Anyone buy the vanos kit from i6motorworks?

[dotcoms]

I'm looking to get a kit to do the project. I just wanted to know if anyone has bought from these guys, if so, any problems?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-DUAL-VAN...-/121144809321

[Poolman]

Besian Systems only,,Rajie came up with this a few years ago. My car was one of the first to have this product when it came out...you can go cheap,,on you can go with proven reliability...

[cal45fan]

I actually bought from him simply because he is local to me and I needed the parts ASAP to help a friend out on his 99 528i.

I like the fact that his kit is COMPLETE. The only thing missing was the valve cover gasket.

The seals look to be the updated material because I compared it to the one Biesan sells.

I will vouch for this seller.

[RuskiE39]

Didn't know it was necessary to actually replace the gasket on the vanos unit itself.

Like mentioned, looks like only sealant and VCG are missing.

[cal45fan]

I replaced that metal gasket anyway.

[absentmathis]

I'd really be curious to drive one of these cars that needs vanos seals. I've now replaced them on two high mileage cars just to see how it would help and it's made no noticeable difference. Cars run strong before and after, no material change in power or mileage.

I'm not saying that some people don't need them. I guess more wondering what causes them to go "bad" because they were fine on two high milers I've had. I ordered from Besian both times but only because they were the only vendor I knew of. They were fine.

[BimmerBreaker]

I'm not saying that some people don't need them.

Okay, then I'll say it. Some people don't need them.

VANOS seals should be replaced when they go bad (just search VANOS failure + your car model on the forums or youtube), they are not neccessarily "consumbables" that need to be replaced every xx,xxx miles... depending on the driver/owner they can fail for various reasons but they can last a long time in a well taken care of engine.

[philly98540]

I'm looking to get a kit to do the project. I just wanted to know if anyone has bought from these guys, if so, any problems?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-DUAL-VAN...-/121144809321

Is this seller using the Beisan vanos seals and putting together a kit? I am curious since I thought Raj contracted out to get these seals made special as the sizes and materials needed were not commercially available. I was remotely involved when this kit was being developed. I had a few e-mails with Raj as seal material was being discussed. We were working on the traction strut bushing DIY when the Vanos kit was being developed. He had a good contact with a seals engineer and Viton was picked vs the stock material. I thought he needing to get them custom made, but I was not sure where it ended up. Too long ago to remember...

[tmvE39E53Z32TT]

....
VANOS seals should be replaced when they go bad (just search VANOS failure + your car model on the forums or youtube), they are not neccessarily "consumbables" that need to be replaced every xx,xxx miles... depending on the driver/owner they can fail for various reasons but they can last a long time in a well taken care of engine.

If you follow the research that Rajie at Beisan system did, you'll see that BMW use the wrong material for the seals. And they acknowledge that too, but they won't fix it since it's not a safety concern. That material degrade gradually. It's good for about 30k miles then it starts degrading. When I replaced them in my old I6 bimmers, one of the seal on each side feels like a plastic ring, not rubber. Imagine how effective that would be for sealing.
I do agree with what you said, ONLY if you already replace the seals with better/correct material.

[dotcoms]

Besian Systems only,,Rajie came up with this a few years ago. My car was one of the first to have this product when it came out...you can go cheap,,on you can go with proven reliability...

I'd order from them, but they need to update their site. Didn't even find all the pieces needed on there. I was after the full(est) kit with a great price.

- - - Updated - - -

I actually bought from him simply because he is local to me and I needed the parts ASAP to help a friend out on his 99 528i.

I like the fact that his kit is COMPLETE. The only thing missing was the valve cover gasket.

The seals look to be the updated material because I compared it to the one Biesan sells.

I will vouch for this seller.

Thanks for that

- - - Updated - - -

Is this seller using the Beisan vanos seals and putting together a kit? I am curious since I thought Raj contracted out to get these seals made special as the sizes and materials needed were not commercially available. I was remotely involved when this kit was being developed. I had a few e-mails with Raj as seal material was being discussed. We were working on the traction strut bushing DIY when the Vanos kit was being developed. He had a good contact with a seals engineer and Viton was picked vs the stock material. I thought he needing to get them custom made, but I was not sure where it ended up. Too long ago to remember...

I don't know where they're getting their pieces... but I made sure in the description that they were made with the viton as the Beisan pieces are. So... it appears that I'd be getting same material just more pieces as a kit for less. ??

- - - Updated - - -

I'd really be curious to drive one of these cars that needs vanos seals. I've now replaced them on two high mileage cars just to see how it would help and it's made no noticeable difference. Cars run strong before and after, no material change in power or mileage.

I'm not saying that some people don't need them. I guess more wondering what causes them to go "bad" because they were fine on two high milers I've had. I ordered from Besian both times but only because they were the only vendor I knew of. They were fine.

I'm basing my decision to do the vanos on info provided by Beisan.

The symptoms defined, I seem to match most of them. And the fact that BMW used the Buna which is stated as needing replacement withing 20k miles. So... seems to me like a good investment either way. Better performance, and importantly for me.. increased mpg... as my car seems to be doing pretty bad right now.

[Poolman]

I'm on my second engine in my 2003 touring. The first engine,,when ever it dropped below 35 degrees and the engine was started cold in the AM,,I couldn't walk away from it and let it warm up,,this was after the first 15k miles were on the car. I had to stay sitting there with my foot on the gas until the engine warmed enough for me to leave it be. This lasted until the new rings came out. By that time there were 100k miles on the car,,changed the seals and it was like a new engine--could start it in 0 degree weather and walk away with no problems about it dieing..loved what the seals did for the running of the car. That engine died at around 260k miles--burnt a valve in #5 cylinder,,instead of making the fix--purchased an engine with 50k miles and installed it along with the tranny--this engine hasn't hiccuped once whenb starting in cold weather and pulls great--don't know what to think about it ,,really--starting to think that the previous owner had the seals installed--or that the PO may have had new vanos installed from BMW--I have new seals to do the work,,but won't until it proven that the engine needs them..I have about 10k miles since the install and will wait it out to see the outcome.

[RuskiE39]

It's pretty subjective... in all honesty, my car drove perfectly and felt perfectly performance wise before the vanos rebuild, the rebuilding of it offered piece of mind and worked out some kinks.

[dangdude]

I replaced my z3m roadster (s52 single vanos) with the besian kit (including bearing), and then my e46 zhp (m54 dual vanos) with the i6motorworks "stage 1" (seal rings) and "stage 3b" (vanos shell and roller bearings, bolts, and sealing plugs). Once you have access to the vanos pistons, it's obvious whether you need to replace the seals or not because you can see how loose they are; unfortunately, by the time you've got access to the pistons you might as well replace the seals. It's not that hard of a job--the only "hard" part is sanding down the bearing parts little by little to get a snug fit with no axial play.

My z3m (150k) was fine and didn't need seals. My zhp (130k) definitely needed seals, both by driving symptoms and by inspecting the vanos pistons. The z3m had little to no change in driveability but the zhp had symptoms and now drives great again. Back to the original question--the i6motorworks kit was nice and fit well. It came with extra parts that were arguably not needed but I replaced them anyway.

[djb2]

I've used several different seals over the years. The i6motorworks kit appeared to be comparable quality to the Besian seals. I had one of those VANOS units apart recently and it still had good sealing pressure and no obvious wear after three years.

The extra parts in the kits look good, but I don't think they add value. I always decide that the original bolts and gaskets are a better choice than the ones in the kit. BMW is careful about selecting fastener plating for metal compatibility, and the replacements have a generic bright zinc plating. It's unlikely to be a problem, but the original bolts are always in perfect condition. Even if the original gaskets leak (they won't unless you damage them), they'll simply drip into the oil-covered timing chain cover.

A few weeks ago I bought a lower cost seal set that has white seals. Presumably these are unfilled PTFE, which might have more of a wear issue than graphite or moly filled seals. The wear on the original seals is negligible, so I expect they will be fine.

It takes a really, really long time to sand the original hardened bearing spacers down to get rid of bearing play. I've wasted hours trying different approaches. 400 grit was useless, and 120 grit was slow. The best was 80 grit emery cloth strips, and I'm tempted to try 60 grit or a diamond hone. I can see why people buy replacement spacers, even when those need to be worked on. I borrowed a mini-lathe and it made the job much, much faster. Typically the spacers start out at 7.45-7.48mm, and they need to reduced to 7.25-7.30mm, generally to 7.28mm. I'll do a cut to 7.32 and verify that there is still barely perceptible play, then shave a bit more off.

[JaxPlanet]

I'm looking to get a kit to do the project. I just wanted to know if anyone has bought from these guys, if so, any problems?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-DUAL-VAN...-/121144809321

That's what I used for my last VANOS job. 2-years and no problems.

I will add that I used Beisan's kit on my prior e39. However, as much as I appreciate their well-documented procedure, $60 for a few o-rings is ridiculous.

[me77]

Put the i6motorworks kit in a M52TUB25 around 1000 miles ago, no issues. Original seals were rock-hard, just like everyone else's. The seals took around 300 miles to break in fully since I had some occasional "hickups" after seal replacement that disappeared completely. Gained a bit of low-end torque and fuel economy is right at the BMW figures now (24-25 mpg vs 21-23 mpg before).

[me77]

A couple hundred miles after I put the new rings in, a ISTA VANOS test showed like-new values on both intake and exhaust side. Now a couple thousand miles later, the VANOS test shows terribles values on both sides, like it did before I replaced the rings. MPG is unchanged but the car lost the low-end grunt it had right after the replacement.

It seems to be true that the only VANOS rings worth installing are the Beisan ones. Lesson learned I guess.

[djb2]

A couple hundred miles after I put the new rings in, a ISTA VANOS test showed like-new values on both intake and exhaust side. Now a couple thousand miles later, the VANOS test shows terribles values on both sides, like it did before I replaced the rings. MPG is unchanged but the car lost the low-end grunt it had right after the replacement.

It seems to be true that the only VANOS rings worth installing are the Beisan ones. Lesson learned I guess.

It's surprising that they would fail quickly. Do as much of an evaluation as you can when you take them off.

If the o-rings aren't fully hardened you can often remove the sliding seals by pushing the slack to one side and lifting them out with the tip of a hobby. Once you can get something underneath (a plastic "razor blade" works well), slowly stretch the seal until it's large enough to remove. I can almost always remove the seals with negligible damage. Original o-rings generally need to be cut out. Some are still flexible enough to remove with only that one cut, but often are permanently in a square cross-section. Some are so bad that they break into pieces when pulling them out and show no hint of once being an elastomere.

In this case you should expect that the energizing o-ring still has enough pressure to immediately expand the seal beyond the piston diameter, and is flexible enough to allow removal of the sliding seal with just fingernails to lift it. The sliding seal should have the dimensions of new, and the Viton o-ring should have a round cross-section.