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Thread: H&R Race with Konis FULL STIFF... How bad can it be?

  1. #1
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    Arrow H&R Race with Konis FULL STIFF... How bad can it be?

    I'm really interested in the response of those out there that have this setup. I just recieved my Konis and Race springs in the mail yesterday. I'll be installing them at the end of the week when I have time.
    I'm hoping those guys out there like Bimmerdawg can chime in here and tell me what you think. I am a pretty aggresive driver and I wonder how this setup dialed up full stiff would feel like on the street? I have gone almost 20K miles with a completely dead suspension thats been pretty harsh on my ass...and also on other components in the suspension but those are all being replaced as well this weekend. Anyhow, the point is that I think I can deal with it but my question is "Is it really, REALLY bad?"

    Thanks in advance.
    Drive it like you stole it!

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  2. #2
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    I have that setup and I think that they are very complient, not really that harsh as every makes them out to be, also not as low as I tought. Over all I really liked this setup, very good in the corners and under hard braking. Of course you do have to be more careful how you drive because the car is lower and the suspension does not absorb big impacts instead the whole car goes up and over the bump. Just make sure your not riding the bumpstops and torque everything to spec. even though I could never figure out how to torque the top nut on the strut to spec. Hope you like this setup and good luck with the install.

  3. #3
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    I have OE sports, but the rates are the same and I run my Konis at full stiff. I don't think it is tooo harsh at all. In fact, I think that I am going to switch setups to get something stiffer.

  4. #4
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    Dont be too impressed by the word "Race" in the springs name. Correct me if I am wrong, but their spring rates are 345 front and 515 rear, although the rear spring isnt linear. Those springs are quite low, but they arent as stiff as a lot of the other springs out there. I could live with stiffer springs than the ones I have right now no problem, but Im sure others couldnt. Even if you did think the suspension is too stiff, you have Koni SA's, it takes 2 seconds to adjust them.
    -Peter

    Current toy: none
    Past cars: 88 M3, 99 M3 x2, 04 M3, 91 NSX, 06 S2000, 01 911TT, 06 Exige, 00 NSX, 04 GT3

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by GotBHP?
    Dont be too impressed by the word "Race" in the springs name. Correct me if I am wrong, but their spring rates are 345 front and 515 rear, although the rear spring isnt linear. Those springs are quite low, but they arent as stiff as a lot of the other springs out there. I could live with stiffer springs than the ones I have right now no problem, but Im sure others couldnt. Even if you did think the suspension is too stiff, you have Koni SA's, it takes 2 seconds to adjust them.
    Since they are linear springs (i believe both front and rear are), you can't really put a single spring rate on them. You can measure different rates at different points of spring compression.

    The H&R "race" springs are WAY too low for the spring rates they use. In general, you'll be riding the bumpstops alot if you drive the car hard (as noted by a buddy of mine who had them for a week, then tossed them).

    I'm pretty sure they are the same rates as the Sport springs, but an inch lower.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spencer
    Since they are linear springs (i believe both front and rear are), you can't really put a single spring rate on them. You can measure different rates at different points of spring compression.

    The H&R "race" springs are WAY too low for the spring rates they use. In general, you'll be riding the bumpstops alot if you drive the car hard (as noted by a buddy of mine who had them for a week, then tossed them).

    I'm pretty sure they are the same rates as the Sport springs, but an inch lower.
    I think you meant that they are *not* linear, but you are right.

    Linear springs are a straight cylindrical shape, and require a fixed amount of force to compress them a certain distance. Non-linear springs are sometimes shaped like the H&R rear's, sort of like a beehive thingie. They have softer initial rates and stiffen up progressivly. I agree that they are not nearly as stiff as they should be for using a ride height that low.

    If I recall correctly, the fronts are linear, and the rears are progressive. Well thats the case if they are designed anything like my old H&R sport's. Not sure if I remember, but the rates of the Sports were 200f, 380r.
    -Peter

    Current toy: none
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  7. #7
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    :

    Yep, I meant they are both progressive rate springs.....

    The front could be linear, but I can't remember at this point.

  8. #8
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    i have H&r sports and ive been thinking about swaping them for race springs for the stiffness and more drop and Bilstien shox, is this good? or should i think of some stiffer springs with the same drop? :

    clik sig 4 17" tires

  9. #9
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    Here is a thread to my settings and some more H&R info.. I have the front Koni's set to 1.5 from soft, backs are 1.25 from soft. These are with H&R Sports.

    My settings

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  10. #10
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    Unhappy I like what I hear...

    From the looks of it, what you guys are saying.... I think I'm going to have no problem at all with this setup. The only thing that has me a little scared is Spencer's comment on how you can ride the bumpstops a lot if you drive hard. I think that I drive pretty hard (safe, but hard) when I want to and it gives me the chills to think I'm going to be riding my bumpstops all the time. One thing I want to ask, Did your friend cut the bumpstops down to spec according to H&R's recommendation that come with the springs? I see on this sheet I recieved with the springs from H&R that I should be trimming the front bumpstops .75". No trimming required for rear. Could this be a cause for your friends problem? Or maybe he just drives his whip like a maniac!! (No offense intended; I drive like a maniac too. ) Was he running the Konis full stiff?
    Drive it like you stole it!

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  11. #11
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    I dont forsee a problem with bottoming out and bump-stops in the rear, however in the front the race springs lower the car a good 2 inches lower than the sports. With only a 345 lb. front spring, you will be riding those bumps stops all the time, regardless how stiff you set the Koni's (you only have rebound adjustment, no adjustment on compression wich could possibly save you from bottoming the shock out).
    -Peter

    Current toy: none
    Past cars: 88 M3, 99 M3 x2, 04 M3, 91 NSX, 06 S2000, 01 911TT, 06 Exige, 00 NSX, 04 GT3

  12. #12
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    Why are you running the shocks full stiff? There is absolutely no reason to do this on the street. That's the whole point of adjustable shocks...

    BTW - having driven Bimmerdawg's car, I'd say his Race + Koni's at FULL SOFT are just slightly stiffer on harsh bumps than my stock springs + Koni's at ~1/2 turn from full soft. I'm not sure if the car stays off the bumpstops when you're driving it hard, as it is pretty low. I know I contact the bumpstops with stock springs and street tires on the track in a few certain corner types.

  13. #13
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    Well, I leave mine on full soft driving around town and have yet to hit the bumpstops. I have the externally-adjustable rears and have set them on full stiff for the mountains and can say that it's really not that bad. I've driven Aaron's (Ron17) car when he had Bilstein Sport and H&R's, and it was softer than his when mine was on full stiff.

    Trust me, you'll absolutley love the adjustability factor of the Konis and I honestly can't think of another shock/spring setup (Co's not included) that looks as good and performs as well as what you're about to put on.

    Feel free to ask me any more questions...I'd love to help you out!
    Geordie Johnston - E36 Collector.


  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BimmerDawg
    Well, I leave mine on full soft driving around town and have yet to hit the bumpstops. I have the externally-adjustable rears and have set them on full stiff for the mountains and can say that it's really not that bad. I've driven Aaron's (Ron17) car when he had Bilstein Sport and H&R's, and it was softer than his when mine was on full stiff.

    Trust me, you'll absolutley love the adjustability factor of the Konis and I honestly can't think of another shock/spring setup (Co's not included) that looks as good and performs as well as what you're about to put on.

    Feel free to ask me any more questions...I'd love to help you out!
    Thank you Geordie. Thats very kind of you. At this point I am so anxious to get the suspension on because like I said before, I've been riding around on stock suspension, DEAD, for at least 15-20K miles. It looks like I'll be putting in new strut mounts and bearings as well seeing that they are most likely toast by now. I hope to put some GC RSMs in as well although I've been eyeing those TC Kline Monoball mounts. What do you guys think of those things? Any first hand experience with the Monoball mounts in here? Also at this point I would like to add that my car WILL be seeing track time and autocrossing in the very near future. Hopefully taking these things into consideration some of you can offer some good insight on that.
    In the distant future I would like to add some anti-roll bars but for now the shocks and springs should suffice, with the addition of some good solid mounts. I would like to mention that I have driven in an E36 M3 with Active Autowerke's Solid RTAB (car was also riding on Bilstein Sports with stock springs) and I was quite impressed with the rigidity of the rear and how SOLID it felt and on the street I would definately be willing to withstand the ride with the metal bushings. Maybe this will give you an idea for my taste. I don't really care what the girl thinks......usually she likes "whatever I like" anyways.
    Thanks again guys! Thanks Geordie, I'll probably take you up on the offer of help pretty soon.

    --Frank in Miami
    Drive it like you stole it!

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