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Thread: If you just turbo'd an m6x how much boost can you run before a tune?

  1. #1
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    If you just turbo'd an m6x how much boost can you run before a tune?

    Hey guy's, im just curious about your opinions on this. With limited options of how to boost an e34 540i i started giving serious consideration to a rear mounted turbo.

    My only question at this point is, if i got and installed it can i run say even 3-5 psi w/o any sort of tune you think? Without it being bad for it or running like non sense.. It would help if i could drive it low boost till i work out the kinks then take it to the tuner. Otherwise tow trucks and dyno fee's are an immediate mandatory expenditure.


    Guesses and opinions appreciated. I had a kenne bell s/c mustang before, and rebuilt a friends b20 turbo once. But i have never started with a car, then added boost..
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
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  2. #2
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    It would probably go so lean it would cut out with any boost and no tune.. You could use a rising rate fuel pressure regulator and then fine tune it after
    '95 318i - DASC Supercharged - 269 Camshafts - 30lb injectors - Ostrich 2.0 tuning - Coil On Plug conversion - 11lb flywheel 228mm clutch - AST 4100's,

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danny318 View Post
    It would probably go so lean it would cut out with any boost and no tune.. You could use a rising rate fuel pressure regulator and then fine tune it after
    Hmmm ok, i kinda got the impression most home kits run stock tune first start up and drives on 2-3# i am going to add a bigger fuel pump and a FPR


    ---- curious about your set up.. Whats that pushing?!
    Last edited by imae30driver; 12-12-2014 at 06:44 PM.
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

  4. #4
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    Without the tune 1-2psi is probably max what you can run safely.
    I have tuned completely stock unopened M60B40 Turbo on E85, ended up with 618WHP and 872WNm (643ft-lb) at 1.2bar (17psi).
    Why bother with 4psi ?
    E30 325i '90 - M50B25 stock + ARP + HX52 + E85 = 651WHP
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laimis View Post
    Without the tune 1-2psi is probably max what you can run safely.
    I have tuned completely stock unopened M60B40 Turbo on E85, ended up with 618WHP and 872WNm (643ft-lb) at 1.2bar (17psi).
    Why bother with 4psi ?
    Just so when i install it i can drive it in general and look for boost leaks first ect, let alone drive it to a tuner vs tow it. Idk anyone who tunes m6x in gereral for a turbo and so i have contacted DUDMD as he is building a turbo m60 and does my kick ass n/a tune.

    please tell me more about that boosted m60! What type of ECU/EMU..? Stock? Miller, war?
    Last edited by imae30driver; 12-12-2014 at 07:42 PM.
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by imae30driver View Post
    Just so when i install it i can drive it in general and look for boost leaks first ect, let alone drive it to a tuner vs tow it. Idk anyone who tunes m6x in gereral for a turbo and so i have contacted DUDMD as he is building a turbo m60 and does my kick ass n/a tune.

    please tell me more about that boosted m60! What type of ECU/EMU..? Stock? Miller, war?
    VEMS v3.7 ECU
    80lb Siemens injectors
    E30 325i '90 - M50B25 stock + ARP + HX52 + E85 = 651WHP
    E46 330cd '04 M-Technic
    E92 335i '10 M-Technic


    Dynapack 2WD 1500HP Dyno

  7. #7
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    I imagine getting a decent reliable safe tune for even 4-500rwhp is going to be the hardest part.
    Will you tune it for me from there lol? Ill give you the spec's.
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by imae30driver View Post
    I imagine getting a decent reliable safe tune for even 4-500rwhp is going to be the hardest part.
    Will you tune it for me from there lol? Ill give you the spec's.
    With true engine management it's not a rocket science. Just get it tuned on the dyno by a trusted tuner and that's all.
    Unopened M60 limits on E85 are pretty high - up to 700WHP and 900WNm proven few times by Scandinavian tuners as well.
    It is recommended to keep rev limiter at 6500rpm for stock rods.

    I don't do remote tuning, sorry.
    E30 325i '90 - M50B25 stock + ARP + HX52 + E85 = 651WHP
    E46 330cd '04 M-Technic
    E92 335i '10 M-Technic


    Dynapack 2WD 1500HP Dyno

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laimis View Post
    With true engine management it's not a rocket science. Just get it tuned on the dyno by a trusted tuner and that's all.
    Unopened M60 limits on E85 are pretty high - up to 700WHP and 900WNm proven few times by Scandinavian tuners as well.
    It is recommended to keep rev limiter at 6500rpm for stock rods.

    I don't do remote tuning, sorry.
    Since you are so helpfull. If i wanted to buy a new fuel pump to support 500whp what size would you recommend? I assume i have a 255lph stock and spray 100 wet shot no issue. Was planning to do at least 340lph maybe more now as i still want to spray a small wet shot occasionally at the strip/dyno so i need an addition fuel supply..
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by imae30driver View Post
    Since you are so helpfull. If i wanted to buy a new fuel pump to support 500whp what size would you recommend? I assume i have a 255lph stock and spray 100 wet shot no issue. Was planning to do at least 340lph maybe more now as i still want to spray a small wet shot occasionally at the strip/dyno so i need an addition fuel supply..
    Just stick to Turbo + E85 I know a guy in Sweden who had healthy 700WHP M60 setup and injected 200HP shot and guess what, both HG's popped

    Regarding fuel pumps, i don't have much experience with Walbro pumps, we use Bosch 044 almost on all cars.
    From my experience single 044 on E85 is enough for safe 500WHP, twin 044 - 1000WHP.
    Next week i will be having a Supra on the dyno with single in-tank Walbro 255 and see if 500WHP is doable.
    E30 325i '90 - M50B25 stock + ARP + HX52 + E85 = 651WHP
    E46 330cd '04 M-Technic
    E92 335i '10 M-Technic


    Dynapack 2WD 1500HP Dyno

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laimis View Post
    Just stick to Turbo + E85 I know a guy in Sweden who had healthy 700WHP M60 setup and injected 200HP shot and guess what, both HG's popped

    Regarding fuel pumps, i don't have much experience with Walbro pumps, we use Bosch 044 almost on all cars.
    From my experience single 044 on E85 is enough for safe 500WHP, twin 044 - 1000WHP.
    Next week i will be having a Supra on the dyno with single in-tank Walbro 255 and see if 500WHP is doable.
    IMO 400~ hp or so is the limit for a single 255.. LMK.

    will .044 fit directly? Have a link?
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

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    Any idea as to limits of an m60b30?

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    Quote Originally Posted by E36 HateR View Post
    Any idea as to limits of an m60b30?
    Not really, but i'm sure at 1-1.5bar will make some nice power hehe. Since b30 has smaller bore, i would expect better HG sealing as well.
    We had zero issues with b40 HG though..
    One of my customers is working now on M62B35 + Schwitzer S400, so in a month or two we'll see the results.
    (M60B30 and M62B35 both got 84mm bore).
    Last edited by Laimis; 12-13-2014 at 01:40 PM.
    E30 325i '90 - M50B25 stock + ARP + HX52 + E85 = 651WHP
    E46 330cd '04 M-Technic
    E92 335i '10 M-Technic


    Dynapack 2WD 1500HP Dyno

  14. #14
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    this is what im going to try and do on an e34 540i. My plan is universal kit as a start for parts. Get the turbo oil system figured out, then go to muffler shop i have a connection with and have the weld the turbo on where the muffler was and hang it then have then have then have them run a pipe with hangers to the front up to where i can meet it with couplers and elbows for the TB.


    Assuming i get my pipes situated, fuel pump upgraded ahead, oil for turbo handled, and vacuum/WG/BOV lines routed i just run no/low boost till i can get a SFMU or simular and bigger injector to take it to a tuner?

    Im sure i missed much.. Help relize how much i am missing, seems to simple lol.
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

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    I have heard (in general) guys wanting to do a low budget build will find a larger maf. figure out how much more flow rate the maf has in comparison to the one the car is tuned for. say 50%. then get injectors that are 50% more flow than the original injectors. put tthem both together and sometimes they get pretty close.

    just thinking that through it seems you could probably put a resistor on you maf. calculate the change in flow rate (at anything but max flow) and get injectors with more flow in the same percentage. if you are looking for 5 psi maybe the stock injectors are not maxed out on duty?

  16. #16
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    If you are going to do a rear turbo kit...just save your money and abort project now. That or just go supercharger. The benefits of turboz are pretty much completely abandoned in a rear mount setup, but you still have all the complexity.
    -Nick
    91 E30 M42 on VEMS

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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by wazzu70 View Post
    If you are going to do a rear turbo kit...just save your money and abort project now. That or just go supercharger. The benefits of turboz are pretty much completely abandoned in a rear mount setup, but you still have all the complexity.
    That seem's a rediculous statement. First off, i not only have personal experiance with a rear mount turbo witch i dyno'd 444whp on 5psi on a gto.. I know they work.

    Also, there are actually major benifits like the long charge pipe acting like an intercooler.
    There is far far less heat around engine bay and turbo this way.

    The entire challenge in turbocharging my car is the packaging under the hood with limited space and making custom exhuast manifolds that wrap around to one side yet still allowing room for a large turbo lol..

    In theory it is the opposite, all the pro's with out most of the complexity.
    will it be cheaper, no. Not really.. But there is more room to grow, and WAY cooler IMO


    I aim to be the worlds first, e34 540i/6 turbo wagon!
    Last edited by imae30driver; 12-14-2014 at 03:50 PM.
    1995 540i /6 speed, Black on black, VF m62 S/C kit v3 6psi - Cold air intake/ SSSquid Tune/racing exhuast, Vortech 8:1 RRFPR ,545 SSK /3.15 with LSD / rev-shift motor mounts/stage 4, 6 puck clutch/ K Sport coil overs / suede sparco 368 steering wheel, Recaro seats, N2O, M/T drag slicks
    "Skill can only get you so far, then comes money!"
    R . I . P Paul Walker - 1973 - 2013

  18. #18
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    Impressive numbers, you think it will hold roughly 540whp and tq with a supercharger and intercooler as well as meth injection on 93, e85 gas station is 50 minute drive over a mountain so you waste most of it

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by imae30driver View Post
    That seem's a rediculous statement. First off, i not only have personal experiance with a rear mount turbo witch i dyno'd 444whp on 5psi on a gto.. I know they work.

    Also, there are actually major benifits like the long charge pipe acting like an intercooler.
    There is far far less heat around engine bay and turbo this way.

    The entire challenge in turbocharging my car is the packaging under the hood with limited space and making custom exhuast manifolds that wrap around to one side yet still allowing room for a large turbo lol..

    In theory it is the opposite, all the pro's with out most of the complexity.
    will it be cheaper, no. Not really.. But there is more room to grow, and WAY cooler IMO


    I aim to be the worlds first, e34 540i/6 turbo wagon!
    Good luck! Can't wait to see spool results. All that piping you're talking about is bad for spool and the heat (energy) loss to the turbo means more lag than a traditional setup. Hopefully it all works out for you. Usually projects like this get scrapped. Hopefully you follow through!

    Mike
    IG: mikevanshellenbeck

  20. #20
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    Been in a few STS cars, and IMO they were a waste of money when a healthy built NA LSX with proper tuning, or a ProCharger kit are WAY better.

    Do a Vortech Si-Trim or T-Trim on E85 with stock compression and make great, consistent power! E85 does wonders for cooling the charge on supercharged set-ups, they seem to almost benefit more from it power wise than turbos.

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