I didn't get the painless panel because I was hoping to retain some of the factory switches, so I am going to end up just making my own panel in either the radio hole or the one underneath it.
Dropped it off at Rally.Build to get the cage started on. I'm just copying the photo example from the FD rulebook, with the addition of a rear strut bar tied in to the crossmember mounts.
Now I just have to wait on the rest of the parts while the cage is getting done.
Lost an LS1 at Summit I think between the sustained high revs (rod bolt issue maybe?). I had the baffle you talked about, it never popped an oil pressure light, so interesting to see what you found. Either way I wouldnt be running an LS1 on track. Accusump is way better solution than the baffle.
right there with you bud, that's exactly where/how i killed my 302 e30. did you have an oil cooler on your car? because i think my oil may have gotten too hot an started foaming or something
regardless, +1 accusump again. i personally plan on wiring up a light or a buzzer that lets me know whenever the accusump valve opens up, seems like a good double insurance
- 96 328is 6.0L. (LS1 to LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?2098938)
- 96 328is 5.7L. (LS1 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1289987)
- 95 ///M3 6.0L. (LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1619249)
- 97 ///M3. (e46 Fender Flares/track car build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1727098)
- 96 328is (Dual Fuel Pump to Surge Tank thread: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...ad.php?1964025)
Nothing much happening around here. Some parts slowly showing up. Engine/Trans should be leaving to come to me sometime next week, still trying to get a hold of SLR and find out where my angle kit is at. S2R hooked it up with a new sunroof and gave me a huge deal on the cracked one so I can mess with trying to put a roof scoop in it.
I removed a quick release set up from a customers 2.5RS because he didn't like the wheel placement and he gave me the quick release. Now I need to find a hub.
also, I found a roof scoop on the shelf in the shop off an old rally car we had, I'm going to use it as a mold of sorts and try to make a fiberglass one to graft in to the cracked sunroof, and also might try molding lexan over it for some rear window scoops as well. We'll see.
Also, the oil pan, baffle, and header bolts showed up, now Just waiting on the actual headers and the steering shaft from Vorshlag.
did that baffle come with its own pickup tube?
mmkay, just wondering if that might have been the issue bimerok was dealing with. apparently you need about .5" of clearance between the screen and the bottom of the pan. too much or too little clearance can lead to starvation issues
- 96 328is 6.0L. (LS1 to LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?2098938)
- 96 328is 5.7L. (LS1 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1289987)
- 95 ///M3 6.0L. (LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1619249)
- 97 ///M3. (e46 Fender Flares/track car build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1727098)
- 96 328is (Dual Fuel Pump to Surge Tank thread: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...ad.php?1964025)
the pickup tube clearance is actually very critical in preventing oil starvation. since the trap doors actually restrict oil flow into the baffle to some degree, i'd argue that proper gap is just as important, if not more, than on a non-baffled car
this is something of an extreme example, but you're literally the only guy i've ever heard from that had negative results from a baffled oil pan. something had to have been wrong for you to have the issues you had
So what you're saying is everyone who used the baffle had to replace the f-body oil pan pick up tube? I doubt that. I installed a brand new, original GM f-body pan, pickup tube and dipstick.
On the other hand, I have never heard of anyone even bringing up aftermarket pickup tube with that baffle. It is pretty plain and simple in my case - baffle in - major oil starvation. Baffle out - minor starvation issues. My opinion, and again, it is only my opinion without any tests, is that oil had issues getting down into the baffle pool fast enough. It looked to me that the top of the baffle is designed with to much of a restriction for oil return.
It is similar to fuel starvation, where some people use dual fuel pumps inside the tank and are happy that the problem went away. Others, including myself had no fix in adding second fuel pump. It did very little for me as for a lot of others. For me, to solve the fuel starvation, I had to make myself a surge tank. That fixed my problem 100%, where I can run my tank down to fumes without having any issues (that one was annoying to have but fun to solve). A lot of it is dependent on the driving style, car setup, track you're on, etc...
- 96 328is 6.0L. (LS1 to LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?2098938)
- 96 328is 5.7L. (LS1 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1289987)
- 95 ///M3 6.0L. (LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1619249)
- 97 ///M3. (e46 Fender Flares/track car build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1727098)
- 96 328is (Dual Fuel Pump to Surge Tank thread: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...ad.php?1964025)
i'm gonna guess from your response that you didn't check your pickup tube clearance. do a little bit of reading on the subject and you might start to see what i'm talking about.
if the baffle success rate was 50/50 then i could see where you're getting your standpoint from... but during the two odd years that i've been doing research on the best way to optimize a wet oiling system, you're the first person i've met that had something bad to say about an oil pan baffle. i'm not saying that the pickup was your issue, but there definitely was some kind of problem. maybe yours had a manufacturing defect? all i do know is that the canton or moroso road race pans + an accusump seem to be the way to go for wet oiling system great success
Last edited by jalopi; 10-19-2015 at 09:20 PM.
Update, I picked up a sheet of Lexan on the way home and after doing some research on forming temps, secured it to the scoop and popped it in the oven. Don't try this, haha. It was working and I was getting pretty excited, but then the actual scoop i was using as a mold started getting soft, and then all the paint peeled off it and stuck to the lexan...so that was a waste of $40.
man that sucks
aren't you supposed to use wood or something as a mold though?
Jalopi, by now I'm fairly familiar with how LS1/2 oil pickup tubes look and if it has a slight bend or disproportion anywhere it will be pretty obvious, not to mention the steel construction is extremely sturdy. There is a huge difference between doing a research and actually trying something out and looking at it in your own car. I've talked to people who actually use their car at a road coarse track (not a drag strip as majority of people on the net) who said that this baffle did absolutely nothing for them, as well some who said they saw improvement, so... By all means, if you determined or want to use this baffle, go for it. I don't car one way or the other. All I did is shared my experience with it. I'm not advocating for or against it...
Nova,
If you're trying to use your blue scoop as a "hot" mold, have you though of trying to do a fiberglass mold from it and then use that as a template? Maybe just a few layers and it should be strong enough and not affected by heat much....
- 96 328is 6.0L. (LS1 to LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...ad.php?2098938)
- 96 328is 5.7L. (LS1 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1289987)
- 95 ///M3 6.0L. (LS2 build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1619249)
- 97 ///M3. (e46 Fender Flares/track car build thread: http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1727098)
- 96 328is (Dual Fuel Pump to Surge Tank thread: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...ad.php?1964025)
Dave and his oil starvation. Lose ONE 302 motor and he's preaching proper oiling at all costs.
:-*
Status: Someone put glitter in my oil. Wait. Why's all my oil outside the engine? What's that knocking?
imo losing one engine to oiling issues is one too many. and just because something looks straight and sturdy doesn't mean it was produced right... machining and manufacturing tolerances are a thing too. every successful engine builder i've ever talked to or read one of their posts really stresses how neglected and important the pickup clearance is. you may have seen a bunch of different pickup tubes, but by itself can you really eyeball one that's only off by 1/2"? without actually measuring the tube you'll probably have just as much luck as slapping OE sized main/rod bearings in during a rebuild because "the crank doesn't look worn". some people magically have great luck with that, others end up spinning a bearing within the first couple thousand miles.
i will concede that improved racing doesn't even mention pickup clearance in their instructions. though that doesn't really say alot about a company that designed a product to prevent oil starvation. maybe that could be part of the problem
also, just as a reference and proof that i'm not just blowing some forum talk out of proportion, here's milodons' thoughts about pickup clearance:
"Once the pump and pickup are installed on the motor you must check for the proper pan to pickup clearance"
http://www.milodon.com/instructions/...tion-chevy.pdf
stay slippery my friends
Last edited by jalopi; 10-20-2015 at 11:54 AM.
Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
M42 + trans - 427lbs
302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs
351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
LS, aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz
I wish I could just find something similar to purchase, but all I can find is the NACA style ducts like this:
http://www.plastics4performance.com/...naca-duct.html
And I would prefer more of a scoop like these
http://www.americanmuscle.com/painte...oops-9904.html
only I want them clear so my rear windows aren't complete blind spots. Surprised no one makes them.
the second scoop is dope. unfortunately that's life as a BMW owner though... too much cool stuff is not made for our cars
seems like the second scoop would be fairly straight forward to make out of wood though (for a mold)
Last edited by jalopi; 10-20-2015 at 12:40 PM.
Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
M42 + trans - 427lbs
302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs
351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
LS, aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz
I think I found a way to do it by building a DIY Vacuum form machine. I think this will work pretty decent. I'll also be able to duplicate some of the interior pieces to make blanks for switch panels and gauges.
http://www.instructables.com/id/Make...-plastic-vacu/
UPDATE
------------------------
It worked! ...Sort of. I built the design above, but didn't have the proper clamps so I attempted to use some bigger clamps not realizing how much air was going to get around them. Also my air nozzle was too big. Shaved it down and am going to get the right clamps and try again. Also, Lexan bubbles like crazy with the heat, so I am going to try to find a sort of plastic that won't.
a quick DIY on the vaccum form.
got a 1 1/4 PVC fitting that close to fit the nozzle on my shop vac. Bored the inside of the fitting out until the shop vac was a snug fit.
Got a piece of wood that was about the size of my oven and drilled a 1 1/4 hole in it, then bored that slightly oversized so the PVC fitting would fit. Used a bit of silicone to make it airtight.
the finished product!
Like I said, it only sort of worked. I need to get some different clamps, and some foam tape to make a decent seal around it, as well as figure out a type of plastic that won't bubble up at molding temp.
Last edited by Novablue454; 10-20-2015 at 11:39 PM.
Just waiting on parts like
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whaaaaatttt
pretty cool how that plastic turned out. sucks about the bubbles, but it's not too bad. if i had to make a bet on it, i'd say that those bubbles cropped up due to the material temperature. why use a gauge cluster though? that the new template you're using for the scoop?
Popular engine swap weights & stock engine weights
M42 + trans - 427lbs
302 + t5 trans - 475lbs
m20b27 + g260 - 497lbs
m52b25 vanos + g250 - 544lbs
351w + t5 trans - 572.5lbs
LS, aluminum block + t56 - 609lbs
LS, iron block + t56 - 719lbs, EST.
http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...60-m42-1jz-2jz
Oil didn't get hot. It was maybe 5 laps in. Early LS1s are known as having weak rod bolts. I did not have a dedicated oil gauge, so I can't tell you where specifically it was oil starving. Hell, don't really know if it was oil starvation or the rod bolt just letting go, but it definitely was having rod knock before it let go (about 6 turns before the rod went out the side of the block). Just make sure you take care of the rod bolts on theese motors.
John Khoury encountered oiling issues that didn't get fixed until dry sump. I think you will be fine with just a track day car, but when you start adding aero and the extra grip of As or R compounds, you might have different issues you never expected.
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