my build thread, e30 with a 9 inch

[rpm620]

I would be down for a TO setup for a ZF if i dont go Dogbox right away.

[someguy2800]

I would go dogbox right away faceplated tko or t101 would be killer. Drive one and you'll be hooked. Kinda wish I would have gotten a faceplated tko, but after getting screwed on one last fall I just wanted an off the shelf trans rather than a custom one. I've heard liberty can take there sweat time on filling orders.


Spent the whole day today going through all the wiring on the car and making sure everything is in order. Some parts of the harness got a bit beat up during the cage install so I had to make some repairs and remove a few circuits now that I am not using the hvac or stock cluster. Just need to button up a few things to get it cranking over, then dig out my megasquirt and get that going again. Lagwagon brought over his m3 today so I could finally get a rid in that. Car is sick. Really fast and super smooth. I've never felt a turbo that size come on so smooth. Car drives like stock.

Tonight I pulled the diff out of the car. When I built the rear end I was still intending to run a bmw trans and 26 inch tires so the gear ratio's are all wrong. I had 3.55 gears in a stock ford case with a stock rebuilt trac lok diff which coupled with the now 28 inch tires would put me at like 175 mph in the top of forth gear and 1600 rpms in 6th on the freeway which is just silly. So I ordered a new Yukon aluminum third member to build a new diff. I'll be going with a 4.22 gear set which will put me at about 148 at the top of 4th and 2000 rpm on the freeway. I'm also getting a spool mainly for safety reasons on the drag strip. With me now moving 10 minutes from the drag strip rather than 2 hours I'll probably be seeing alot of track time.

[rpm620]

Im still kicking around the dogbox idea.... i was wondering tho would there be a way to use a BMW automatic bell housing and make an adapter for it..

[someguy2800]

Its possible but pointless in my opinion. They are too long so you would have to machine a good bit of material off and weld the adapter plate on. But then you have no reference point to determine the crankshaft centerline in order to machine the transmission dowel holes so you would also need to machine an assembly fixture to bolt the aluminum bell to in order to accurately drill the trans dowel holes. The alignment between the trans input and crank centerline is a maximum of .010" total runout and .010 parallel, otherwise you will burn up the front bearing. Mine came out to about .002" on runout and flatness. Also I realize most aren't concerned about this but an aluminum bell housing won't do much for you safety wise if you have a clutch or flywheel failure. I have seen a couple clutch explosions that put a healthy fear of them into me. I have a 4 inch gash in my trans tunnel from when I broke the output flange on my stock trans. I have parts to make 5 more t56 bell housing that I am picking up tomorrow and will make anything else there is a demand for.

[LagWagon]

Lagwagon brought over his m3 today so I could finally get a rid in that. Car is sick. Really fast and super smooth. I've never felt a turbo that size come on so smooth. Car drives like stock.

Aside from blowing the charge piping apart twice.. yeah it was fun! haha

[someguy2800]

I've seen two catastrophic clutch explosions. Once at a tractor pull, didn't get to see the damage up close but you could see pieces bouncing off the retaining walls. Also saw one at the strip in a 4th gen camaro. The stock bellhousing was 1000 pieces and there was a hole where a piece came up through the dashboard and out through the roof. Not meaning to scare anyone, its exceedingly rare.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbxcSVKH8MY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9vpcyxvvC8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBONiZ6Hv1c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDbrvUtNJfU

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Aside from blowing the charge piping apart twice.. yeah it was fun! haha

comes with the hobby! thanks for the ride, I really like the car.

[rpm620]

Well if I get a dog box I will let you know

[LagWagon]

Y u no update

[someguy2800]

Sorry for the lack of updates, havn't had any time for the car. I was traveling last week on business and spent the weekend chillaxin with the wife.

Finally got the parts for the new rear diff for the car. As I noted above, with the addition of the T56 my gear ratio was wrong so I decided to just build a whole new diff with all aftermarket parts. I kind of hit the jackpot on the rearend I got as it had a factory 4 pin trak lok limited slip diff in it, which is pretty rare and highly sought after. Ford first made them in about 1964 and there are a half dozen company's still making that limited slip. Ford 9 inches have gained a near mythical status as being bullet proof, but in reality the only really strong factory 9 inches are the ones with nodular iron cases and daytona pinion supports, which are extremely rare. I normal 9 inch isn't any stronger than a GM 12 bolt, or a ford 8.8. What really sets a nine inch apart is the aftermarket parts! I sold my factory diff for $550, and the new diff only cost me $675 to build with all new parts!

So for parts I ordered an aluminum thru bolt case from Yukon Gear, a chromoly drag spool, a billet aluminum pinion support, a billet steel yoke, and all the bearings, spacers, shims, ect... I got all this as a kit from Quick Performance for a really good deal. The case is bored for a 3.25" OD carrier bearings as opposed to the factory case which is 2.89", which allows for a bigger stronger carrier bearing and also room to use a larger 35 spline axle. Since I already have custom 31 spline axles, I fit it with a 31 spline spool with special bearings. The case is rated for 1200 hp. For gears I got a set of used nascar gears in a 4.22. They are motive gears which have been rem polished. I can't get a picture of it but they shine like chrome.



Bearings pressed onto the pinion and carrier, and races pressed into pinion support. I just have a 12 ton harbor freight press.



There are 4 reasons why a 9 inch can be one of the strongest diffs you can build. 1. Its big. Big pinion, big ring gear, big spines, big bearings. 2. Lots of aftermarket parts made with better materials. 3. It has a very high hypoid ratio. If you look at the location of the pinion gear it is very low in the case in relation to the carrier centerline compared with any other car diff. The high hypoid ratio gives the pinion gear more leverage on the ring gear as it actually operates like a combination of a worm gear and a traditional bevel gear. Also because of this a 9 inch always has 3 pinion gear teeth in contact with the ring at any time compared with most low hypoid diffs which only have 2. The downside to this is there is alot of sliding motion between the pinion and ring so there is a higher frictional loss compared to most diffs. 4. Pinion support bearing. One thing fairly unique about a nine inch is it has three pinion bearings. Most diffs only have two, but a nine inch adds a third bearing to the end of the pinion gear as seen below. This help keep the pinion gear from deflecting away from the ring gear which will cause you to break teeth and destroy the pinion bearings. This boss very often breaks off in the factory cases. This case has at least 3 times more material around this bearing than a factory case.



These are really easy diffs to work on but there is quite a bit going on. You have to set the bearing preload on the pinion with shims, the pinion depth, the carrier bearing preload, and backlash. And of course check the mesh pattern.





Just out of curiosity here are some pics comparing the size to a bmw 188mm diff.





weight

stock e30 LSD 188mm diff - 84 lbs

stock iron ford 9 inch with LSD - 70 lbs

Yukon aluminum case with spool - 52 lbs

[stealthbeam]

Badass man! Great progress

[vollosso]

So how strong is a BMW 210mm diff relatively?

[someguy2800]

So how strong is a BMW 210mm diff relatively?

I have no idea.


I got the new diff in the car tonight and put the axles and brakes back on. I took the next two days off work so I will try to update as I go. Here's a random shot of the end of the axle with wheel studs. Axles were custom made by Strange.

[auaq]

Looks delicious!

[wazzu70]

Your car is awesome. Love following the project! Its refreshing to see both DIY fab and unique approaches using non-BMW parts.

[auaq]

Would it be alright to call this project as a 'Hybrid ///M Turbo Project"?

[someguy2800]

You can call in Shirley for all I care. There aren't any "M" part in the car.

I spent the whole day working on the car. Started by rolling the bottom lip of the rear fenders. They were rubbing the tires at the bottom of the suspension travel. Besides for rolling the lips this was the only modification done to the outer bodywork to fit the tires



I put in the drive shaft and set the 4 link geometry in its starting positions. For the top bars I am using the top holes front and back, and the bottom bars are using the bottom holes on the axle and the third holes on the frame side. This position the instant center at 6 inches behind the front axle centerline, and 13 inches off the ground. The antisquat is at 53%. This should push the front end up pretty good while still softening the hit to the tires. I left the anti squat fairly soft so that I can still tune with the shocks. If I need more or less hit I can still make bar adjustments. If the car doesn't want to go straight I can also play with preload on the bars.

A word of caution: I nearly killed myself this morning under the car. I was under the car on my back tightening one of the four link jam nuts and I pulled the car off the jack. I just had the floor jack under the pumpkin with the rear tires about 4 inches off the ground and it tipped the jack over sideways. Car came down on top of me but by some miracle all the low hanging parts missed me and I was able to squirm my way out. I thought I was dead for a second there! Good thing the car sits high! Use jack stands!



I did about 45 other little stupid things not worth mentioning and then had to go to the dentist.

[E36 HateR]

Good work!

And be careful man always shove a jack stand under there, its always better to crush some part of the car rather than your head.

[someguy2800]

I usually make a habit of pushing a tire under the car, but they don't fit anymore

[someguy2800]

Wife convinced me to stay inside last night so I didn't get anything done. This morning I made new battery cables for my new mini battery. I went with an exide lawn mower battery with 300 cca. It is about half the size of a stock battery, only 18 pounds, and only cost $30. I don't know how this is going to work out but I wanted to try it out. It is 31 pounds lighter than my old battery. I might put in a shutoff switch on the back of the car but I am worried about idiots pushing it in when the car is running trying to be funny and destroying all my electronics.



I couldn't find my belt so I had to get a new one and figure out the length again. I don't run power steering. For anyone wanting to delete the power steering, the correct belt length is 55 inches.



I cranked the motor over for the first time a bit ago. Everything sounded good and it made oil pressure so I am going to hook everything up and hopefully get first start up today.

[LagWagon]

sweeeeet

[good & tight]

Awesome work Perry, jelly of that 4 link setup you have.

[someguy2800]

just got it running for the first time! I ran it for a minute or so and all seams well so far. I need to put the exhaust on before the neighbors call the cops. Still need to fill the trans and rear end with oil and put in the radiator. Once I get it all buttoned up I will start tuning and get it ready to drive. It will be a bit before its all done as I will be out of town this weekend.

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Awesome work Perry, jelly of that 4 link setup you have.

thanks!

[black bnr32]

won't you need the rear switch to meet NHRA rules? i can send you the rule book if you need.

[BobRoss]

Love the updates man, nice work!

[someguy2800]

won't you need the rear switch to meet NHRA rules? i can send you the rule book if you need.

A cutoff is only required for a relocated battery. Since it is still in the oem position it is fine.