Shopping for a 5-Series Wagon

[pbonsalb]

The AT really is pretty good. As fast as the 6 speed manual. There is an 08 535xit with 59k and auto and some mods for sale on N54Tech for $17k.

You could probably do a 6 speed manual conversion on one. No idea what is involved. I know people who have changed autos to manuals on E36M3, E38 740i and other cars.

[jomama]

They (535xi) will become available. It may take months, but when one comes up, you will need to pounce as soon you find one. You are looking nationwide, right? I bought mine from California and I live in Massachusetts.

Yes, looking in North America.

[jomama]

Guy is selling MT 2010 535x with 65K for $27K. Almost $7K over KBB. I'm passing.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...ink=true&Log=0

[mbhurley]

KBB Means nothing for this "rare" car. As a perspective, in 2010, I looked at a 08 wagon with 22K miles and a price of $34,500 from a dealer. In 2013 I looked at 2010 with 39K miles for $33K from another dealer, and a 09 with 34K miles $32K. All 535xiT's with a MT. None had warranties after 50K miles.

I think $27,800 is too much, but I could see this car for $23-$24K, Especially if it is in great shape. Several reasons:

1. Has a extended warranty for another 1.5 years up to 100K miles.
2. Relatively low miles for a 2010
3. It is rare - Don't make anymore and not likely to have another MT wagon model from BMW ever again. Also, not many MT made in e61 body for States; only like 300 or so from '06 - '10.
4. It has most of the goodies, no sport pkg though.
5. All the things the owner claims to have done to it show good maintenance schedule.

I bought my 2007 530xiT three years ago (April 2013) with 54K miles, no warranty for $21,900. Sold it last month for $15,000 with 90K miles with some scraps and small dents and other small cosmetic issues. Damn shopping cart!

You might want to drop the owner a note and see how firm they are on price. I don't think it will go for almost $28K, but I could see $23K.

[jomama]

I agree in paying more for a rare car but $7K is bordering on insulting. ~$2-4K I can understand as I was the owner of a rare MT, 2004 Volvo V70R, in flash green with an Atacama interior and low miles but even that car, I only sold for a few G's over BB. The greatest thing about that car was that I drove it for over 2 years, put at least 25K on it and still made a healthy profit! I'll wait until this guy settles down and probably make an offer around the $20-23 range. If it were in a color I loved, I might offer more but the white just isn't my style.

[DaHose]

As the saying goes, "it's worth whatever someone is willing to pay". In California it is hard to sell wagons, so ours sat on a lot for a long time. The dust was so thick on the INSIDE that I wiped my finger on the arm rest and left a clean track. I swear it must have been sitting over 6 months. What's funny is that when I asked to see the 530 wagon, our sales guy completely ignored the "wagon" part and grabbed the keys for a sedan they had prepped. He was completely surprised to hear someone wanted the wagon. We paid well below KBB, but our 06 530xi has an auto. tranny.

If you don't gotta have it now, then I agree. Hold off and see if it sits. Then make an offer if it's still there.

Jose

[jomama]

Has anyone seen a 08+ MT E61 for sale recently?

[sean911sc]

I just sold my E39 Touring with 304K after getting a 07' 530xiT. It sat for a good month at the dealer. I wasn't really looking for a E61, but after a while the enjoyment of a new car project was appealing. The N52 has the mid-range powerband that surprised me considering I had the 525i for 6 yiears as a daily driver. I'd like the 535, but due to the amount of driving I do the maintenance of a turbo engine was a key factor. Keep in mind I'll be on the lookout for a E61 535xiT fully loaded as a non daily driver.

[daka]

Ahhh, an 08 -10 Automatic (must be wifeable) I'd jump on a clean one....HELP

[jomama]

For a 2010 535ix with ~85K miles - how likely is it that I would have to repair or replace the turbos? I've heard horror stories about the turbos but usually after 100K. Should I be concerned? Is it really that big an issue?

(automatic = wifeable - that's funny, mine only drives stick)

[KingDavidsCourt]

For a 2010 535ix with ~85K miles - how likely is it that I would have to repair or replace the turbos? I've heard horror stories about the turbos but usually after 100K. Should I be concerned? Is it really that big an issue?

(automatic = wifeable - that's funny, mine only drives stick)

Most of the issues I've seen (and they are significant *see my few other posts in the E60 section) none of them are terminal. The block is bulletproof even under a ton of upgrades (see above) The turbos seem to be strong, although the wastegates can be troublesome. EVERY GASKET WILL NEED REPLACED RELATIVELY FREQUENTLY. EVERY one... valve cover (and thats not an easy job) Oil pan (and thats not an easy job) Oil filter housing... and then theres the Walnut blasting of the manifold. Direct port injection builds carbon in there and it's recommended every 50k i think. If you can do this work yourself... materials are next to nothing (i bought all gaskets, and oil catch can, plugs, new silicone vacuum lines and a few other pieces for 500$ or so)... but a shop, even an indy will charge a small fortune for this list of replacements. When it runs well... it's a joy to drive. Expect various things to fail though... they will.

[pbonsalb]

Have you done the oil pan gasket on a 535xi? The front axles go through it. Looks like a rough job. I have done the intake manifold gasket, intake manifold gaskets, oil filter housing to block and oil cooler gaskets and none of those were particularly difficult. Just time consuming.

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I have about 125k on my 08 535xit. I tightened the rear wastegates and the cold start rattle went away but I think it will return. The turbos are oily. I will likely replace them next year or the year after -- which should be in the 145-160k miles range -- rather than wait for a failure.

[KingDavidsCourt]

Have you done the oil pan gasket on a 535xi? The front axles go through it. Looks like a rough job. I have done the intake manifold gasket, intake manifold gaskets, oil filter housing to block and oil cooler gaskets and none of those were particularly difficult. Just time consuming.

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I have about 125k on my 08 535xit. I tightened the rear wastegates and the cold start rattle went away but I think it will return. The turbos are oily. I will likely replace them next year or the year after -- which should be in the 145-160k miles range -- rather than wait for a failure.

I have not... had them scheduled for this week until my unfortunate run in with a piece of flying debris that toasted my cooling system. Thankfully I found a guy on N54tech who know's everything about the N54 and is doing it for me. He mentioned dropping the subframe to do it.

Do you have an oil catch can? I got one with the hope that it will stop most of the oil passing through... preventing or at least delaying turbo failure as well as extending the need between walnut blasts.

[pbonsalb]

No oil catch can but I think it's not a bad idea. I had the intercooler and intake manifold out and they were not full of oil though there was oil residue. I use a burger can on my turbo E36M3 but vented to atmosphere rather than Re circulated. The 535xit is my wife's car so I would have to recirculate since she would complain about an occasional oil smell.

Yes the subframe would have to come down to do the pan on an xi. I was more curious about the axles, which go into the sides of the pan.

[jomama]

Most of the issues I've seen (and they are significant *see my few other posts in the E60 section) none of them are terminal. The block is bulletproof even under a ton of upgrades (see above) The turbos seem to be strong, although the wastegates can be troublesome. EVERY GASKET WILL NEED REPLACED RELATIVELY FREQUENTLY. EVERY one... valve cover (and thats not an easy job) Oil pan (and thats not an easy job) Oil filter housing... and then theres the Walnut blasting of the manifold. Direct port injection builds carbon in there and it's recommended every 50k i think. If you can do this work yourself... materials are next to nothing (i bought all gaskets, and oil catch can, plugs, new silicone vacuum lines and a few other pieces for 500$ or so)... but a shop, even an indy will charge a small fortune for this list of replacements. When it runs well... it's a joy to drive. Expect various things to fail though... they will.

Wow, great info thanks. As for the DIY stuff - considering I'm not really a gearhead, nor do I have the proper equipment - are any of these things easier to do than the other? Or is it just safer to have everything done at the shop? If I can save an hour or two of labor, I'd really like to learn how to do some of the aforementioned maintenance! Thanks again

[pbonsalb]

You can find DIYs for most projects, though not all DIYs are specific to the E60/61 and not all DIYs spell everything out perfectly. Some are for the E90 with the same N54 engine and may require some interpretation or modification. I don't think you will be saving an hour or two of labor in most of these projects. More like 3 hours, but since you are learning, it will take you 6 hours and you will need tools. If you want to start learning, its best to find someone who can come over and help, or to whose house or shop you can go.

[Norskie]

No oil catch can but I think it's not a bad idea.

Keep in mind there are two paths for oil to get into the intake - high speed and low speed circuits. You'll probably want to start with the low-speed circuits, as that is where most of the driving is done. RB Turbo sells a kit to install an external PCV valve system for the low speed stuff.

http://www.rbturbo.com/products/acce...ternal-pcv-kit

They do have a non-NPT option which requires tapping into your manifold, but it is $70 less than the inline plug'n'play one.

[pbonsalb]

I was planning on the pcv upgrade when I do the turbos but probably won't bother before. Our car does not pass much oil. How hard are they to install?

[jomama]

Snagged a 2010 MT E61 with 85K today!

Pretty pumped to say the least...driving it home next weekend.

Now to the fun stuff: wheels (going 19" Apex EC7's or Miro 111's), some side skirts and M front/rear bumpers. Any other "must haves" you guys would recommend? This is my first BMW!

[pbonsalb]

JB4 or Cobb or MHD.

[KingDavidsCourt]

Congrats.... what kinda deal did you get and where are the pics?

jb4 and dci...

[OntheRoad365]

Congratulations! Looking forward to seeing the pics.

[Norskie]

I was planning on the pcv upgrade when I do the turbos but probably won't bother before. Our car does not pass much oil. How hard are they to install?

Turbo's are hot-side, PCV is cold-side; two different things. Not much overlap in the work involved.

If you have the manifold off for a walnut blast, everything is easy to get to. If you're not going to pull the manifold then get the non-NPT adapter; you'll need to remove the throttle at hte least (which is very easy when you replace your charge pipe).

Plugging the head ports isn't required (but it works better if you do), but to do these you'll need to remove the valve cover. Which you might to do anyway if it's leaking.

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JB4 or Cobb or MHD.

If I did my research properly, it's Charge pipe + (JB4+MHD or Cobb) for max reliability.

[KingDavidsCourt]

Turbo's are hot-side, PCV is cold-side; two different things. Not much overlap in the work involved.

If you have the manifold off for a walnut blast, everything is easy to get to. If you're not going to pull the manifold then get the non-NPT adapter; you'll need to remove the throttle at hte least (which is very easy when you replace your charge pipe).

Plugging the head ports isn't required (but it works better if you do), but to do these you'll need to remove the valve cover. Which you might to do anyway if it's leaking.

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If I did my research properly, it's Charge pipe + (JB4+MHD or Cobb) for max reliability.

Yeah the charge pipe will crack after a while.. I dont believe it's necessary right away. I think there's only one option built for the 535... for whatever reason there are several for the 335 and they dont direct fit.

[jomama]

No pics yet - it looks like a standard E61 535. Will send the pics after I get some decent wheels and the new bumper.