M54-M52TU DIY Solution to the troublesome CCV system, (Pic Heavy)

[BavarianE39]

Finished this yesterday afternoon and took it for a couple short drives since. Immediate feedback is the car is idling a lot smoother and no "Mayo" so far. Will update later.

Note: This would have been the 3x CCV with new hoses I've had to replace since I bought the car in 06...

Sweet! Glad to hear, we need more people to do this! I was also on my 3rd ccv on my 528I as well.

[kuwacs]

I'm going to look into doing this. I'm not sure if I actually have any CCV issues, though. Haven't seen any mayo or start issues, though I think I do have a slight whistling from that area (though it could be from my alternator getting ready to kick the bucket). However from feeling around, the dipstick hose has a notch worn into it from rubbing on the (sub)frame.

[BavarianE39]

I'm going to look into doing this. I'm not sure if I actually have any CCV issues, though. Haven't seen any mayo or start issues, though I think I do have a slight whistling from that area (though it could be from my alternator getting ready to kick the bucket). However from feeling around, the dipstick hose has a notch worn into it from rubbing on the (sub)frame.

Very high vacuum pressure from the dip stick or oil cap is a pretty telltale sign of a bad ccv. Yes the whistle could possibly be your alternator or maybe belt tensioner bearing.

[Jason5driver]

Very high vacuum pressure from the dip stick or oil cap is a pretty telltale sign of a bad ccv. Yes the whistle could possibly be your alternator or maybe belt tensioner bearing.

Have you ran your X5 since installing the PCV...?
I have noticed massive suction/ vacuum within the oil dipstick tube after shutting the car off.
I could hear a big whoosh after pulling the dipstick, after I shut the car off.

[BavarianE39]

Have you ran your X5 since installing the PCV...?
I have noticed massive suction/ vacuum within the oil dipstick tube after shutting the car off.
I could hear a big whoosh after pulling the dipstick, after I shut the car off.

Yeah I drive it daily, I had the same thing you're describing when my ccv failed, since I installed this pcv I haven't had that problem. I know that pcv creates a slightly higher vacuum, maybe using a smaller fitting after the pcv valve can help you out in this situation.

[Jason5driver]

Yeah I drive it daily, I had the same thing you're describing when my ccv failed, since I installed this pcv I haven't had that problem. I know that pcv creates a slightly higher vacuum, maybe using a smaller fitting after the pcv valve can help you out in this situation.

I am pretty sure I am using the same exact valve as you.
I started with a 3/4" hose from the valve cover, then right to the PCV valve (large valve end), then to a short piece of 3/8" hose that fits over the smaller valve end.
Then, I slipped a 3/4" hose over the short 3/8" hose, and ran a 3/4" hose to a 'T' fitting, connecting the Air Distribution Piece to a 3/4" hose on the larger port.
I ran a 15/32" hose from the far end of the 'T' to the smaller port of the Air Distribution Piece.

Perhaps there is too much vacuum, like you suggest...?

I think I might try using the OEM hoses on the Air Distribution Piece and see what happens...?
I would also prefer to use AN hoses and fittings for a cleaner look, and ease of connecting/ disconnecting hoses.
However, I am not sure where to buy AN fittings/ hoses...

I will take a picture of my setup and post it, and see what you think...

Thanks!
Jason

[Toushi]

I can't say that I'm not skeptical about this...
I mean why would the BMW engineers go through all that effort to make the CCV system the way it is if it could be replaced by a simple PCV system? There must be some benefit or something from the OEM system...
I'd prefer to keep my car as stock as possible really.

[NeilM]

I can't say that I'm not skeptical about this...
I mean why would the BMW engineers go through all that effort to make the CCV system the way it is if it could be replaced by a simple PCV system? There must be some benefit or something from the OEM system...
I'd prefer to keep my car as stock as possible really.

A fair comment. Here's a link to some further reading about why the engine may not lend itself well to something as simple as a PCV valve: http://www.106rallye.co.uk/members/d...hersystems.pdf
(The non-mathematically inclined can skip the equations and read the text.)

We have BMW's updated cold weather CCV kit on our '03 525iT. I wouldn't say it's perfect — there still seems to be too much water vapour condensing out in the oil — but at least it hasn't frozen solid like the original.

Neil

[BavarianE39]

I am pretty sure I am using the same exact valve as you.
I started with a 3/4" hose from the valve cover, then right to the PCV valve (large valve end), then to a short piece of 3/8" hose that fits over the smaller valve end.
Then, I slipped a 3/4" hose over the short 3/8" hose, and ran a 3/4" hose to a 'T' fitting, connecting the Air Distribution Piece to a 3/4" hose on the larger port.
I ran a 15/32" hose from the far end of the 'T' to the smaller port of the Air Distribution Piece.

Perhaps there is too much vacuum, like you suggest...?

I think I might try using the OEM hoses on the Air Distribution Piece and see what happens...?
I would also prefer to use AN hoses and fittings for a cleaner look, and ease of connecting/ disconnecting hoses.
However, I am not sure where to buy AN fittings/ hoses...

I will take a picture of my setup and post it, and see what you think...

Thanks!
Jason

My guess is that it's too much vacuum since you have both ports on the air distributor connected while I have one. I'm still planning on connecting the other side on mine this week, I'll be specifically using a smaller T fitting to restrict the vacuum from both ports, maybe that's something you can try as well.

[Jason5driver]

Current picture:

[BavarianE39]

Current picture:

Well looking at those pics my guess would still be that your system is pulling too much vacuum from both ports,
I bought all the parts to attach my other port, I'll be using a smaller T fitting to reduce the vacuum pull.

Also doing this conversion on my neighbors 330i this weekend cause his 2nd winter CCV froze yesterday. Should be a fun weekend!

[Jason5driver]

Thanks for the reply and feed-back...!
Ever think about utilizing the M50 CCV setup/ hoses...?
Link (see #1):
http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts...84&hg=11&fg=15
The M50 setup doesn't use hose clamps at the valve cover, they are just barbed so the stock hoses just slide on.
I am going to try using some sort of oil catch can, in conjuction with the current setup I have with the PCV valve.
I may have to change valves to help regulate the system better as well.
Also, it looks like in order to incorporate an oil catch can, I have to route the hose down and towards the intake manifold.
Basically, placing the oil catch can underneath the intake manifold, very close to where the original CCV valve was located.
Reason being, I think it will help keep the oil catch can from freezing.
I think I will also try using the stock hoses only at the Air Distribution Piece.
Again, I would really like to use AN fittings and braided hoses.
I think it would look much cleaner, and ease connecting and disconnecting hoses.
However, I still do not know were to find the correct AN hoses and fittings...

I did contact a local speed-shop, who specializes in custom euro cars, and talked a little bit on the phone about catch cans.
They seemed pretty familiar using oil catch cans, and they suggested using a re-circulating system in conjuction with an oil catch can.
They have a few different catch cans there at their shop that I am going to check out next week.

Sorry for the rambling...
LOL...

Thanks,
Jason

[NeilM]

Again, I would really like to use AN fittings and braided hoses. I think it would look much cleaner, and ease connecting and disconnecting hoses. However, I still do not know were to find the correct AN hoses and fittings...

Pegasus Racing: https://www.pegasusautoracing.com

Neil

[Jason5driver]

Pegasus Racing: https://www.pegasusautoracing.com

Neil

Thank you for the link...!

Also, I recently inspected the hoses at the Autozone Pcv valve, and found quite a bit of oil and condensation, all throughout the hoses to the Air Distribution Piece.
I also found yellow goop at the oil filler cap as well.
Which leads me to NOT connecting to the intake at all.
So, I re-installed the newly cleaned stock OEM CCV garbage until I can figure out a better game plan.
Picture of found crap;
"Bavarian",
Have you checked or inspected your hoses...?

[BavarianE39]

Thank you for the link...!

Also, I recently inspected the hoses at the Autozone Pcv valve, and found quite a bit of oil and condensation, all throughout the hoses to the Air Distribution Piece.
I also found yellow goop at the oil filler cap as well.
Which leads me to NOT connecting to the intake at all.
So, I re-installed the newly cleaned stock OEM CCV garbage until I can figure out a better game plan.
Picture of found crap;
"Bavarian",
Have you checked or inspected your hoses...?

I'll have a look inside mine when I have a chance, maybe we can look into some sort of insulating tape to put around the hose? I have not had any yellow goop on my oil cap since installing this.

EDIT: took my hoses off, had some small yellow spots on the pcv, the hose had a little yellow inside of it, but nothing close to what the OEM ccv has inside of it. Oil cap is still clean without any yellow spots on it.

[Emons34]

So this idea was a bust? Factory CCV is still more efficient?

[BavarianE39]

So this idea was a bust? Factory CCV is still more efficient?

Wouldn't say it's a bust, been about a month now driving everyday in 5 degree weather, My oil cap still has no goop on it, idles perfectly, and hasn't burned a drop of oil in over 2000 miles of driving. Like I said earlier, everyone has a different opinion on this subject. It's your car you do what you like to it.

I'm keeping this system in my car. Also installed this on my neighbors 330 a few weeks ago and he's had no trouble with it at all.

[Mike WW]

Awesome! How is this different from the old system? I still don't have a clear grasp on how PCV/CCV, etc work.

The factory system is designed (and has worked well for me) to have the oil vapors hit the side of the CCV, separate out that oil and let it drain back to the oil pan. Apparently climate and driving habits are critical, but I've never had a problem with it and I've got almost 250K on M52/M52TU cars now, and I've never had to add a bit of oil to any of them. Northern Calif isn't as warm in the winter as some people think, but nowhere even close to the OP in Minn. The advantage, besides not having to add oil, is they can make a more effective, cheaper cat and who wants to replace those things. The disadvantage is they should have provided some means to keep it warm in cold weather, by electric heat or engine coolant or whatever as way too many people have had problems with them even if I haven't.

I can understand the OP and why he took the approach he did, but IMO if you aren't having problems with it, I wouldn't mess with it.

[BavarianE39]

The factory system is designed (and has worked well for me) to have the oil vapors hit the side of the CCV, separate out that oil and let it drain back to the oil pan. Apparently climate and driving habits are critical, but I've never had a problem with it and I've got almost 250K on M52/M52TU cars now, and I've never had to add a bit of oil to any of them. Northern Calif isn't as warm in the winter as some people think, but nowhere even close to the OP in Minn. The advantage, besides not having to add oil, is they can make a more effective, cheaper cat and who wants to replace those things. The disadvantage is they should have provided some means to keep it warm in cold weather, by electric heat or engine coolant or whatever as way too many people have had problems with them even if I haven't.

I can understand the OP and why he took the approach he did, but IMO if you aren't having problems with it, I wouldn't mess with it.

I definitely agree with you here, if you're not having problems with yours then just leave it alone. I was replacing them yearly and was scared of oil hydro locking my engine like I've seen at my shop before, so I decided to go this route. Before I did this I was also looking at somehow providing auxiliary heating to the CCV unit, I looked at routing coolant lines similar to how Mercedes heats their windshield washer fluid and looked into 12 volt heating tape.

None of those seemed as easy as this hence why I tried it. I'll keep updating everyone as to how its going periodically. So far in these cold temps I've had no issues.

[Jason5driver]

I definitely agree with you here, if you're not having problems with yours then just leave it alone. I was replacing them yearly and was scared of oil hydro locking my engine like I've seen at my shop before, so I decided to go this route. Before I did this I was also looking at somehow providing auxiliary heating to the CCV unit, I looked at routing coolant lines similar to how Mercedes heats their windshield washer fluid and looked into 12 volt heating tape.

None of those seemed as easy as this hence why I tried it. I'll keep updating everyone as to how its going periodically. So far in these cold temps I've had no issues.

I can still see a lot of oil film within your hose and pcv valve.
I want to eliminate the oil film from getting into the intake, completely.
Hence, the reason I think utilizing a filtered oil catch can in conjunction with a pcv valve will keep the oil out of the intake, and keep from having too much vacuum through the system.

When talking to my local speed-shop, they at first offered using an oil catch can from a Mini-Cooper, however, after I told him more about the M54 and how the stock CCV system works, he voted against doing anything because he thought the a check-engine light would come on, and that the M54 requires too much vacuum through its system in order for a typical oil catch can to work.

[BavarianE39]

I can still see a lot of oil film within your hose and pcv valve.
I want to eliminate the oil film from getting into the intake, completely.
Hence, the reason I think utilizing a filtered oil catch can in conjunction with a pcv valve will keep the oil out of the intake, and keep from having too much vacuum through the system.

When talking to my local speed-shop, they at first offered using an oil catch can from a Mini-Cooper, however, after I told him more about the M54 and how the stock CCV system works, he voted against doing anything because he thought the a check-engine light would come on, and that the M54 requires too much vacuum through its system in order for a typical oil catch can to work.

Hmmm, keep us updated on utilizing a catch can, the one on my 540 has been working great for over a year now, but that's a completely different engine. If you can successfully install a catch can into this system it would definitely be a nice addition.

[bimmerfiver]

I am installing an Oil Catch Can into my I6 this weekend.
My CCV is filled with mayonnaise.
My car was flat-bedded last week to the shop; car started, then RPM's fluttered, followed by shut-down.
The cure?
Nothing.
Put the car in a warm shop, wait 15 minutes and it started/ran perfectly.
It's done this same exact thing three times in the past five years, and each time it was a munged-up CCV coupled with extremely cold temperatures.
This winter in the northeast has been, and remains ridiculously cold.
Parts I ordered for Plan 'A':

1. An AMW Oil Catch Can in sexy silver:

http://www.accmachtech.com/catchcans.asp

2. DAYCO part # 80424. This is a Brass Hose Connector, connects 3/4" to 5/8" hose. Will use this at the Crankcase outlet, taking the OEM connection, cutting it, clamping on a short piece of 3/4" hose...within a few inches, add the DAYCO # 80424, where you then add a few feet of 5/8" hose. DAYCO part seen here:

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/d...424/19590180-P

http://www.amazon.com/Dayco-80424-Br.../dp/B000CJ1VUW

2. Some 5/8" to 3/8" reducers for the two hoses leading into the AMW Oil Catch Can, THOGUS part #TRC80106/P. These are 5/8" to 3/8" reducers. They are plastic, but made to withstand severe temperatures, high pressure, and oil/gas. They are available at GRAINGER, $2.82 for a pack of 10. See here:

http://www.grainger.com/product/4EMP...-_-productfeed

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/ite...1316&catid=465

http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/fil...lyethylene.pdf

3. I also ordered the same 5/8" to 3/8" reducers for the two hoses leading into the Oil Catch Can, in brass. The plastic THOGUS parts will arrive first, and I'm sure they'd last many years. However, in the Spring, I'll swap in 2 metal versions of these reducers to make it ready for Terminator Genisys 5. These brass reducers are for some reason hard to find, and can also be expensive. I found them on EBay for cheap, as seen here:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/190829794602...%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

4. A proper PCV Valve, Purolator part # PV1050, which I'll install leading into the Air Distribution Piece:

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/p...1050/5850312-P

5. A handful of stainless hoses clamps.

6. One foot of 3/4" Transmission/Fuel Hose.

7. Six feet of 5/8" Transmission/Fuel Hose.

8. One foot of 3/8" Transmission/Fuel Hose.

9. Assorted sized caps to use the proper one, needing to cap-off the Oil Dipstick.

I don't believe the system BavarianE39 installed will work. He did a neat thing of bypassing the OEM CCV, but the cholesterol (condensation aka mayo) will still fill find its way into the hoses, and his aftermarket PCV. An Oil Catch Can is a statin drug. It leads the condensation into a trap, literally, away from the heart (engine).

My car has 196K miles, we've put four, yes 4 OEM BMW CCV systems in the car. Including the one it came with, that's 5 CCV's in 12 years. I installed the magical dipstick and *winterized* OEM version three years ago...and it lasted three years.

The OEM System is tragically flawed.

I will install the above pieces/parts, which I wanted to-do many years ago. This fellow did what I wanted to-do back in 2008, and I will do this upcoming weekend:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTGNHbUDCvM

If the above system doesn't work, I will enact 'Sarah Connor Plan B'; I will take a new OEM CCV Valve, and move it to where I intend to install the AMW Oil Catch Can (in front of the driver side cabin air filter). I refuse to install another OEM CCV under the intake manifold. I'll splice hoses to a new OEM CCV Valve, so that I can easily replace it every winter LOL. The OEM CCV is tragically flawed, but to waste hours leaning over to do it again and again? I cannot do it. When I replaced my Air Distribution Piece a few years back, I scratched my head, asking why I couldn't splice a rubber hose from it, and one from the crankcase, and simply place the OEM CCV somewhere else?

Regardless, I don't think I'll have to touch Plan 'B'. The Plan 'A' should work just fine. . .

BMW = Like Tom Bailey said, they are a machine needing work, with a labor of love:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41eON7zXdeo

Tom Bailey from the Thompson Twins for all you 80's folks below, and Germany World Cup FTW:

[BavarianE39]

:

I like the idea that you have, either update here or make a new thread when you install your setup because I am very interested in it. I installed a catch can in my 540 in a similar fashion but I still utilized the factory CCV on the intake, I also had it hooked up to the oil filter drain line. On yours it looks like you'll have to periodically drain the goop out of the catch can ?
Wish our cars weren't cursed with these oil separator issues, whether it's on the V8 or I6...

[bimmerfiver]

Will do.
In the meantime, researched and some phone calls leads me to believe...
Aeroquip makes great hoses for this task. Even comes in Bavarian Blue.
Aeroquip part # FC332-06 for 3/8", FC332-10 for 5/8", and FC332-12 for 3/4".
FYI here:

http://hosewarehouse.com/Hydraulic-H...ual-to-FBV0400

http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/uploads/ga...e7a528aa0b.jpg

http://www.eaton.com/ecm/groups/publ...t/pll_1071.pdf

They stock and deliver ASAP:

http://www.morelandhose.com/

Application:	For gasoline, fuel and lubricating oils, air and water. Not recommended for hydraulic impulse applications and not approved for airbrake applications. For more information on specific fluid applications and high temperature ratings see the Fluid Compatibility Chart link below.	SAE Rating:	None
Other Ratings:	None	Tube:	AQP elastomer tube
Reinforcement:	Textile braid	Cover:	AQP elastomer
Temperature Range:	-40°C to + 150°C (-40°F to +302°F) Air not to exceed +121°C (+250°F) Water not to exceed +82°C (+180°F)
Reusable Fittings:	Reusable Fittings
Fluid Compatibility Chart:	Fluid Compatibility Chart

Part Number	Hose I.D.		Hose O.D.		Max. Operating Pressure		Minimum Burst Pressure		Mininimum Bend Radius		Vacuum Service		Weight of Hose
	mm	in	mm	in	bar	psi	bar	psi	mm	in	kPa	in/Hg	Kg/m	lbs/ft
FC332-04	6,4	0.25	12,4	0.49	20,0	300	82,0	1200	76,2	3.00	94,8	28	0,12	0.08
FC332-06	9,7	0.38	16,0	0.63	20,0	300	82,0	1200	76,2	3.00	94,8	28	0,18	0.12
FC332-08	12,7	0.50	19,1	0.75	20,0	300	82,0	1200	127,0	5.00	94,8	28	0,22	0.15
FC332-10	16,0	0.63	23,1	0.91	20,0	300	82,0	1200	152,4	6.00	60,9	18	0,30	0.20
FC332-12	19,1	0.75	26,4	1.04	20,0	300	82,0	1200	177,8	7.00	60,9	18	0,30	0.28

[BavarianE39]

Little update for anyone following. Been well over a month and a half now since doing this install. Car hasn't skipped a beat whatsoever, no oil consumption to report, exhaust tips are clean and free of carbon, oil cap still has no goop on it. Same goes for my neighbors 330i that we installed this system on, both happy with the results. -15 degree mornings seem to have no effect on this pcv.