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Thread: The Z3 Diagnostics Thread: Instructions, Experiences, Discussions, Experimentation

  1. #51
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    Tried to download the program and my Windows 7 (64 bit) PC couldn't unzip the download. Is the file really 490 Mb in size?

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by cngizbleevng View Post
    Tried to download the program and my Windows 7 (64 bit) PC couldn't unzip the download. Is the file really 490 Mb in size?
    Yes it is 490mb. Try unzipping with WinRAR or similar. Although it was working fine with Windows' built in Zip folder application.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by 328 Power 04 View Post


    When you enter the Airbag section (E36 > Body > Airbag), I believe the 4th button (also F4) on the bottom is "Error" click that and then read error memory. It will tell you in words and error code what the problem is. Feel free to post a screenshot here. You can clear the errors on that menu as well (E36 > Body > Airbag > Error > clear errors).

    Three questions:

    1-Based on the above, am I correct in thinking that this set up will allow you to turn off the airbag light? (I stupidly left my airbag disconnected after replacing my window sliders and turning the car on to confirm that the window was moving smoothly.)

    2-I have some money left over from a gift card to Amazon and would like to buy the cables there...do these two cables look like they'd work? http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...A2PUOSINICLRJ2 and http://www.amazon.com/ASSEM%C2%AEBMW...20+pin+adapter

    3-Does this setup have any missing functions as compared to one of the Peake scanner/reset tools? Or does it have additional functions not found on the Peake tools?

    Thanks in advance.
    Last edited by kornfeld; 07-15-2015 at 01:43 AM.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  4. #54
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    I found a video on youtube showing someone using INPA to turn off their airbag light, so it looks like that answers question 1.

    Any input on questions 2 and 3 is welcome! Thanks.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  5. #55
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    3... those other tool's functionality is in the name. Readers/reset tools. They don't offer anything beyond those basic features, the diagnostic computers are what was originally used at dealerships (at least some of the software is...) to read all the data about the car, code and reset various settings, and do basically everything. The functionality they offer over those basic reader/reset tools is immense. The problem is with all this added functionality its possible for a backyard mechanic to tick the wrong box and "brick" the car. Not sure how likely that is on these cars (I know certainly you can do things like make the EWS have problems), but I was talking to a friend with a much newer 7 series about it and on those cars it is a serious consideration. Just make sure if you are using the software that you know what you are doing. There are tons of very helpful guides out there and very helpful people who will answer any question you may have.

    I'm not sure on point 2 but I bought a $200 laptop with the software installed and all neccessary cables included. Works like a charm - I just dont trust myself to use it, so I gave it to a friend who now uses it to worry about bricking his 7 series.

    Going into my TENTH YEAR of providing high quality reproduction BMW fabrics!

    PRICE CUT on ALL FABRICS
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  6. #56
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    Awesome, I was hoping that would be the case. There is a set of open-source software in the Subaru world that can be used for tuning/diagnostics/etc and I'm well versed in how that can be easily used to completely incapacitate a vehicle or grenade a motor, so I'll be careful with this as well.

    I decided to buy this cable instead:

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/231334322820

    Because it's much closer to me than the one I linked from Amazon and should arrive much sooner.

    Thanks for the info!

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have a windows 8.1 laptop I would like to use for this, and a windows 7 laptop that I could use if I need to (but would prefer not to).

    I see in the original post that I need to use compatibility mode and open as administrator when installing, which all makes sense. Do I also need to follow the steps in the instructions file to make environmental path changes? If so, which set of instructions should I follow? What do these changes accomplish, and should I put them back to their original settings after installing the INPA software?
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by kornfeld View Post
    Awesome, I was hoping that would be the case. There is a set of open-source software in the Subaru world that can be used for tuning/diagnostics/etc and I'm well versed in how that can be easily used to completely incapacitate a vehicle or grenade a motor, so I'll be careful with this as well.

    I decided to buy this cable instead:

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/231334322820

    Because it's much closer to me than the one I linked from Amazon and should arrive much sooner.

    Thanks for the info!

    - - - Updated - - -

    I have a windows 8.1 laptop I would like to use for this, and a windows 7 laptop that I could use if I need to (but would prefer not to).

    I see in the original post that I need to use compatibility mode and open as administrator when installing, which all makes sense. Do I also need to follow the steps in the instructions file to make environmental path changes? If so, which set of instructions should I follow? What do these changes accomplish, and should I put them back to their original settings after installing the INPA software?
    There is a set of open-source tuning software in the Subaru world, that is now updated for BMW use as well now, mostly for MS41 ecus, but there is some work being done on MS42 and MS43.


    That cable should be fine. Make sure you get the 20 pin adapter as well.





    Yes you can use Windows 8.1 64-bit (I do, on a Microsoft Surface Pro tablet). Follow the directions at the bottom of the first post for installing it. It only has issues with the self extracting .exe files. So you have to manually install the programs after extracting the files. It's no big deal though.

    *I updated the post to include how to set up environment variables on Windows 8.1, but windows 7 is very similar.* You do it before installing all the programs, or else they will warn you while installing that you don't have the environment variables set.
    You only have to do that only once, and you leave the ";c:\ediabas\bin" there. It is necessary to do so to allow ediabas (software server between cable and BMW programs) to be accessed by Windows properly.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  8. #58
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    Excellent, thanks for the info. One question: in the middle of the post in the "Installation" section, you say too use Windows XP service pack 3 as the compatibility mode (**Newer Windows - Every install file MUST be opened Compatibility -> Windows XP (Service Pack 3), and "As Administrator"**), and in the Windows 8.1 section, you recommend using Windows XP service pack 2. I'm guessing I should go with service pack 2, but wanted to confirm before moving ahead.

    And that's very cool that romraider can work with some BWM computers, I had no idea that was going on.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  9. #59
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    Minor detail, sorry, it doesn't really matter which service pack. I updated to service pack 3 in the first section, and forgot to update the "service pack 2". It is getting updated now.



    ------

    All 3 of my BMWs are currently edited/tweaked with RomRaider and others. I helped define all that is available for MS41.1 ID60 (for my 328is, I'm "Enabled" on RR... trying to change my username here too).

    For my MS42 Z3 roady, I edited the maps to improve performance with the M54B30 intake manifold and tweaked the VANOS camshaft behavior a bit. At high rpm (4500+) the engine really wakes up. Still very little torque out of the little 2.5.
    Last edited by 328 Power 04; 07-16-2015 at 11:57 AM.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  10. #60
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    Cool. I'm going through the steps now, and I think I've missed something along the way. I added ";c:\ediabas\bin" to the end of the path system variable, set compatibility to XP SP 3 for the step 1 setup file, and ran it as an administrator.

    Then I'm getting a slightly different sequence of windows when I actually run it than what you posted in the instructions, which I don't think is a big deal, but I do have some specific questions in bold below:

    -Select English
    -Welcome window; Next to continue
    -License agreement; accept and next to continue
    -Read release notes and click next

    -Select Components to install. By default, everything is checked except for EDIC-driver. Should I leave that unchecked, or just install everything? Click next

    -Then it asks me where I want to install EDIABAS. The default destination is C:\EDIABAS. I tried setting this to C:, which I think matches up with the second step in your walkthrough, but it wouldn't accept that. I changed this to C:\, and that worked. It does a similar thing for all of the other components to install; it gives a default destination like C:\EC-APPS\INPA, which I then change to C:\. I changed this on all of the components that I chose to install. Is that correct?

    -Select Start Menu Folder to create, click next

    -Choose to execute backup and restore wizard (which I did, is that correct?) and create desktop icons/quick launch icons or not, click next

    -Select hardware interface settings; select STD:OBD, is that correct?

    -Select Com1, click next

    -Verify all settings, click install

    At this point I get an error that says:

    "Application for data backup not found. The wizard could not find a EDIABAS installation in the default directory "C:\EDIABAS". If there already exists an installation in another directory, please specify the path name. In case there is no EDIABAS installation on your system, please press the "skip" button."

    As I understand it, I'm installing EDIABAS right now, so this error makes sense (I think). Should I just click skip and move on with the installation?

    Thank you for the help, and I apologize if these are stupid questions!
    Last edited by kornfeld; 07-16-2015 at 01:38 PM.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  11. #61
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    You do not need to change the directories of the installation. Under components, choose "Complete Installation" if not chosen. (EDIC unchecked is correct, you need the rest)

    Let it go to the defaults,
    Ediabas to C:\EDIABAS,
    WinKFP/NFS to C:\EC-APPS\NFS,
    INPA to C:\EC-APPS\INPA
    NCSExpert to C:\NCSEXPER


    Uncheck "execute backup and restore wizard"

    STD:OBD is what you choose for USB cables, CORRECT.
    COM1 is ok, but you can always change it later if you have COM port conflicts - See "Connection Troubleshoot" The COM port generally needs to match the USB Cable's COM port.



    You can redo the installation by just restarting it all over again. You do not have to uninstall or anything.

    If you want to clean up your "C:" Directory after it dumped the files/folders in there unsorted (from when you changed the directory), sort the C:\ by date, and just delete what you installed last. It will be files and folders. Then run the installation again starting with step1

    - - - Updated - - -




    I see where the directions were a little confusing, I had originally copied and pasted them.


    Now Windows 8 instructions are fixed for the first part. Working on all of them slowly.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Instructions pdf inside INPA_502_Enabled_ReUpdated.zip, and instructions on post 1 have been updated and fixed to actually represent what is being installed
    Last edited by 328 Power 04; 07-16-2015 at 03:34 PM.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  12. #62
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    Huzzah! After much tweaking, I finally got everything to work tonight so I could clear the airbag error light I introduced when I left the door airbag unplugged and turned the ignition on. Thank you to 328 Power for putting this all together, and for all of the other posters in this thread for posting other useful info. This was all much more fiddly than romraider, but the walkthroughs and FAQ's helped immensely.

    Unfortunately, in the process of monkeying around with my computer, I screwed something major up that I haven't been able to repair. All of the tiles disappeared from my modern/touchscreen Windows 8 desktop, and all of the icons disappeared from my regular Windows desktop. Nothing was actually deleted from my computer, but I really messed up some file associations somehow. I think I'm going to have to wipe my computer and start from fresh unfortunately...while my computer still works (and it connected to the ECU on my car just fine), it has a few weird idiosyncrasies right now that I haven't been able to remedy. Time to nuke it from orbit.

    Anyhow, at least I know the cables that I bought work and that all of the software does function on my computer, so that's a big plus in my eyes.
    Last edited by kornfeld; 07-21-2015 at 12:10 AM.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  13. #63
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    I reinstalled everything and had a few additional pieces of information that might be worth adding to the instructions:


    -When extracting each of the three main files ("Step_1_Install_BMW_Tools.exe" , "Step_2_Install_INPA.exe" , and "Step_3_UPDATE.exe"), I created a folder for each bundle of extracted files. I titled these folders Step 1, Step 2, and Step 3. If you create a folder that has a space in it (like I did by titling the folders step 2 instead of step2), the install will hang when you are part way through step 2. Therefore, don't create or use any folders that have spaces in their title (like My Documents). I couldn't figure out what was going wrong at that point, and found the answer to my issue here: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=926813

    -In step 3, should you run "C:\Ediabas\Hardware\Obd\OBDSetup.exe" in XP SP3 compatibility mode and as an administrator? I did, and all seems to work well, but I don't know if this is necessary. Could be good to clarify in the instructions.

    -Do all of the things you access via INPA require you to be connected to the port in the engine bay? It would be great to have a list of where you should be plugged in when you're trying to accomplish X. I see a few things mentioned in this thread, but I don't think everything is covered. For example, Randy said:

    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    <snip>

    So we have TxD2 going to two ports. The same communication pin on the DME and EGS are connected to both the 20 pin and the 16 pin. The difference in the protocol, OBDii vs BMW, is done by recognizing the initialization in software. Both protocols use the same hardware. Thus you can access the DME OBDii from the 16 port as expected, or from the 20 pin port with an adapter. Likewise, you can use INPA to access the BMW protocol from the 20 pin, or the 16 pin inside the car. It's all the same wire. It does not matter which port you use for either protocol.

    Note, for the 16 pin to work, the cap has to be on the 20 pin. The cap does the daisy-chain so that you can't have two scanners plugged in at once.

    <snip>
    However, I couldn't access the airbag menu from the 16 pin in the car (the cap was on the 20 pin). I unplugged from the 16 pin, added the adapter, removed the cap in the engine bay and plugged in...and then I could access the airbag menu. Should it have been available from the regular OBD II plug?


    Again, thanks for everything.
    Last edited by kornfeld; 07-21-2015 at 10:57 PM.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  14. #64
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    No, you can only access the DME and EGS from the 16 pin. All other modules are on TxD, which is only wired to the 20 pin. Thus for the airbag you have to go under the hood.


    /.randy

  15. #65
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    Perfect post...you're helping to clarify my question. If I have it right, the DME is the engine control (digital motor electronics), and the EGS is the transmission control (elektronisch getriebesteuerung, or electronic transmission control). So engine things and transmission things are accessed via the 16 pin connector.

    A few questions: Do cars with a manual transmission have an EGS? Do the chassis systems (ABS and DSC) and the body systems (airbag, onboard computer, electronic vehicle immobilization, etc) have their own acronyms as well? Are all DME and EGS systems accessed via the 16 pin, and all chassis and body systems accessed via the 20 pin, or are there exceptions?

    (Also, I'm seeing back in the first post that, "Some modules can only be read through the 20-pin port (use adapter). They are (but not limited to): Airbag, ABS, DSC, Cruise Control, EWS security, Central Body Electronics, Auto Transmission, etc." So there is already a bit of info on this that I had forgotten when I first read through it.)
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  16. #66
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    Yes, every module has a BMW assigned acronym. The technical documentation and scanner uses these same acronyms, so it's helpful to be consistent. It gets really annoying when you are searching eBay for a E39 TCU (Tele Communications Unit) and get a screen full of EGS transmission controllers.

    The post of mine you quoted above was specificly about the difference between TxD and TxD2. The part you quoted was about TxD2; the OBDii compliant modules. The paragraph right after the quote reiterated that the modules that aren't required to be OBDii compliant are on TxD and can only be accessed from under the hood.
    Last edited by rf900rkw; 07-22-2015 at 01:11 PM.


    /.randy

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    Yes, every module has a BMW assigned acronym. The technical documentation and scanner uses these same acronyms, so it's helpful to be consistent. It gets really annoying when you are searching eBay for a E39 TCU (Tele Communications Unit) and get a screen full of EGS transmission controllers.

    The post of mine you quoted above was specificly about the difference between TxD and TxD2. The part you quoted was about TxD2; the OBDii compliant modules. The paragraph right after the quote reiterated that the modules that aren't required to be OBDii compliant are on TxD and can only be accessed from under the hood.
    One hundred twenty (120) acronyms, when the 07/2008 Autologics Training Manual for BMWs was printed. Probably the most-used appendix in the 1"+ thick book!

    I haven't contributed much to this thread, nor do I pretend to be able to comprehend all of it, but I do have a simple question regarding the 16 & 20 pin connectors. Are there modules that can only be accessed through the 16 pin connector, or are ALL of them accessible via the 20 pin? I knew a long time ago that there were modules only reachable via the 20 pin, but never thought about it going the other way around...

    While I have both 16 & 20 pin connectors for the Autologics, by default, I always reach for the 20 pin.

    As concerns the airbag module and resets, would anybody really want to be sitting in the seat when manipulating it? I think they did all the dumbasses** in the world a favor, when they made you go under the hood for that one!

    Thanks for the clarification.





    ** sorry, been watching a lot of That 70s Show recently, and that word seems to come up a lot

  18. #68
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    All modules are wired to the 20 pin via some combination of TxD, TxD2, and RxD. Only TxD2 is extended to the 16 pin.

    I'm fine sitting in the seat while messing with the airbags. You have to on most cars, including all non-Z3 BMWs post 2001. I've yet to see a scanner that had a bi-directional command to test the airbag .


    /.randy

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    All modules are wired to the 20 pin via some combination of TxD, TxD2, and RxD. Only TxD2 is extended to the 16 pin.

    I'm fine sitting in the seat while messing with the airbags. You have to on most cars, including all non-Z3 BMWs post 2001. I've yet to see a scanner that had a bi-directional command to test the airbag .
    Reminds me of once when I was working on the fire/safety system on an offshore (Gulf of Mexico) production platform; goes something like "what's this (TEST) switch for...?"

    Dumped a whole rack, maybe a dozen 5' x 18" cylinders of Halon into an MCC Room.

    Well, we know the solenoid valves worked!

    Thanks for the confirmation though, I was under the impression that you could communicate with everything from under the hood.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by rf900rkw View Post
    The post of mine you quoted above was specificly about the difference between TxD and TxD2. The part you quoted was about TxD2; the OBDii compliant modules. The paragraph right after the quote reiterated that the modules that aren't required to be OBDii compliant are on TxD and can only be accessed from under the hood.
    That all is starting to make sense. I'm still trying to understand the relationships between the sea of acronyms (RxD, TxD, TxD2, DME, EGS, INPA, etc) and the two separate physical ports in the car.

    Randy F's question was helpful as well...so for the shade-tree diagnostician, is there any reason to use the OBD II port (except for the fact that you can be seated a bit more easily with the computer)?

    Also, do manual transmission cars have an EGS, or is it only present on the automatics?
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  21. #71
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    On our older cars, only Engine control unit and transmission control unit is ported through the in car OBD port. However they are also available at the 20pin port when you have the OBD cap in place. So essentially all modules are reachable via 20pin. A quick engine scan for CEL is a bit more convenient through the OBD, that's all. (Also logging with Romraider is easier connected inside the car )

    The manual cars have no transmission control unit, EGS. Just automatics.



    Your curiosity is amazing, as you ask very good questions.
    I wouldn't be surprised if you will be very advanced not before long.
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  22. #72
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    The obdii port is handy for real time data, diagnosing while driving. The gist of these posts is you can run obdii or INPA from the 16 pin, which ever fits your needs better.


    For us, EGS is for automatic only.


    /.randy

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by 328 Power 04 View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if you will be very advanced not before long.
    Ha, we'll see about that, based on how not-smoothly my initial attempt at this was. I'm just glad I messed up my laptop instead of bricking the ECU! (I mean, DME. )

    Once I get all of the wrinkles worked out with this software, I'm going to have to look into using romraider as well.
    2001 Z3 3.0 Coupe--Sterling Gray/Sunroof Delete/5MT

  24. #74
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    I will be working on adding a feature to INPA where it will show a "Z3" menu (E36 menu named as Z3) and placed on the main screen, instead of under old. (to relieve the constant reminder of our aging cars??)


    It would be through an .exe that just updates the current installation, instead of having to reinstall everything.

    Interest?
    -Abel

    - E36 328is ~210-220whp: Lots of Mods.
    - 2000 Z3: Many Mods.
    - 2003 VW Jetta TDI Manual 47-50mpg
    - 1999 S52 Estoril M Coupe
    - 2014 328d Wagon, self-tuned, 270hp/430ft-lbs
    - 2019 M2 Competition, self-tuned, 504whp
    - 2016 Mini Cooper S

  25. #75
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    It's just a single text file change. Why not show what to change, or offer just the changed (ini, ipo??) file.


    /.randy

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