E46 330i Automatic - M54B30 Turbo

[5mall5nail5]

Jon,

Your comments did not sit well with me, so I've taken some time to reflect and reply in a constructive manor.

There are many "directions" one can follow including specifications, documented industry best practice guidelines, and guidance from industry professionals. In general, I tend to pursue all 3, and balance their application based on my own tool and skill set.

There are no MIL specifications for concentric twisting because that is not the purpose of MIL specifications by design. Concentric twisting would part of a work order, work instruction, or as part of a Quality Specification guideline. MIL specifications define how a part is constructed, not how the assembly of those parts is performed.

Harnware is the wiring industry's benchmark design and construction software from TE. As part of it's "Help" documentation, it lists best practice for many types of harness construction steps. Below is a link to the document for Hand Cable Laying, as part of their Harness Assembly Instructions:

http://www.te.com/commerce/DocumentD...=SS&DocLang=EN

This is an example of industry best practice.

Lastly, I have been lucky to spend a fair amount of time in a number of professional automotive racing environments. This gave the opportunity to see first hand how wiring harnesses were constructed and utilized in some really nasty user environments. I've seen the innards of quite a few harnesses; some because they were torn apart due to crash damage, some due to maintenance damage, and some due to fire damage. All of the top race teams seemed to share common wiring harness practices, including concentric twisting. One such example was Penske Racing with the now retired Porsche LMP2 car. They had electrical gremlins, so harnesses were being cut open in the pits to try understand what was happening out the track. I saw those harnesses, which were built by Porsche Motorsport.

This is an example of professional experience.

Sorry Adam, didn't mean anything by it - no disrespect.

I sat with an MDA/NASA wiring specialist and our own engineers back at my old job when we were working on an optical comparator setup for lashing and solder splices along with staking, conformal coating, and potting... which proved to be an insanely complex and annoying thing to try and automate. It was right at the prime of my wiring my car (for the second time) and I was very interested in how they recommended doing everything. Everything I had asked and had been instructed revolved around high freq signals (high freq being relative here) being twisted together and never around a high current source as everything becomes a gigantic antenna. I have a series of PDFs that I was referred to by said engineers but will need to fix the links on DTAForum as the links are broken since I moved web servers - they're from NASA on lashing, splicing shielded cable, and looming and show the bundles. That said, professional motorsports do things differently and that's ok, I was just stating that in my 6.5 years of watching missiles get wired and assembled I never saw anyone wrap signal cables around like that and was instructed by a few groups that twisting individual signal wires with their respective sensor ground was preferred. That's not to say it doesn't work, doesn't look cool, or doesn't work well, because yeah it probably does, I was just coming from the standpoint of what I was taught. I hold the people who wired and designed the assemblies I am referring to at a high standard because missiles, jets, etc. can afford a lot less error than things on the ground. Again, no disrespect, just making conversation.

One thing to remember - the TE PDF you reference makes no mention of the application. Standard practice wiring a 1 khz hall effect sensor and a 24 ghz strain sensor are likely very, very different.

[PEI330Ci]

Jon,

Thanks for taking the time to explain your experience and perspective. It is relevant, and I enjoyed reading it.

[hakentt]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

[dburt86]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

glad you chimed in with your one of your usual constructive comments.

[Butters Stoch]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

Pretty sure this has long past expensive . OP is one of the brighter bulbs of the bunch, so I wouldn't hold my breath.

[PEI330Ci]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

For everyone's amusement, why do you think it won't run right?

[Jaze]

For everyone's amusement, why do you think it won't run right?

Don't bait the racist, bitter, old man. The world is a much better place without his participation, or input.

I am also around many professional race cars in many varying levels of competition, this is 100% the standard practice.

[PEI330Ci]

Pretty sure this has long past expensive .

That made me laugh...

[Rob43]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

I've got $5 dollars that says it will.



Rob43

[cdmbmw]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

glad you chimed in with your one of your usual constructive comments.

[wazzu70]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

For most people I would say that is true. Adam has the ability to stick with it, the intelligence to get it done and if he gets into trouble he has people to call. He is not a flake or someone with pie in the sky dreams.

Without a doubt this project will be completed and function as it should.

[herrubermensch]

I've got $5 dollars that says it will.



Rob43

I'm with you.

--Peter

[Binjammin]

For most people I would say that is true. Adam has the ability to stick with it, the intelligence to get it done and if he gets into trouble he has people to call. He is not a flake or someone with pie in the sky dreams.

Without a doubt this project will be completed and function as it should.

Even if it never runs (it will, of course), it's some of the nicest fab porn around here. If he took an axe to it before it ever started I'd still enjoy watching.

[PEI330Ci]

I admittedly have a focus and commitment that is unusual amongst most car guys.

My 2001 330Ci was a car stereo mule (Gutted to the frame to build) until 2005. From 2005 to 2009 it was a racing project.

The 330i has been a project car since 2010.

On top of this, most people experience some "life" events that draw them away from this hobby. I have moved cities 7 times since starting ownership of an E46, worked my "day job" on 5 continents, started a family, and nearly died twice. I know of many cases where just one of these life events caused a change in hobbies.

I might be crazy.

If for some reason this project ended tomorrow, I would be content with what it has achieved. I have learned a lot, and that has always been the point...

[5mall5nail5]

Any background on the dying twice thing? Wow. A very dynamic past!

[dburt86]

lol thats what i wanted to know too!!

[hobbit382]

Any background on the dying twice thing? Wow. A very dynamic past!

Well you know about the 330ci catching fire right? I would call that a near death experience.

[gnarfy]

Mark my word. This will be one expensive fiasco. It will never run right. Sorry for being pessimistic.

wow, talk about a constructive comment...

[5mall5nail5]

Well you know about the 330ci catching fire right? I would call that a near death experience.

I do know, yes.

[TheJuggernaut]

If for some reason this project ended tomorrow, I would be content with what it has achieved. I have learned a lot, and that has always been the point...

That's the beauty of this hobby, it indulges so many different needs. Some guys just want to race, and for them it's impossible to understand how I haven't quit and taken up knitting when they hear how long it's been since I've driven my car in anger, or that my engine builder took over 2 years to finish my engine. Most things I've done on my car, I've never done before or at that level. I don't know how to do it and I don't know if I can get it done. So every challenge overcome is a victory on its own, even though to the outsider, the car appears to be not much closer to being finished than before. It's like a world war, I may be a long ways off winning the whole thing yet but having my first turbocharged engine setup I designed, built (minus the shortblock), plumbed and wired make almost 800whp is like taking Stalingrad, my diff project was like taking Normandy, the fender flares were my Kursk - I feel pretty fucking happy with myself!

Yet to the guy who just wants to drive, having heard me talk about another major thing I just tackled, the next question is, so you're all done, coming to the track next week? Not even close. If and when that happens (well it sort of has but it was just cruising laps), it will be glorious. But it's not the end game, not the goal. It's not irrelevant but it's just another waypoint. As long as I'm physically capable and I don't run out of imagination, this car will never be finished.

[djborya]

That's the beauty of this hobby, it indulges so many different needs. Some guys just want to race, and for them it's impossible to understand how I haven't quit and taken up knitting when they hear how long it's been since I've driven my car in anger, or that my engine builder took over 2 years to finish my engine. Most things I've done on my car, I've never done before or at that level. I don't know how to do it and I don't know if I can get it done. So every challenge overcome is a victory on its own, even though to the outsider, the car appears to be not much closer to being finished than before. It's like a world war, I may be a long ways off winning the whole thing yet but having my first turbocharged engine setup I designed, built (minus the shortblock), plumbed and wired make almost 800whp is like taking Stalingrad, my diff project was like taking Normandy, the fender flares were my Kursk - I feel pretty fucking happy with myself!

Yet to the guy who just wants to drive, having heard me talk about another major thing I just tackled, the next question is, so you're all done, coming to the track next week? Not even close. If and when that happens (well it sort of has but it was just cruising laps), it will be glorious. But it's not the end game, not the goal. It's not irrelevant but it's just another waypoint. As long as I'm physically capable and I don't run out of imagination, this car will never be finished.

Its finished when you run it to the wall and flip it half dozen times. Or it burns down to the ground like OP's old car. That's why the is a lot of people have the never ending builds. They fear the loss of the project. I like to build them and race them and know and accept the risk that's why I don't think twice when it's time to go fast, and don't get all bent out of shape when I tear shit up , it's the name of the game. If you don't want to get burned don't pay with fire.

[TheJuggernaut]

Its finished when you run it to the wall and flip it half dozen times. Or it burns down to the ground like OP's old car. That's why the is a lot of people have the never ending builds. They fear the loss of the project. I like to build them and race them and know and accept the risk that's why I don't think twice when it's time to go fast, and don't get all bent out of shape when I tear shit up , it's the name of the game. If you don't want to get burned don't pay with fire.

I think you're projecting your feelings too much. Both my car and the OPs other car have been on track, mine in every phase of its life. There's a difference between fear and avoiding excessive risk. Not being afraid of crashing or burning is stupid. But what you do about it is another question. Never going on track is just irrationally giving in to fear. Another way is you build a cage, fire system, wear full safety gear and inspect the car to make sure that you took every reasonable precaution. It can still go wrong but at that point it's a reasonable risk to accept. The point I was making is that to me and the OP, the build is the majority of the satisfaction, so logically, if it never completes it is not a big deal, nor should it ever really complete (which does NOT mean it never goes on track, simply that there is always more to do). Your builds are a means to an end, because the racing is what you're after. But to insinuate that neither I nor the OP are anxious to see what our efforts can do on track is silly. All we are, or at least I am saying is that if for some reason it never happens like tomorrow I become paralyzed, then the project is not a failure.

[Binjammin]

I admittedly have a focus and commitment that is unusual amongst most car guys.

Guys that do it right are the inspiration for the rest. Glad you didn't die and keep up the good work.

[djborya]

I think you're projecting your feelings too much. Both my car and the OPs other car have been on track, mine in every phase of its life. There's a difference between fear and avoiding excessive risk. Not being afraid of crashing or burning is stupid. But what you do about it is another question. Never going on track is just irrationally giving in to fear. Another way is you build a cage, fire system, wear full safety gear and inspect the car to make sure that you took every reasonable precaution. It can still go wrong but at that point it's a reasonable risk to accept. The point I was making is that to me and the OP, the build is the majority of the satisfaction, so logically, if it never completes it is not a big deal, nor should it ever really complete (which does NOT mean it never goes on track, simply that there is always more to do). Your builds are a means to an end, because the racing is what you're after. But to insinuate that neither I nor the OP are anxious to see what our efforts can do on track is silly. All we are, or at least I am saying is that if for some reason it never happens like tomorrow I become paralyzed, then the project is not a failure.

I am not saying I go racing with my car without required safety equipment ( my car has all of it and more , fyi), nor is your car ever "done" as well when you do any kind of competitive racing, unless you total loss it due to some kind of racing mishap. when you race every chance you get, because the competition is what forces you to advance with your car. What I was saying is that I know many people like you guys who spend 10 years building on the car and take it out to the track only a few times a season if that. I don't blame them, it's cheaper, gives you more time to modify the car and there is much smaller chance of getting it torn up then if you would be racing every weekend. Me, I like to go fast, win races and build them as well, I just wish I had unlimited funds and time like some of my competition, makes me wonder how fast I would be able to go if I had that ability.

[TheJuggernaut]

I am not saying I go racing with my car without required safety equipment ( my car has all of it and more , fyi), nor is your car ever "done" as well when you do any kind of competitive racing, unless you total loss it due to some kind of racing mishap. when you race every chance you get, because the competition is what forces you to advance with your car. What I was saying is that I know many people like you guys who spend 10 years building on the car and take it out to the track only a few times a season if that. I don't blame them, it's cheaper, gives you more time to modify the car and there is much smaller chance of getting it torn up then if you would be racing every weekend. Me, I like to go fast, win races and build them as well, I just wish I had unlimited funds and time like some of my competition, makes me wonder how fast I would be able to go if I had that ability.

Sorry dude, you're still missing what I'm saying and you're off base. And cheaper??? HAH. If all I wanted was to get the car on track it would have cost me 50x less.