Rajicase's First Turbo Build, Ballin' On A (Nonexistent) Budget

[vollosso]

Eeehhh if done right id rock sleeves.

The block will be "rebuildable" lol.

But you do hear a bit too often dropping sleeves.. usually ""due to heat"" or "overheat"... also cracking sleeves...

I don't know. Its quite the Sophie's choice you have here.

Side note, anyone going to bimmerfest west?




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[328iFun]

They ruined the block,

They buy me another block.

If I were you I would be looking around on craigslist locally for motor or block for around the price you paid to have them do the work (or cheapest you can find) or for the price you purchased yours. I'd print the ad and hand it to them. You shouldn't be worrying about whether or not your motor is going to "hold up" due it having a sleeve in it and it not being properly machined by someone else.

Not cool in my opinion. I've been told by X amount of people I'm asshole though, so I don't know... That's what I would do. Would then take the new block to another shop.

[rajicase]

They ruined the block,

They buy me another block.

If I were you I would be looking around on craigslist locally for motor or block for around the price you paid to have them do the work (or cheapest you can find) or for the price you purchased yours. I'd print the ad and hand it to them. You shouldn't be worrying about whether or not your motor is going to "hold up" due it having a sleeve in it and it not being properly machined by someone else.

Not cool in my opinion. I've been told by X amount of people I'm asshole though, so I don't know... That's what I would do. Would then take the new block to another shop.

I have learned that there are certain times to be confrontational and certain times not to. In this instance, a locally owned business at any point can tell me to fuck right off and Ill have no course of action to take. In this instance, the owner acknowledged the problem they caused and promised to fix it and it would be good as new. This shop has been around for decades and has done great work for me and everyone I know, so I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. I told the owner what type of power and stress this block would see and I ensured he knew how important it was that it would be reliable, he promised it would be. So the ball is in their court, I am going to let them sleeve it, pick it up, inspect it and continue my research. Worst case I pick up another block and bring it to another shop; whats another month or two and a few hundred dollars more at this point, right?

Everything I have read leads me to believe that a sleeved block is every bit as reliable assuming proper install. Other commonalities between failed sleeves seem to be related to overheating and installing sleeves in cracked/damaged bores. I'm going to hope that a massive machine shop that has been around longer than I have been alive knows how to properly sleeve a iron block and hope that this screw up was just an isolated and carless mistake....

[328iFun]

I have learned that there are certain times to be confrontational and certain times not to. In this instance, a locally owned business at any point can tell me to fuck right off and Ill have no course of action to take. In this instance, the owner acknowledged the problem they caused and promised to fix it and it would be good as new. This shop has been around for decades and has done great work for me and everyone I know, so I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. I told the owner what type of power and stress this block would see and I ensured he knew how important it was that it would be reliable, he promised it would be. So the ball is in their court, I am going to let them sleeve it, pick it up, inspect it and continue my research. Worst case I pick up another block and bring it to another shop; whats another month or two and a few hundred dollars more at this point, right?

Yes, I would get another block and take it another shop. That way you don't have to worry about. Especially considering how much time and money has been put into it.

I think a few hundred bucks extra soul be worth the piece of mind.

Until you can source a new block we cab always post more dog pics, I have tons

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[rajicase]

I am going to play it by ear. I am at the least going to pick up my sleeved block and get you guys some pics. And maybe some more people here will chime in once they see the finished product.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...ron-block.html

This was an interesting thread to read.
Cool pics of a freshly sleeved iron block.

[tyr283]

If they have a good track record and the shop knows what the block will be put through and is confident it will last I see no reason not to just let them sleeve it. I don't know, maybe I'm missing something

VAC sleeves tons of blocks and I remember a while back reading that they said a single sleeve in a cast iron M5X block had no drawbacks provided it was done right (there was a guy who called them about having it done after he damaged one cylinder)

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[328iFun]

If they have a good track record and the shop knows what the block will be put through and is confident it will last I see no reason not to just let them sleeve it. I don't know, maybe I'm missing something

VAC sleeves tons of blocks and I remember a while back reading that they said a single sleeve in a cast iron M5X block had no drawbacks provided it was done right (there was a guy who called them about having it done after he damaged one cylinder)

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I'm sure a sleeve will work for Raj fine.

If I were him it would itch my bump to have all 5 cylinders perfectly fine and then a sleeve in the 6th because someone else goofed.

But building a good rapport with a local shop is good thing... He may need them again later

[chikinhed]

After all the crap I've been through, I wouldn't take any chances, I'd get another block and have them machine it. Don't let Murphy into your engine.

[Butters Stoch]

After all the crap I've been through, I wouldn't take any chances, I'd get another block and have them machine it. Don't let Murphy into your engine.

Grab a m52 for $300. Even shipping is no big deal. I shipped one from NH to Mike R and cost on shipping was only $79 iirc. That was a stripped block. But I'm sure the sleeve will be fine.
Will they be doing a flanged or tapered sleeve ?

[rajicase]

Grab a m52 for $300. Even shipping is no big deal. I shipped one from NH to Mike R and cost on shipping was only $79 iirc. That was a stripped block. But I'm sure the sleeve will be fine.
Will they be doing a flanged or tapered sleeve ?

I'll decide what course I'm going to go once I get the block back. I'm really inclined to trust the machine shop on this one but I'll keep thinking about it.

I'm not sure what type of sleeve they are going to use. I assume tapered but I'm not sure.

[Butters Stoch]

I'll decide what course I'm going to go once I get the block back. I'm really inclined to trust the machine shop on this one but I'll keep thinking about it.

I'm not sure what type of sleeve they are going to use. I assume tapered but I'm not sure.

Well, I only worry as this is F-up #1. If a sleeve drops, shame on you.
Personally, I'd probably just have them sleeve it, if I was in your sneakers.

[rajicase]

Well, I only worry as this is F-up #1. If a sleeve drops, shame on you.
Personally, I'd probably just have them sleeve it, if I was in your sneakers.

I'm getting very mixed signals from you regarding sleeving lol.
Shame on me what ?

[Butters Stoch]

I'm getting very mixed signals from you regarding sleeving lol.
Shame on me what ?

I'm torn with it.
They already screwed up a job for you once. You asked them to punch out the block and they didn't do it right. So, you can call it an honest mistake. Maybe things got hectic or whatever and they made a very rare mistake. Or, this is common practice for them, and they aren't really all that good.
If its #1 then your fine, but if its #2, and you go ahead and have it done, reassemble the whole car. Drive it a few hundred miles, then a sleeve drops. Well, that will suck for you much more then for them. That would be a whole lotta work for you, and you will ponder parting it out.

So, the old saying.
Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice shame on me.

If that sleeve drops, they have fooled you twice.

The shit part ?
When modding a car, making that type of power, it will be easy for them to blame something on you. You will have no recourse what so ever. 100% screwed you will be.

[pbonsalb]

Supposedly if sleeving is done right, a lip or step is left at the bottom so the sleeve cannot drop. There was a fancy built motor that pushed down a sleeve due to the pressure from the ring of a cutring gasket, and perhaps this motor was not sleeved right or perhaps when it was sleeved no one contemplated a cutring gasket since they did not exist for S52 at the time the motor was built.

[rajicase]

Hmm so the idea of the cut ring pushing the sleeve down concerns me. I guess what I can do is torque the head down with the oil pan off and visually see whether or not the sleeve moved. I'm sure I can make some mark or measurement before and after I torque the head down to be sure the sleeve has not moved.

[philly98540]

Heat cycles likely make it move after install. Can the shop tell you what type of sleeve they plan to use?

[rajicase]

Heat cycles likely make it move after install. Can the shop tell you what type of sleeve they plan to use?

I'm sure they can , but they are closed over the weekend.

[Mklock]

Cheapest block I find in most yards are 150$ I'd say take your chances with the sleeve.

[rajicase]

Cheapest block I find in most yards are 150$ I'd say take your chances with the sleeve.

I probably will.
As long as they put a step in the bottom of the bore to retain the sleeve I don't see how it could drop.

Hopefully they get done with it early next week and I can get back to work.

[GG///M3]

Long, or short sleeves that is the question


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[milKt]

Long, or short sleeves that is the question


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SLeeveLESS

Full muskel shoit

[GG///M3]

SLeeveLESS

Full muskel shoit

Korrekt in which it will work best indeed


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[jakermac]

I once had a VERY reputable engine shop here in Vancouver bore a 4cyl block for forged pistons for me. I asked them to hit a specific piston to wall clearance. I gave them the pistons. When I went to pick it up, the pistons were NOT marked for which bore they were to be matched up with. I questioned the counter guy Dave (Brad, you'll know who I'm talking about) about why the pistons were not marked. His response was "it doesn't matter". I asked why it didn't matter, if the piston to wall clearance that I asked them to target/hit was achieved. His response was that they bored all the holes to the same diameter.

As they did not perform the work as I had asked them, I asked to be compensated. They "bought" the block from me for the cost of a replacement block and refunded all the charges for the work they performed incorrectly. I have never returned to them for any further work. They did stand behind their fuck-up, and I think this shop that you are dealing with should do the same.

[rajicase]

Well I've already told them to go ahead and sleeve the cylinder so I can't really ask for a refund any more.

I'm gonna pick up the block and see how it looks and post some pics here for you guys to examine and go from there. Worst case I'll cut my losses and get another block and take it to another shop. Surely I can sell this one and recoup some costs down the road.

I really want to give the machine shop the benefit of the doubt because I have used them for years, recommended them to friends, and have never had anything but excellent experiences and same with everyone I know. And like I said, this place has been around for decades and every BMW shop around sends their heads and shit to them so I'd really hope that this was an isolated incident and that the sleeve they install will (as they promised) be good as new and have zero effect on longevity and reliability.

[someguy2800]

Ask them if they are machining a step to retain the sleeve. If not tell them to cancel the order for the sleeve and source an m52 block.