I've heard some rumors of poor performance, but also glowing reviews from the universal AEM Infinity EMS (NOT the E46 plug and play - that's a special firmware as I understand it).
I have a still uninstalled EMS-4 which I was planning to install sometime in the near future. And while it'll run my engine, it'll be pretty much max'd out from the getgo on general purpose IO. The lower cost Infinity 6/8H setups have much more IO capability, and the possibility of some interesting traction control/flex fuel stuff that I would probably make use of.
So anybody here have any experience with it?
I think Boris is the only one running it, and I know he's had quite a few issues with it to get it working (but it is running now AFAIK).
Why not go with a ProEFI? IMO it's a much better unit.
Infinity is a very powerful platform with endless capabilities. I like it though I have had 2 failures Wich aem tried to blame on the wiring, ( I disagree with their claims because the car was driven in to garage and left there for 2 weeks untouched when I went to start it to pull it out it would not. I had no rpm reference, but was able to communicate with the ecu) Swap with another known good box and it fired right up and been running since.
B.
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Bistein sport susp,turner sway bars,3:25lsd,m52 AEM INFINITY stand alone. MORAN 2500cc injectors E85 ,front mount 33x12x4 intercooler, 5lug conversion M3 front,Mcoupe rear Dss axles/driveshaft ATI Proglide.
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Is this for the S13 (4-cylinder?)?
If so, I'd stick with the EMS-4 at least for a while. It should still have slew-rate traction control, and how many general purpose IOs do you really need? I have a Series 1 unit on the SE-R and it's been there for years and I still haven't even hooked up the boost control solenoid. Maybe I'm slow/lazy?
Flex fuel stuff? You don't think you'll just tune it on one fuel and call it a day?
Having done quite a few stand-alone installs, I've found that it tends to take years to get to the point where you are actually messing with the bells and whistles. Unless tuning cars is your job, or you've already amassed a good collection of tunes for certain engines, you'll probably find yourself messing with tip-in enrichment for months until you get it right. You'll mess with warm-up enrichment for a few seasons at the least. You'll then decide to tune your idle a bit better, which will take months. Then maybe you'll go back to tune tip-in enrichment because originally you thought TPS-based would be good enough but you realize with the turbo that MAP readings don't follow TPS as well as you thought and you'll want to do MAP-based tip-in enrichment or maybe even a hybrid approach. Then you'll remember you never tuned deceleration enrichment, so you'll rough that out in a few weeks. Then you finally get around to tuning the knock frequency curve. You realize it's not hard at all, but you forgot to buy the pre-amped Saturn Ion knock sensor to replace the non-amped Nissan unit and you tell yourself you'll buy and install the correct sensor and tune the curve. Also one of these days you'll get around to tuning the boost control solenoid. You said you would, but wastegate spring pressure really has been plenty. 10 years go by and the car has been running "well enough" after the first couple tuning iterations that you haven't messed with anything in the last 8 years. Your tuning laptop battery doesn't hold a charge anymore, and you're finally thinking about selling the car to someone else who will get more use out of it and you've been eyeing that new project.
Burma-Shave
Last edited by BenFenner; 02-19-2014 at 10:06 AM.
I agreeOriginally Posted by BenFenner
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The infinity is a VERY advanced unit. Much more advanced than even a proefi. I would compare it more to a Motec ECU than proefi
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Not super-deep, but there was an article on MotoIQ recently where they installed Infinity in an E46 M3: http://www.motoiq.com/MagazineArticl...-Play-EMS.aspx
Jeff | '94 BMW Alpina B3 | '06 BMW 325XI Wagon
Define "much more advanced" as I don't agree.
that whole article is funny to read, they're talking about the Infinity ECU like it's an absolute breakthrough, VE tuning, freq. based & windowed knock sensing, etc... all things that have been available on other ECU's for YEARS!
AEM's V1 was horrible, V2 is only slightly better. The EMS-4 is just a skinny V2. The Infinity IMO isn't anything special at all from what I've seen. I have yet to get one in my hands but knowing AEM's past I'm willing to bet I'm not going to be blown away especially with AEM's lackluster support and general lack of knowledge about their own products (yes I'm aware they don't make their own products, but that's not an excuse).
My car is at Technica right now getting ProEFI (w/ flex fuel sensor ) and a GTX upgrade.
What makes ProEFI so exciting? People seem to use it as a benchmark, but nothing about it seems amazing. I have never used one though so maybe Im missing something.
It's based upon a very capable Motorola 555 CPU, it's extremely reliable and durable.
That said, it's closer to a stock ECU then it is a stand alone it's used in Mercruiser Marine, and other various applications and I believe might even have been used in some GM cars.
Full fault guidance for sensors (like OEM ECU), 34 analog inputs, 8 digital inputs, 3 H-bridge outputs, 10 total outputs (8@ 8-10a! 2@ 2a), and it has from my understanding and reading one of the best on-board traction control strategies available.
The AEM is good, but I don't think it's as good as the ProEFI. JMO.
Also I see that AEM got smart and decided to offer the "advanced tuning package" for free "for a limited time" I'm assuming that will turn into "forever" if they want to remain competitive.
Sorry for the delayed response, had to be makin' the car modding money at the day job.
The main reason why AEM - I get wholesale on them. So yea... ProEFI at street price is not even remotely cost effective vs. that since EMS have quite a profit margin.
It is going on my SR. The EMS-4 will do what I want, and I've argued with people that it can do it. But at the same time, the Infinity seems like a pretty big jump in capability. The main reason I'm contemplating "upgrading" is the EMS-4 has been sitting in a box for a couple of years while I've been trying to get my car running while moving and changing jobs etc. The labor to build a harness is worth quite a lot since I'm finding myself having limited amounts of time to work on the car these days. So if I build the harness, I want it to be on something I can use for years and years.
As for tuning experience, I'd consider myself "fairly skilled." I've tuned a couple of dozen cars, and I ran into the limitations of the stock Nissan ECU pretty quickly. My tune was dead reliable, but there were some hard coded simple PID(or maybe just P) controls on the throttle enrichment I could never completely tune out. The best Nissan ECU tuners agreed with me that it was a dirty secret inherent in using injectors 3x+ the size of stock that you'll never get rid of. But anyway, I've got enough experience to tweak around the intermediate stuff and won't be wondering how to tune my throttle enrich/decel enrich settings. No doubt it'll take many hours, but any EMS will to develop a really solid tune.
The reason for the upgrade is I figure it's a roughly $400-500 delta vs. used value of the EMS-4 and going to the Infinity. My labor building the harness is worth more than that, so it's really down to is the Infinity mature? The fact that people have had bad experiences on the hardware side makes me think the "bad stories" might have something to them. Which BTW - those came from people who are very "in the know" on AEM tuning. I just don't know how much it's expectations that the Infinity be just as mature as the old Series 2, or how much is legit.
Thanks for the feedback on the ProEFI unit. If I was looking for something new I would give it a look over.
Figuring that you can go with the latest and greatest for a delta of $500, that's pretty good. And since the Infinity is completely "unlocked" due to their "limited time offer" you'd obviously have much more features to make the investment easier to swallow. That said the EMS-4 isn't a bad little unit for what it is, but as you say you haven't yet built a harness for it either.
Cost being the only deal breaker here, I'd say go for it.
I'm wanting to go with the aem infinity but it will be running an s54 in my e36. It seems like a nice system. If o can find it for a decent price of like the plug and play jumper to help me get a jump on the wiring.
HPF is the best price on them I've seen so far. Any sponsors of the forum sell it?
Last edited by patb1; 02-20-2014 at 08:41 AM.
The best system is just as bad as the worst system if not tuned properly. A perfectly tuned MS2-E will out perform a poorly tuned ProEFI. So, at the end of the day, go with what you like - focus on the software since that's where all of your control is. You can put the fastest CPU you want in it but have to tune from a hyper terminal screen and you'll go nuts. To me, first of course is the general abilities, then immediately the software, then the featureset, then the community/development.
I'm generally happy with AEM's tuning method. Their fuel/spark teeth method is a little goofy and not explained well, but otherwise it is all logical to me.
The VE based tuning should make things a bit quicker as well vs. the bajillion lookup tables and pulsewidth of the Series 1/2.
All this talk about standalone makes me want to play with one.
Maybe someday when I get all my projects finished.
How about a Pro AEM FMU ?
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I've tuned them all, motec, haltech,dfi,accel,seflo,fast,aem,GM factory ecu's, and on and on, they are all calculators, I have a personal prefrence for AEM hardware, I like being able to custom configure the damn box how I want it.
This has been my experience as well. I know the hardware and firmware has to do it's job, and it can be poor, but at the end of the day, to me, the software is what I deal with most and is the face of the system. If I like the tuning software and to a lesser extent the log viewing software, I'm much more apt to like the system as a whole and recommend it. If it does blow up my engine due to a hardware issue, the reality of the situation is that I may never know.
Personally, I absolutely LOVE AEM's tuning software. I have no reason to seriously discount the hardware or firmware, so I highly recommend the system. The jump to Series 2 is nice for USB support and the new software. As for AEM Infinity, I've not deal with it, and I completely understand your concerns, wondering if it may be too early in the teething process to be good... The only thing I can say there is that they had a great product with series 1 (maybe you or others disagree) that only got even better with series 2. I don't see them making a big mistake and fucking it up for series 3, but AEM's made some shit electronics in the past (CDI boxes for one) so obviously nothing is guaranteed.
I've been trying to get my head around MS3 for a future project, but actually the new Infinity 6 and 8h are looking mighty tempting. I came across some info on the Supraforums giving a comparison of the 6/8h vs. the previous Infinity:
Street Pricing:
30-7106 Infinity-6 $1399.95
30-7108 Infinity-8h $1290.50
30-7101 Infinity-8 $2349.95
30-7100 Infinity-10 $2699.95
30-7102 Infinity-12 $3199.95
I don't immediately see a reason you couldn't use the cheaper 8h on our 6-cyl cars with high impedence injectors? But I suppose additional outputs might be nice.
AEM even has a fairly cheap ($77) plug and pin kit to create a harness. Does anyone sell an 88 pin Bosch-type harness for the other end?
Very intriguing stuff...
Jeff | '94 BMW Alpina B3 | '06 BMW 325XI Wagon
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