Custom output shafts

[buildit]

Hi everyone

Im having difficulty sourcing 33 mm output shafts.
https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...23#33211226933

Has anyone had any success with aftermarket shafts or having custom output shafts made?

[m6bigdog]

I have been looking for a while and I have yet to find a complete aftermarket output shaft.
I anticipate this is going to be another expensive NLA part.
Fortunately, I have one for my spare parts, I should have purchased two!!

CV Joint Boots are available.
I anticipate the diff CV Joints could be replaced with an on the shelf parts.
Unsure of the configuration of the hub CV Joint.

[rogbmw]

Will this work? https://www.ebay.com/itm/153796293721

[rjjablo]

I just regreased mine and put new boots on

The bearing in their are likely a standard size but if they are worn so is the race

I have heard of some people swapping them from side to side to take care of problems (Do more research on this)

Drag your car to one of those shops in Poland and see if they will make you a pair.

[m6bigdog]

I found some at:
https://www.bmaparts.com/
$85 each
Must not be a German part!!

Edit:
These are definitely not the larger output shaft LK-102mm
Keep looking...

[buildit]

Will this work? https://www.ebay.com/itm/153796293721

I have come across replacement inner cv joints.
The problem comes if the outer cv joint is bad. Mine is ruined.

The diff drive flange was used in E38 and E39 M5 https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/par...&q=33131214068
and the drive flange hub was used in plenty of models https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/par...&q=33411095774.
So, in theory, cv joints with similar dimensions should be available.

I'll have to investigate this further. Ideally both inner and outer cv joints should be replaceable.

[m6bigdog]

Another aftermarket:
https://bimmers.com/product/surtrack/BM8015

The E31, E36 & E46 M3 all have the ABS ring on the external CV Joint w/Stub Axle.
Of course the question is what is the output axle shaft spline dimensions.
The E38 & E39 and later model cars don't have the ABS ring.

I have yet to find the internal or external CV Joints separately.

Caution about Output Shafts specification and I don't think the aftermarket has figured this out
There are 2 used on the 850
output shaft LK=122MM/D=33MM - P/N: 33211226933: used with 850 only - Euro M70 (2.93:1 diff), S70 & M73: 102mm Diff Flange Bolt = 12mm
output shaft LK=94MM/D=27MM - P/N: 33211227018: with 850/840 - Euro & US M70 (3:15 & 3.64:1 diff), M60 & M62: 94mm Diff Flange Bolt = 10mm

The search continues...

[m6bigdog]

Best output axle BMW OE parts reference I've seen so far:
https://www.getbmwparts.com/v-1994-b...d-differential

I never thought to look in my old microfiche library

[dragon850]

Another aftermarket:
https://bimmers.com/product/surtrack/BM8015

The M3 E36 & E46 have the ABS ring on the external CV Joint w/Stub Axle.
Of course the question is what is the output axle shaft spline dimensions.
The E38 & E39 and later model cars don't have the ABS ring.

I have yet to find the internal or external CV Joints separately.

Caution about Output Shafts specification and I don't think the aftermarket has figured this out
There are 2 used on the 850
output shaft LK=122MM/D=33MM - P/N: 33211226933: used with 850 only - Euro M70 (2.93:1 diff), S70 & M73: 102mm Diff Flange Bolt = 12mm
output shaft LK=94MM/D=27MM - P/N: 33211227018: with 850/840 - Euro & US M70 (3:15 & 3.64:1 diff), M60 & M62: 94mm Diff Flange Bolt = 10mm

The search continues...

This aftermarket one is complete throw away, it is too short... tried it myself.

[buildit]

I spoke to a specialist shop yesterday.

The inner cv joint was apparently somewhat standard.
An initial quote of around 900 Euro for 2x inner and 2x outer cv joints.

Looking into other leads...

[m6bigdog]

I spoke to a specialist shop yesterday.

The inner cv joint was apparently somewhat standard.
An initial quote of around 900 Euro for 2x inner and 2x outer cv joints.

Looking into other leads...

Patiently waiting for you to report back.

[m6bigdog]

FWIW:
There are 3 different Output Shafts used on the E31:
Correction for the E31 Output Shaft part numbers and specifications:
33-21-1-226-933 LK=122MM/D=33MM Euro Manual M70-2.93:1 final drive/S70/M73-Auto
33-21-1-227-148 LK=94MM/D=32MM Euro-US Manual M60/M62/M70-2.65:1 final drive
33-21-1-227-018 LK=94MM/D=27MM Euro-US Auto M60/M62/M70

FYI, correction for BMW Catalog: 33-21-1-226-933 has a LK=102mm, bolt circle diameter with M12 bolts. O.D.=122mm of the CV Joint

[m6bigdog]

I have contacted GKN/LOBRO Germany to see what they can come up with for Inner & Outer CV Joints.
I will report back if and when that have info for us.

[Albert850i]

33-21-1-226-933 has a 102mm bolt circle with M12 bolts. 122mm = O.D. of the CV Joint

LK means Loch Kreis in German = (bolt) hole circle diameter.

[buildit]

Thank you everyone for your input.

I am talking to several shops in Poland and will report back.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

[m6bigdog]

LK means Loch Kreis in German = (bolt) hole circle diameter.

Thanks for the translation:
I was attempting to correct the BMW Catalog descriptions without mistating:
Unfortunately the LK-122mm dimension in the BMW Catalog is in error.

Incorrect dimension: LK=122mm (33-21-1-226-933 LK=122MM/D=33MM Euro Manual M70-2.93:1 final drive/S70/M73-Auto)
Actual Hole Circle Diameter: LK=102mm/D=33mm, CV Joint Outside Diameter, O.D.=122mm

When you are attempting to source an aftermarket CV Joint it is imperative we have the correct CV Joint, Hole Circle Diameter, LK=102mm dimension.

[BMSman]

if you haven't already, try looking here...

https://web.tecalliance.net/gkn/qa/p...ups:236;page:0

[m6bigdog]

if you haven't already, try looking here...

https://web.tecalliance.net/gkn/qa/p...ups:236;page:0

Thanks for the reference, BUT,,
Yep, I tried GKN/LOBRO a while ago,
They don't list any output shafts or CV Joints for the E31 - search "Passenger Car" any model 840, 850, CSi nothing!!!
And the worst part ... 850Ci-M73 - Even the listed Bellows specification is incorrect for the 1-226-933 output shaft.

https://web.tecalliance.net/gkn/qa/p...ypeNumber:3816

[m6bigdog]

FWIW:
I received a somewhat disappointing email reply from BMW Group Classic:
"Thank you for your request and the detailed description.
Yes, the topic doesn't seem unfamiliar, but I don't know how I can help you from here.
But as I saw at first glance, there are still occasional waves on the free market (for example at www.extra-classics.de)...."

Extra-Classics.de - seems to be a source for many reproduction/NLA parts for the E31 and other early model chassis.

While the larger CSi/M73 output shaft LK=102mm/D=33mm was not offered the LK=94mm/D=27mm version is in the parts catalog.
https://www.extra-classics.de/Antrie...K-94mm/EC53120
Description:
Product information "Drive shaft 8 series BMW E31 33211227018 850i 850ci 840i 33211227148 bolt circle LK 94mm"
Drive shaft for the rear axle, suitable for the 8 series BMW E31 850i, 850ci, 840i and 840ci.
Replacement for the no longer available drive shaft (drive shaft) with a 94mm bolt circle, part no. 33211227018 and 33211227148 on the rear axle differential.
Comparison number(s):
BMW 33211227018 (LK 94mm)
BMW 33211227148 (LK 94mm)

[m6bigdog]

Just received an email from "extra-classics.de/"
The bottom line is, they are not interested in sourcing a reproduction LK=102mm/D=33mm output shaft for the E31-850CSi/850-M73 and differ to BMW as the only viable production vender.
They also recommend replacing the LK-102mm final drive output flanges with the LK-94mm output flanges and using the smaller LK-94mm/27mm output shafts as a replacement.
FWIW:
BMW E31 engineering used the larger output shaft for a reason (reliability manage engine torque?) and using a smaller output shafts could cause untested (reliability/unsafe) output shaft failures.

Email:
"Thank you for your message and the details of the research you have done.
Regarding this drive shaft, we have already registered it, it has the remanufacturing ticket no. 71. We also have a physical sample part of it.
Unfortunately, it is not worthwhile to remanufacture this component due to the extremely low number of pieces required.
Only BMW can do this, because they still have the tools for it and also all the production drawings and suppliers for the various processes.
However, should the opportunity arise at a later date, we will think of you....
Perhaps you could try taking 2 normal flanges from the 850i or 750i and fitting them into your differential. Then the smaller drive shaft should also fit. We have not tested this, you would have to try it yourself.
Thank you again and I wish you a good time.
Kind regards
Johannes
https://www.extra-classics.de/
----------------------------------------
JZ Car-Solutions
Hasenweg 1
74354 Besigheim
Germany
USt-ID-Nr.: DE279731434"

[dragon850]

Just received an email from "extra-classics.de/"
The bottom line is, they are not interested in sourcing a reproduction LK=102mm/D=33mm output shaft for the E31-850CSi/850-M73 and differ to BMW as the only viable production vender.
They also recommend replacing the LK-102mm final drive output flanges with the LK-94mm output flanges and using the smaller LK-94mm/27mm output shafts as a replacement.
FWIW:
BMW E31 engineering used the larger output shaft for a reason (reliability manage engine torque?) and using a smaller output shafts could cause untested (reliability/unsafe) output shaft failures.

Email:
"Thank you for your message and the details of the research you have done.
Regarding this drive shaft, we have already registered it, it has the remanufacturing ticket no. 71. We also have a physical sample part of it.
Unfortunately, it is not worthwhile to remanufacture this component due to the extremely low number of pieces required.
Only BMW can do this, because they still have the tools for it and also all the production drawings and suppliers for the various processes.
However, should the opportunity arise at a later date, we will think of you....
Perhaps you could try taking 2 normal flanges from the 850i or 750i and fitting them into your differential. Then the smaller drive shaft should also fit. We have not tested this, you would have to try it yourself.
Thank you again and I wish you a good time.
Kind regards
Johannes
https://www.extra-classics.de/
----------------------------------------
JZ Car-Solutions
Hasenweg 1
74354 Besigheim
Germany
USt-ID-Nr.: DE279731434"

I Would not touch that company with a 10 foot pole and not very surprised that's the response you got.
I didn't want to say anything but since you brought up your interaction with them....
They list products on their site that they do not have in stock or any intention to reproduce. (Why? I have no clue)
For example, they purchased a few of my fuel pumps for resale but since I have entered into an exclusivity agreement with https://www.pusches.de/ to distribute my pumps in Germany and I could not supply them with more units.
The owner of extraclassics threw a tantrum over this, he basically took my description and pictures (he only recently took down my pics) and posted on his website at much lower price even he has no stock, just to hurt my business.
Make your own conclusions of what kind of business that is...

I will look into making reproduction shafts for M70 and the thicker M73 powered cars.

[buildit]

I will look into making reproduction shafts for M70 and the thicker M73 powered cars.

Perhaps also just replaceable cv joints?

I haven't received any more concrete estimates but working on a few more leads.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A6013 using Tapatalk

[m6bigdog]

This aftermarket one is complete throw away, it is too short... tried it myself.

Ed,
Re: "too short" reply,
The compressed output shaft length spec for the TrakMotive/SurTrack BM8015 is 25-15/32"/647mm
That I can find, the output shaft length spec for the E31 - 33211227018 is 652mm, that is only 5mm/0.19" longer.
I personally measures a 33-21-1-226-933 and I came up with a compressed length of approximately 650mm +/-, as I didn't use the best method for a precision measurement.
Was this your observation?
Hence, the 5mm short makes the BM8015 unusable?

That I am aware the are 3 output Shafts made for the E31 production versions:
33-21-1-226-933 LK=102MM/M12/D=33MM - Euro Manual M70-2.93:1 final drive/S70/M73-Auto
33-21-1-227-018 LK=94MM/M10/D=27MM - Euro-US M60/M62/M70-Auto
33-21-1-227-148 LK=94MM/M10/D=32MM - Euro-US Manual M60/M62/M70-2.65:1

Also, the results of my research indicates JOBRO/GKN does not supply (may never have supplied - BMW OE only) the inner LK-102mm/M12 CV Joints even though it was used in various versions of the E31, E38. E39, E60, E61, E63, E64, & E82 up to 2013.

The outer D=108mm CV-Joint with the stub axle w/48 tooth ABS ring is exclusive to the E31.

With that, the E31 community is left with a single option of using the LK-94mm/M10 inner CV-Joint for all inner CV Joint applications, as at least it is available.
Hence, this would require replacing the LK=102mm final drive output flange with a Lk=94mm output flange.

In discussing the LK=94mm output Flange/CV Joint conversion with Harold, he is not that concerned as the LK=94mm/M10 CV Joints are sufficient and used without catastrophic failures on the Dinan TT 850's.
Not my desired option with lower diff gearing, but when this is the only one you must go with it!!

[dragon850]

Ed,
Re: "too short" reply,
The compressed output shaft length spec for the TrakMotive/SurTrack BM8015 is 25-15/32"/647mm
That I can find, the output shaft length spec for the E31 - 33211227018 is 652mm, that is only 5mm/0.19" longer.
I personally measures a 33-21-1-226-933 and I came up with a compressed length of approximately 650mm +/-, as I didn't use the best method for a precision measurement.
Was this your observation?
Hence, the 5mm short makes the BM8015 unusable?

That I am aware the are 3 output Shafts made for the E31 production versions:
33-21-1-226-933 LK=102MM/M12/D=33MM - Euro Manual M70-2.93:1 final drive/S70/M73-Auto
33-21-1-227-018 LK=94MM/M10/D=27MM - Euro-US M60/M62/M70-Auto
33-21-1-227-148 LK=94MM/M10/D=32MM - Euro-US Manual M60/M62/M70-2.65:1

Also, the results of my research indicates JOBRO/GKN does not supply (may never have supplied - BMW OE only) the inner LK-102mm/M12 CV Joints even though it was used in various versions of the E31, E38. E39, E60, E61, E63, E64, & E82 up to 2013.

The outer D=108mm CV-Joint with the stub axle w/48 tooth ABS ring is exclusive to the E31.

With that, the E31 community is left with a single option of using the LK-94mm/M10 inner CV-Joint for all inner CV Joint applications, as at least it is available.
Hence, this would require replacing the LK=102mm final drive output flange with a Lk=94mm output flange.

In discussing the LK=94mm output Flange/CV Joint conversion with Harold, he is not that concerned as the LK=94mm/M10 CV Joints are sufficient and used without catastrophic failures on the Dinan TT 850's.
Not my desired option with lower diff gearing, but when this is the only one you must go with it!!

From what I remember they were much shorter than the original shaft, basically their whole production line is garbage and unusable.

[m6bigdog]

Bump..
I'm still searching the world over for either a complete output shaft or the CV Joints.
I have gained a lot of information for the LK=102mm CV Joints and the specifications for the output shaft from BMW Group-Classic.
However, no luck finding new or used parts available to purchase.