clutch return spring grommets are 35-31-1-113-725. You need two for each pedal.

However, if I had to do it over, I would get 3 brake spring grommets (narrower) and 1 clutch spring grommet (wider). The only place you need the (wider) clutch spring grommet is on the top end of the brake return spring (which is a good thing, because that is the most difficult one to get in place-- lying on your back over the door sill and only really able to get one hand up in there).

The brake grommets are narrower and a better fit for the other 3 points of attachment (brake spring point on the brake pedal, Mason clutch pedal, and upper clutch spring mount point). However, if you are keeping the stock clutch pedal, I think it requires the wider clutch spring grommet so you'd need 2 of each type in that case.

At any rate, getting these grommets on was annoying and painful to my fingers but I didn't bother to use liquid soap or anything. The main problem is the upper spring mount for the brake pedal because it's so hard to get to. But luckily the wider clutch grommet is also softer and easier to get in place. Yes it's strange that the brake spring would require a clutch spring grommet, but when you see it you'll understand-- the metal of the bracket is too wide for the narrow brake spring grommet. Anyway, that was my experience.

Pros:
-- Faster shifting. Basically the altered geometry of the pedal seems to change the clutch engagement point so that all clutch engagement is compressed up into about the top 1/3 of pedal travel. It might be top 1/2, but it feels pretty extreme. The pedal is also lower, so the overall range of movement is less than the stock pedal. Anyway, the Mason pedal would allow you to use a very high clutch stop... Much of the pedal travel now is useless.

-- Nice solid feel (of course most or all of that is due to the AKG bronze bushings).

-- Pedal is lower so that it lines up somewhat better with brake pedal.


Cons:
-- After all of this, I now suspect BMW made the stock clutch pedal plastic so that with such a light mass, it will vibrate more, giving you a better feel for clutch engagement. The metal Mason pedal has a much greater mass and doesn't pass much vibration through to your foot so you have to 'listen' harder to the feel of the clutch through your foot. I try to shift as fast as possible, so this only comes into play when I'm moving off from a dead stop.

-- Clutch engagement is.... strange. When I finished install and first tried the car, I thought I had left something disconnected or messed something up because the car just revved and wouldn't move when letting out the clutch pedal. But then I kept letting the clutch pedal up farther and farther and finally the car started to move.

Basically the geometry of the pedal seems to change the clutch engagement point so that all clutch engagement is compressed up into about the top 1/3 of pedal travel. This is a 'pro' for fast shifting. But a 'con' for weird feeling when taking off from a stop. I've been driving the car with this pedal for about 3 hours total and I'm still getting used to it. This pedal will let you relive what it's like to be learning to drive stick for the first time I now think some of the weirdness comes from the somewhat numb feel that I mentioned earlier--- the plastic pedal let you know what the clutch was doing more obviously than the metal Mason pedal does.

-- Obviously it's very expensive... And you get the surprise $30 shipping fee (the pedal is small and only weighs like 3lbs) jumped on you after you've gone through all the order process. But by that point you've already decided to pay $245 or whatever for a clutch pedal so what's $30 more...

All in all, I'm very glad I did the replacement of the grommets (no more spring noises) and upgraded the bushings to AKG bronze (no more slop). The pedal covers turned out well (though they required a lot of finishing work considering the $150 price, and also took a lot of work perfectly placing the holes that have to be drilled through the pedals). The Mason pedal............ well, I'm still not sure. I like the faster shifting but don't like the reduced feel. I'll have to spend more time with it to see. It will probably be cool with a TALL clutch stop.

[deni2s]

Hm, got pedal installed at the shop, probably they used the same bushings as I had on original pedal. Got the armed clutch line with CDV delete installed at the same time, and also UUC shortshifter, Supersprint exhaust system and suspension. Truth to be told, I didn't noticed much difference in pedal feel. It was fine before and fine now. If I would know it is changed, probably I wouldn't even notice that something has been changed. Maybe that's because the car was in good condition before, or too many other more drastic changes, to notice this. Feeling is totally fine, but I wouldn't do it again, also knowing that it's not very cheap. Or maybe I just get used to good things pretty fast, and would notice if would go back to stock.

[Vintage42]

It seems that on my pedal, the ears that operate the switches could have been located better. I had a tech do the installation, and he said he had to bend an ear to make the car start. Months later when I first tried the cruise control, I found it did not work unless the clutch pedal was pulled out with my toe. So instead of bending the other ear, I bent the switch's bracket.
https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...0#post30006560

[rf900rkw]

Sometimes I am amazed at the effort people will go through to avoid the simple fix. The switches are adjustable.

[Vintage42]

Sometimes I am amazed at the effort people will go through to avoid the simple fix. The switches are adjustable.

People don't avoid the simple fix; they just don't know about it. How is the clutch switch adjusted? Looking at it mounted on its bracket, I would not realize that.

[rf900rkw]

The same as the brake light switch. The red ring around the stem is the adjuster. Pull it out a ways, and then let the pedal travel push it in the required amount. Pull the adjuster all of the way out and it releases the switch from the bracket. How many DIYs and youtube vids tell you the only way to remove the switch is to break it out.... advice worth exactly what you paid for it.