99 e36 m3 new clutch won't disengage completely

[stealth99m3]

Hey guys I have a 1999 e36 m3, that I just finished replacing the clutch and flywheel on. It has a fx stage 2 clutch kit with lightweight flywheel. link http://www.ebay.com/itm/FX-STAGE-2-C...lVUUvZ&vxp=mtr
Of course I made the same mistake as a lot of other people have installed the clutch backwards the first time, with those great instructions. But I figured it out and pulled it apart and I was lucky the trans shaft sleeve had very little damage at the end which I fixed and the clutch was fine. So I reinstalled the clutch in the right way and put it all back together. It starts and runs fine,but I hold the clutch in and try to put it into first gear or any gear and it the rear wheels start to spin. So I know the clutch isn't completely disengaging. I've bled the system multiple times and there isn't any air in it. A couple months ago I replaced the master cylinder, with a oem bmw replacement and it was fine until the clutch went out. After bleeding the clutch pedal has resistance and you can hear the clutch disengaging some but just not all the way. But now why isn't the clutch completely disengaging? Any help is greatly appreciated

[woody328is]

I had a similar problem recently. Had trouble with the trans angle on installation. It was in the splines of the disc but wouldn't slide in so we pulled it out to recheck things. Everything looked good so in it went. This time it slid in okay. We didn't know that the pilot bearing came out of the crankshaft and fell into the pressure plate. Sometimes it would lock the disc and keep it spinning. Pulled the trans and there it was. One other cause is if the disc doesn't slide freely on the input shaft it'll stick to the flywheel enough to stay engaged.

[scooper]

try to bleed again OP. Check for leaks.

[E36328Coupe]

1) With the rear wheels in the air, no brakes on and out of gear many cars turn the back wheels anyway due to oil drag.
2) Unless you stand on the clutch for 5 seconds say to let the input shaft spin down the rear wheels will turn. They don't stop spinning instantly. And even then oil drag...........
3) The bleed nipple is at the bottom of the slave so impossible to bleed air out with it in situ, pressure bleeders may be a little more successful. You can change fluid effectively but not bleed if aid has got in. Air is lighter then brake fluid, you only get to draw fluid off the bottom and not the air.

[66 6]

1) With the rear wheels in the air, no brakes on and out of gear many cars turn the back wheels anyway due to oil drag.
2) Unless you stand on the clutch for 5 seconds say to let the input shaft spin down the rear wheels will turn. They don't stop spinning instantly. And even then oil drag...........

What he said. Put the wheels on the ground, parking brake on, foot on the brake. Start car, press clutch and try to put in gear. Slides in? No problem, Grinding? Problem.

[stealth99m3]

thanks for the replies and help guys. I forgot to mention in the original post that i tried to press the clutch in and then the brake. The car stalled so I know it has to be more than the acceptable oil drag. 3rd gear and up is also hard to shift into.

[woody328is]

If the hydraulic system is sure to have no air in it the trans has to come out to inspect the clutch assembly.

[E36328Coupe]

3) The bleed nipple is at the bottom of the slave so impossible to bleed air out with it in situ, pressure bleeders may be a little more successful. You can change fluid effectively but not bleed if aid has got in. Air is lighter then brake fluid, you only get to draw fluid off the bottom and not the air.

^^
Is the pedal feel good or weak

[stealth99m3]

I figured I would be pulling it again,I'll inspect the clutch pivot pin and probably replace it and maybe the fork too. The pedal feels alright I guess. The disengagement does'nt happen until about 1/4 to half of the clutch pedal travel. Is this normal?

[E36328Coupe]

Has the slave cylinder been disconnected?

[stealth99m3]

I have removed the slave from the trans to bleed it but I have not disconnected the line to it.

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looking at pics on google and thinking back, I think I might have installed the throwout bearing incorrectly, not giving me the full travel i need to disengage it. Thoughts?

[E36328Coupe]

Cool so rod down nipple up, slacken nipple push rod in, tighten nipple let rod out to pull more fluid down and repeated a few times?
If so and properly bled then you have either the arm came off the ball joint, the release bearing not in right (or forgotten but it sounds like you have some slip) sticking plate on the input shaft, needle roller (usually jams them in gear / stops shifting) wrong parts or wrongly assembled OR clutch master cylinder issues - check it for weeping. It's the only thing not in the gearbox left to check

If the release bearing is not in on the correct areas maybe it sits further back. On some gearboxes you can pull the arm across and manoeuvre (like getrag on Manta) but on these working through a small hole I don't see you having many options.

[stealth99m3]

Yea thats how ive been bleeding it, i even had someone slowly push the clutch in while i was holding the rod with the nipple open, try to get any air out of the master. ill check that it seats properly again. I wish i had taken a pic of the trans before i put it in but i remember that the way i put the throwout bearing on was that it didnt spin at all around the input shaft. That could be wrong, but i see now that the ears/tabs have to be vertical. Idk remember the oreintation of those tabs when i installed it but there isnt a way to change that from that small hole im guessing? Ill have a chance to get my hands on it tomorrow but thanks so far

[stealth99m3]

Sorry I was busy for a couple days but i finally got a chance to pull the trans today. The throwout bearing was in the correct orientation, so that cant be the problem. The only other things i can think of being the problem are the pivot pin,fork, and slave or master cylinders. Any other things i could be missing? And what are the chances the fork is bent?

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so just took out the pivot pin and it looks bad. back of pinimage1.jpg Front of pinIMG_0290.jpg Looking at pics of the original pin on google, it looks nothing like mine. So ill definantly replace this pin but would this be the cause of the clutch not disengaging completely?

[flyfishvt]

That's your problem. The pin acts as an anchor point for the clutch fork.

[stealth99m3]

sweet im going to try and pick up a new pin tomorrow from the dealership. I would like to upgrade to the 5 series metal pin part #21511223281 if they have it. Just to make sure, will the pin work for my trans? If not ill just get the plastic one and new spring of course

[stealth99m3]

So I installed the new pivot pin and put the trans back in and the car is still doing the same thing. The only things left are the master or slave cylinders that could be at fault right? How to I determine if either is leaking?

[scooper]

do a pressure test on the hydraulic system and look at your brake fittings in addition to the clutch cylinders. They're all connected. Worst case, get all stock parts and re-install if you want your car to be driveable. A lot of time aftermarket parts are not properly engineered and machined.

[mike318]

My sons slave cylinder went out and the fluid puddled under the bell housing. The master if leaking is going to be on the drivers carpet. It might also be the hose between, and leak under the car down onto the slave. Getting the air out of the slave drove me nuts. What worked for me........remove the slave from the bell housing and hold in one hand by the bleed screw. move your hand to the high point of under the car. So, now the slave body is lower than the bleed screw. Get a friend to slowly very slowly, press the clutch peddle and you (open bleed screw) bleed until the air is all out. (Just like bleeding breaks.) As you do this and the air is all out the plunger of the slave will try to exit the unit,,,,,,,,,,,stop. Should be good, push it back in and reinstall into housing. Sorry if I ran on a bit.

[stealth99m3]

So i forgot to add this but when i finished installing the trans i went to push the clutch and the pedal seemed different. so i grabed it with my hand and started moving back and forth at the top part of the engagement and after that the pedal felt a lot better. I have a feeling its the master giving me problems this whole time. What sucks is that its a bmw part straight from the dealership. And thanks mike, thats how i was bleeding it the last time and it felt better but i got to a point where it wouldnt get any better so i pulled the trans to see if the problem was in there. And doesnt the clutch resuvoir have a little wall between that and the rest of the brake resuvior scooper?

[mike318]

Stealth: I cant get to the car and check the reservoir...work. But you could remove the slave and check the distance to the clutch arm. Then holding the slave at this distance from the housing, have the clutch pushed to see if there is any more travel. I don't have enough experience to be helpful in this area.

[flyfishvt]

The clutch and brakes share the same reservoir. Any partitions that may be in there are only to prevent fluid from sloshing around. If you run out of brake fluid it will affect the clutch first. The feed to the clutch is higher up the reservoir than the brake feed. You have to lose a lot of fluid to affect the clutch. It would be very evident with just a quick look at the reservoir.

I replaced my clutch last summer. I never touched any hydraulic lines. I removed the slave but kept it attached to the hydraulic line. Even so when I got things buttoned up my clutch pedal went right to the floor. No resistance. I pumped it a few times and it got a little better. Not much. I had to press the pedal the entire distance it would move or the clutch would not come close to releasing. I thought it was just my new Stage3 clutch. I got in and drive it about 200 miles later and the pedal magically fixed itself. Feels perfectly normal now.

I can only assume it had an air bubble somewhere and managed to self bleed it out.

[DJ Genius]

Are you 100% sure you installed the throw out bearing in the correct way, notches sitting on top of the fork and not inside the fork:

[stealth99m3]

I guess I just have a bad feeling about the master cylinder but Ill keep trying to pump it i guess and yes dj a 100% i made sure to look for that first the last time i pulled it and it was correct.

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So fly you drove the car without the clutch completely diesngaging for the first 200 miles?

[flyfishvt]

My clutch was disengaging but barely. Then it fixed itself.