740i to M7 transformation - S62 swap

[blackknight530i]

Actually, I've got a Dinan Stage 1 tune that might get me a bit closer to the 400hp mark. I'm waiting to put that on until after I get it running though and maybe after I get a feel for it stock first.

[xboss]

It will feel like 450 anyway with that stick shift!

[blackknight530i]

Yeah, no kidding. Now keep in mind, it's going to feel like 800hp compared to my 530iA. I've never really been able to drive a 740i with a working engine at speed. I got to play a little bit with the 97 740il I had for a couple weeks, but it had some tire and suspension needs that I never got to do before I sold it to my co-worker. I was able to ride in it after he fixed those things though. Either way, it's going to feel way more powerful that what I've been used to. I've test driven a couple e39 M5's in the past, but you can't do much on a test drive anyways.

On a side note, I was trying to shift the transmission into reverse while the car was (obviously) off and it's not obvious that I'm getting it into reverse. I understand that I'm supposed to pull it towards me while pushing it forward, but when I pull it back into second, it feels like it slides straight back. Am I doing something wrong, or is it just not obvious that it's in reverse unless it's running and I let the clutch out? I'm just hoping I don't have a problem with my 6-speed not going into reverse. I have heard of people having issues with this, but I'm not sure of the fix.

[007008]

My reverse takes a bit of effort to get it over to the reverse gate. When cold I have to hit it left.

[jicaino]

Subscribed! this looks AMAZING!

[purplecty]

So close!

[geargrinder]

in for the sub. this is a great build. the ultimate sporty shorty.

[xboss]

Black night, isnt there some kind of safety mechanism on the reverse gear? Wondering if you missed something, it seems like it should be able to get into reverse with the engine not running.

[blackknight530i]

What safety mechanism on the reverse gear? Where would it be located? If it's supposed to be attached to the transmission, it should be on there.

- - - Updated - - -

It could be that since the transmission has been sitting for a long time and then even with fresh fluid, hasn't been rolled to get the fluid around the gears. Maybe once I get the engine running and move the gears around, it will be easier. It's got fresh Royal Purple SynchroMAX in it. The forward gears are quite notchy as well, so this could also be related. This is already the second transmission I've bought for this project, I'd hate to have to look for another one. The first one's case was broken during shipping. Yes, I said shipping. The guy shipped it in a box with paper wrapped around it and sent it UPS.

[geargrinder]

Have you seen these threads? You might have issues w/ the arrestors or lockout pin. these are the only things you can fix outside the tranny really, but READ THE SECOND THREAD CAREFULLY especially all the warnings about not taking the procedure lightly. You can 'brick' your tranny if you screw up the procedure.

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum...mission-update

http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39...w-i-fixed.html

[blackknight530i]

The roller piece mentioned in both those threads is brand new in mine due to the fact I needed a different one to allow for the gear detection switch. It could be the issue though as we modified the transmission in order to install the switch since the transmission was out of a 540i and not a M5. Maybe we went too far with it in order to make it sit flush and make a good seal. You don't think you could take a picture of your M3's gear detection switch and see if it is flush with the case, could you? I know that's asking a lot, but it's hard to find pictures of that.

[geargrinder]

Sorry, M3 is semi-mothballed for the winter... But im swinging past my shop tomorrow, if they have an M5 or M3 apart I'll grab pix if theres something...

[blackknight530i]

I actually found the picture I was looking for on a M3 SMG to 6MT conversion thread. It is supposed to sit flush with the case, so I don't think that is my problem. I did read about a detent repair kit that is supposed to be fore hard shifting and some say it helped with the reverse lockout, but it's about $150, so I'd like to first see if I really am not doing it right or if I am in reverse and just don't know it because the car isn't running. I should know this weekend.

[geargrinder]

I did read about a detent repair kit that is supposed to be fore hard shifting and some say it helped with the reverse lockout, but it's about $150

Yeah that's the same thing that's in the threads I linked above. The only things you can do are those ball bearings which get replaced by the later pin-type setup, or, the lockout pins that go in from the side. The M5board thread is the one with the most detailed technical pix and details I could find.

The problem, if you read all the details of that thread - and I suggest you do - is that if you don't follow procedures to the letter, you can put the box into a config where it is "locked into lockout". You need to be sure the box is not in the wrong gear when you do each procedure. If you inadvertantly had it the wrong in gear when you did the sender maybe that locked it out of reverse?

Another PM comin your way...

[BimmerboyJp]

I'm hoping to do the same conversion with my E38. I Believe you mentioned of putting together a guide? is there any video?

[blackknight530i]

No video yet, there will be of first running start and stuff, but not of the work involved. Unless you have a film crew while you work and an editor to go through and cut out a lot of the stuff where nothing is really going on, I don't see this helping much.

As for a guide, I will be taking most of what is put in this thread and taking out the stuff that we didn't end up using and putting in a few more details where required along with a full parts list that I used with separated parts based on what is optional and what you may need depending on what used parts you get. I'll also be including more details on the custom parts required for this and we can also sell the custom parts already made if you want. The main thing that will make the guide worthwhile is the parts list as it has taken the most time to compile. If I'd known all the parts I would need before I began the project, I would have finished this a long time ago. As for when it will be available, it will be after I get the car running and can be sure there isn't anything else required to complete the swap.

BTW, I have family in Thousand Oaks. Nice place. I grew up in the Valley not too far away.

[blackknight530i]

So, I've got some great news! She lives!!! Thanks to Trevor7008 (aka 007008 on bimmerforums), I got a MPPS cable and was able to download the DME software, modify one byte of code for the EWS delete, and it started on the first turn of the key without any leaks. We got her started and bled the power steering system and coolant system. I also figured out that I wasn't pulling hard enough to get the shifter into reverse and now I know there are no problems with that. We also got the holes in the hood filled with bondo and a primer coat put on them.

Now for the bad news. While she runs, she's got misfires in 5 cylinders and a VANOS error:

CD/44 - Misfire, cylinder 1, without cylinder cutout
CE/44 - Misfire, cylinder 2, without cylinder cutout
CF/44 - Misfire, cylinder 3, without cylinder cutout
D0/44 - Misfire, cylinder 4, without cylinder cutout
D5/44 - Misfire, cylinder 6, without cylinder cutout
B8/52 - Function, inlet VANOS, bank 1: control

It could be that it needs a set of spark plugs since the engine has been sitting for about 8 months without being started, but I'm also getting a crank position sensor error code and that could be due to the sensor I used being from the auto transmission. In the morning, I'm going to try swapping to the sensor for my broken manual transmission to see if it helps. I also got a new set of spark plugs that I'm going to try.

I'll have another update and some pictures and maybe video tomorrow. I'm hoping to get it back to my parents house and out of the shop tomorrow. We may even try to take it on a 100 mile shakedown drive before I attempt to bring it back to Charlotte next weekend, which is about 350 miles.

[jicaino]

kudos!

BTW highly interested on the modifying DME's software (and trans software would follow that, right? I want to reprogram the way that my steptronic shifts in the normal program, delete the big brother in the manual mode, basically a dinan reprogramming for the poor man that lives way too far away for considering it a viable option)

[S62fan]

Well that's great news! Did the S62 run ok before the swap?

[blackknight530i]

The S62 was a pull from a wrecked M5 and I bought it from the owner of the car. I have records of when it was installed in his car. From what he told me, it ran ok before he parted it out. He changed the oil with 10w-60 TWS every 5k miles for the full 42k miles on the engine. It seems like it has to be something related to it sitting for so long. Oh, I'm also not getting reverse lights. I checked the switch and it is working as it should, and I noticed that one wire that goes from the DME to the IKE for reverse light was not in the original harness, so I ran one, but I didn't have the right connector for the IKE plug, so I kind of "fit" one that was slightly larger and I'm not sure it is making contact. Should that be the only wiring I need to do? I already have the M5 cluster and it is set to manual.

Jicaino, I'm not sure I'm following what you're asking. I don't have an auto computer anymore and modifying the DME on a M5 (MSS52) is very different than the ME7.2. It sounds like what you're asking for is a modification of the automatic computer.

[geargrinder]

Now for the bad news. While she runs, she's got misfires in 5 cylinders and a VANOS error:

CD/44 - Misfire, cylinder 1, without cylinder cutout

That's awesome - glad you got around the cable limitation! (FWIW I got screwed by 100 things this week, still haven't finished them...)

I don't know too much about S62 but I do have a few friends with 'beasts' and I have helped them with scanning and coding from time to time. every time I scan an S62 it seems it has a few of those misfire codes lurking. now I think my buds mostly have aftermarket tunes on their motors (some Alpha-N...) so I always attrib'd it to aggressive tune settings, but I can't remember scanning an S62 that didn't have those at one time or another, I think it is very very sensitive to misfires.

Did you try clearing codes, shutting down, and restart? Duh sounds obvious I'm sure you did. I can imagine if things were sticky from sitting maybe you'd have some funny behaviour that could cause a few micro-misfires in the first minute or two of running... again those motors are super sensitive to that I think...

kudos!

BTW highly interested on the modifying DME's software (and trans software would follow that, right? I want to reprogram the way that my steptronic shifts in the normal program, delete the big brother in the manual mode, basically a dinan reprogramming for the poor man that lives way too far away for considering it a viable option)

You are a bit confused. First, his S62 has a completely different DME - MSS52 not ME7.2 which is what you have. completely different hardware/software, not even in the same universe. Paul is tweaking an MSS52 for which there is a lot of 'public domain' tweaking info coming out over the last couple of years luckily. This is of no help and no relation to our ME7.2 motors. There are a few guys who tune ME7.2 in US but only a few and far between, and there is no homebrew DIY coding / tweaking available on that platform.

Second, Steptronic programming mostly happens in the "EGS" module (aka what non-Bimmer world would call a "TCU" or transmission control unit). Yes it interacts w/ the DME but Dinan and other people who have tunes for the tranny behaviour flash that primarily to change the shifting. There are EGS module flashes from Dinan (and ESS I think?) for 540 Steptronic, and that's the kind of thing you are talking about, but nobody small-time at all I know who does that on the side and certainly no public domain info to homebrew like Paul is doing here w/ the MSS52 DME / ECU on the S62. So you are out of luck there.

Third, Re: 'big brother' that would be in the ABS/DCS module. Again it interacts w/ the DME but to change it fundamentally you need to recode the DCS module. There are some guys playing with retrofitting E46 DSC modules (with track mode) to other cars, but AFAIK nobody has been able to come up with a quality recode or mod for the E39 V8 platforms. If so, there's about a million of us in M5's/540's that would love to hear / see / buy it...

Sorry if that's not a great answer but iz troof.

[007008]

I have extra IKE pins. What time are you coming through here tonight?

[GSXRliterbikz]

Could the misfire codes be related to the flywheel? Did you use the m5 or the 540? Isn't the stroke diff on the m, resulting in issues if you use a 540 flex disk.

[TxDarth]

Could the misfire codes be related to the flywheel? Did you use the m5 or the 540? Isn't the stroke diff on the m, resulting in issues if you use a 540 flex disk.

I think he went 6 speed, hence no flex disk.........

[GSXRliterbikz]

I think he went 6 speed, hence no flex disk.........

The crank sensor still reads off the flywheel. The m one is different than the 540 one. Since he's using a 540 trans, if he used the flywheel from the 540, then it would cause problems.