TV Module for backup camera?

[quakefiend420]

I picked up a backup camera recently that I'd like to get installed. I have MKIV, 16:9, factory bluetooth, and a Sirius adapter installed. Is the BMW TV module the best option for setting this up? If so, any particular part #? I looked around on eBay and found several different ones...

Thanks!

[franco90]

nope NAvtovideo is your answer

[quakefiend420]

I've been doing some googling and Im not coming up with much on NAVtoVideo.

[franco90]

I've been doing some googling and Im not coming up with much on NAVtoVideo.

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw...o+nav&_sacat=0

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Install DIY
http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/489176

[sealbeach740]

I have a different POV than franco90.
With the OEM BMW TV tuner (which are now much cheaper since analog TV is pretty much non-existant anymore), you can not only add a backup camera, but you can also add AUX video that interfaces with your navigation. By interface I mean you can select or set a destination, then have the Nav route it. Then, turn on your video (DVD changer, iPod....) and watch on your 16x9 screen. When your next turn or direction change is coming up, you'll still be able to see your video, but you'll hear the Nav voice tell you what's upcoming. Once you get close enough, the Nav will take over your 16x9 & show you the map & what's the next route change for you to do. Once you've executed that manuever, it will go back to your AUX video seamlessly. It's quite a cool feature if you're driving a distance & only need map instructions once in a while. The video you're watching is only interrrupted to show you the map so you know what route to take, once you make the change, you're back to watching the video without having to provide any input or press any buttons.

The audio from a BMW TV tuner is only mono, but it's pretty easy to get stereo input to go along with the AUX video.

And, when you go into reverse, your backup camera will override anything being shown on your 16x9 until you get out of reverse.

Of course, back in the day, having the ability to show a TV show while you were driving was a pretty cool feature to show off to your friends!

[quakefiend420]

I have a different POV than franco90.
With the OEM BMW TV tuner (which are now much cheaper since analog TV is pretty much non-existant anymore), you can not only add a backup camera, but you can also add AUX video that interfaces with your navigation. By interface I mean you can select or set a destination, then have the Nav route it. Then, turn on your video (DVD changer, iPod....) and watch on your 16x9 screen. When your next turn or direction change is coming up, you'll still be able to see your video, but you'll hear the Nav voice tell you what's upcoming. Once you get close enough, the Nav will take over your 16x9 & show you the map & what's next for you to do. Once you've executed that manuever, it will go back to your AUX video seamlessly. It's quite a cool feature if you're driving a distance & only need map instructions once in a while. The video you're watching is only interrrupted to show you the map so you know what route to take, once you make the change, you're back to watching the video without having to provide any input or press any buttons.

The audio from a BMW TV tuner is only mono, but it's pretty easy to get stereo input to go along with the AUX video.

And, when you go into reverse, your backup camera will override anything being shown on your 16x9 until you get out of reverse.

Of course, back in the day, having the ability to show a TV show while you were driving was a pretty cool feature to show off to your friends!

I'm all about making my upgrades appear as factory as possible, so having it automatically switch between signals sounds pretty nifty. Will any TV module work, or do I need a specific part #?

[sealbeach740]

Will any TV module work, or do I need a specific part #?

No, not every BMW TV module will work for you. You don't want one that (only) works for a MKI Nav module, and you DO want one that works with a 16x9 screen.

This link will help you, but be aware it's a bit dated by now (but, those part numbers should still be acurate, there may just be other, newer numbers):

http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/230716/

It's been a while since I've needed to get info on a TV module. There may be more updated info out there that I'm not aware of, but this will get you started.

[quakefiend420]

No, not every BMW TV module will work for you. You don't want one that (only) works for a MKI Nav module, and you DO want one that works with a 16x9 screen.

This link will help you, but be aware it's a bit dated by now (but, those part numbers should still be acurate, there may just be other, newer numbers):

http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/230716/

It's been a while since I've needed to get info on a TV module. There may be more updated info out there that I'm not aware of, but this will get you started.

So it looks like everything in Section 1 and 2 will work except the ones noted that may not support widescreen?

[sealbeach740]

Ummm, don't pick one from section 1. I believe the analog/digital hybred units are for European TV signals.
I don't believe the hybred units work in the USA.

[xboss]

Funny how they hammered us all here in the USA that analog was going away and without a converter there would be no more TV. It's been 4 years now since the "analog ban" and there are like 8 stations in my area that still broadcast in analog.

[voodoomelon]

They switched off analogue in the UK about 3-4 years ago, and switch it off completely in Ireland about 6 months ago.
The best option is to get a regular analogue tuner and just tap into it; it has backup camera compatibility integrated.

[GSXRliterbikz]

I just bought a tv tuner and installed a cam. It's important that you get a tuner that is 16:9 compatible. There is a list somewhere on Bimmerboard that has all the part numbers for the 16:9's.

[quakefiend420]

They switched off analogue in the UK about 3-4 years ago, and switch it off completely in Ireland about 6 months ago.
The best option is to get a regular analogue tuner and just tap into it; it has backup camera compatibility integrated.

So with the default installation (just a couple harnesses, it appears) the tuner is going to be aware when I hit reverse and will automatically switch to the backup input? And it also has a 2nd AUX input with mono audio, right? Is that switchable from the widescreen unit up front?

[GSXRliterbikz]

So with the default installation (just a couple harnesses, it appears) the tuner is going to be aware when I hit reverse and will automatically switch to the backup input? And it also has a 2nd AUX input with mono audio, right? Is that switchable from the widescreen unit up front?

You have to add a relay to get it to work automatically.

[Magnum]

The writeup below will show you most of the info on adding the B/U Camera with relay to the TVonNav [see link I'll paste at the bottom].

I've also since ran new cables to add Video and Audio from my iPhone / iPod / iPad, this was done by using apple's AV cable and adding / splicing the cables I needed to make it work, plus it charges the device. I rarely use my DVD changer anymore because I can simply load up my movies, plug it in and go. Everything still works seamlessly with this setup, like B/U camera, rear seat monitor......

Another cool thing I added for my rear seat passengers, was to hook up on of those 5/1 in one game controllers you can find at most of the big box stores. The one I have is kind of old, but having Pac-Man, Galaga, Pole Position...on the rear monitor is fun for the rear passenger. Best thing, no power needs to be added for this because it's battery operated, lol...

I'd still love to get the TV function back though, being able to watch local stations in the car was priceless.!

Here's the link I mentioned above:

TVonNav with B/U camera install.

[kahlilj]

Sealbeach740 or anyone:

Is this below still true? If you're not intending to pick up any over the air digital signal can't we still use the Hybrid analog/digital units for DVD or backup camera installation and it will work fine?
I have mk4 & 16:9 screen as well and want to install a BMW TV tuner. I have the list from the bimmer board (that Roy created). So will the hybrid units not work for this basic function (onboard DVD player and/or backup camera)?

No, not every BMW TV module will work for you. You don't want one that (only) works for a MKI Nav module, and you DO want one that works with a 16x9 screen.

This link will help you, but be aware it's a bit dated by now (but, those part numbers should still be acurate, there may just be other, newer numbers):

http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/230716/

It's been a while since I've needed to get info on a TV module. There may be more updated info out there that I'm not aware of, but this will get you started.

Ummm, don't pick one from section 1. I believe the analog/digital hybred units are for European TV signals. I don't believe the hybred units work in the USA.

Racer2086, did you ever get yours figured out? If so what part number did you go with?

Ok, so I just got a TV module off ebay. It's actually a Rover module :/, but it was only $70. The guy who sold it said it worked in his '05 330 with MKIV and will work with any i-bus BMW. It looks exactly like the BMW one, just with a Rover label on it. I just plugged it in and the TV option doesn't show in the menu. The module responds to i-bus and everything because I can hear the fan spin up. If I leave just the TV module plugged in, the screen is just white.

My question...do I just need to code the system now, since this is a newer video module? Or did I make another stupid mistake buying this module? I kinda trust the guy because he was selling it on the E46 board also and seems to know what he's talking about. Also, the Rover people put BMW equipment in their cars all the time, so there must be some cross compatibility.

[sealbeach740]

Sealbeach740 or anyone:

If you're not intending to pick up any over the air digital signal can't we still use the Hybrid analog/digital units for DVD or backup camera installation and it will work fine?

I really don't know. I don't have any experience with the hybrid TV tuners.
My GUESS is yes, it should be fine for DVD & backup camera, but I don't know. I personally don't see why not getting a TV signal or not would impact showing a DVD via a DVD player/changer or installing a backup camera.
In fact, I can't recall reading where anyone (in the USA) has installed a hybrid BMW TV Tuner in an e38 or e39.

[Alpine 7even]

I really don't know. I don't have any experience with the hybrid TV tuners.
My GUESS is yes, it should be fine for DVD & backup camera, but I don't know. I personally don't see why not getting a TV signal or not would impact showing a DVD via a DVD player/changer or installing a backup camera.
In fact, I can't recall reading where anyone (in the USA) has installed a hybrid BMW TV Tuner in an e38 or e39.

I have a factory TV module, I've added video/audio inputs and outpurs as well as cam in and the cam signal and relay activation. Also added an aftermarket digital TV tuner, wdtv and kept my factory video/audio in plug (modified to accept video input from a usb to vdeo/audio jack). So my front factory 16:9 and rear monitor can display the same image or separate image as factory. I also coded the TV module for "TV in motion".

Edit: I currently have mk4 and 16:9 for those curious.

[sealbeach740]

Alpine 7even - care to share what aftermarket digital TV tuner you added?
How is the reception from the digital tuner while the car is in motion?
What did you use to get the digital TV tuner signal into the BMW OEM TV tuner?
Thanks!

[kahlilj]

I really don't know. I don't have any experience with the hybrid TV tuners.
My GUESS is yes, it should be fine for DVD & backup camera, but I don't know. I personally don't see why not getting a TV signal or not would impact showing a DVD via a DVD player/changer or installing a backup camera.
In fact, I can't recall reading where anyone (in the USA) has installed a hybrid BMW TV Tuner in an e38 or e39.

Thanks man. I'm thinking they should work. The hybrid's were in Roy's list: http://www.bimmerboard.com/forums/posts/230716/
But like you said I don't know of anyone who has installed a hybrid in the USA...

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Alpine 7even - care to share what aftermarket digital TV tuner you added?
How is the reception from the digital tuner while the car is in motion?
What did you use to get the digital TV tuner signal into the BMW OEM TV tuner?
Thanks!

I know right? +1 with the questions

[racer2086]

I think I can clear this up for you.

Premise:
I have a TV module in my E38 and I just put one in the E39 after I retrofitted all the nav stuff to that. My E38 has a 4:3 monitor, E39 has a 16:9. Older units will not output a 16:9 picture, so you need to make sure you get one that supports your screen size. My E38 has an older TV module that I fitted like 7 years ago, which meant that I was forced to a 4:3 size picture when I installed a 16:9 in my E38, despite having an MK4. This is because both the MK and the TV module generate the video interface you see on the monitor. When either one is installed alone, that unit is purely responsible for showing picture on the boardmonitor. When they are both installed together, they know it, and the TV module becomes the slave unit, passing through the MK video to the boardmonitor. The only time this policy is disrupted is when the reverse camera ground signal is realized, at which point the TV module becomes the master and outputs the reverse camera picture.

Answer:
DON'T buy a hybrid unit. They are for European digital signals (DVB-T), which is different than the USA. That is why they command a lot of money on ebay.de $200+. That is a waste for us in the USA.

DO buy a unit for the screen size in your car. Any numbers from section 2 should work for 16:9, but I avoided those last two numbers that say it may not support 16:9. I think I got one of the lines 5 or 6 from section 2. Any analog that supports 16:9 should work for you...I scored mine for ~$35 from the UK last year. Just need patience. The digital vs analog is only referring to the type of signal the internal tuner is equipped for; all units (unless maybe the very old ones?) should have inputs for an aux video/audio and for a reverse camera. That is separate and irrespective of the digital/analog tuner inside.

Extra:
There are aftermarket solutions to getting digital TV into the old BMW tuners. A member of another forum created an interface board, so that you can put an aftermarket digital TV tuner in the BMW TV module and have the factory control. No stuff external to the TV module is needed, it retrofits inside the TV module case, which surprisingly is mostly empty space inside. The interface is called PIBus and here is a link so you can read more info on the interface and fitting the digital tuner: http://pibus.info/tv/

Now, I didn't care about TV in the car. But if you want to route DVD through the TV module, you will have the same issues I did getting my phone to display on the screen. There are two: (1) the TV module takes old-school composite video inputs (the yellow RCA jack), that you need to add to the harness (pretty easy) or buy an aftermarket harness with it already; (2) the TV module sound is mono. The big issue for me was the sound.

Sound:
Mono sucks. Unfortunately, even my BM53 radio firmware makes the radio take the L&R channels that I feed to it directly for the TV audio input and merges it into a mono signal. My solution (stick with me here) was to wire the audio from my HDMI converter for my phone (in your case DVD player) into the AUX inputs on the BM53. Then you just need one line of I-bus code to switch the radio out of TV audio mode when you select TV on the screen to get back to AUX. Then you have stereo audio through the speakers and your video on the screen. All you need is a little $25 Arduino and an i-bus interface board. I already coded the thing, so I can give you my code. Here is my thread: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...hlight=arduino

Hopefully that covers everything for you.

[sealbeach740]

racer2086 - thank you very much for taking the time to write up all this information. Very informative.
Especially the pibus link.
If I understand this, there is a way to add digital TV to our old analog (BMW) TV tuners, but even after doing this, getting a decent (digital) TV picture while moving is still sketchy. Sounds like it works if you're in a good reception area & not moving, but the picture quality suffers once you start driving. I guess a good part of that reason is analog TV is just getting the best TV picture possible, while digital TV is basically either a very good picture or not a good picture at all.

Again, thank you for writing all this up & sharing it with us.

Let me add with the analog BMW TV tuner in my 2003 540 (with a BM53 radio) I am able to split the video from an iPod to the TV tuner's inputs, and the audio from the iPod (in stereo) to the AUX input of the BM53 radio. I believe this is possible thru the NavTV software. This allows me to watch TV (actually the iPod video ouput) & listen to a different sound source (the iPod stereo output). But of course, my old analog TV channels mainly show "snow" for most TV channels (occasionally I get a bad picture of some PBS type channels).

[racer2086]

No problem. I just went through this fairly recently, so it is still fresh in my mind. Give it another couple months and who knows.

Sounds like the NavTV does similar to what my Arduino does. It must signal the BM53 to switch from the TV audio back to the last audio input that was used. There's one ibus command to go off TV audio and another to go back on. I mapped mine to the < > switch of the tape deck. Really nice having stereo sound with a video input on the monitor.

And yeah, from what I understand, the digital is either all or nothing for the picture, which is why it is hard to get it while moving. I can't say from personal experience, however.

[kahlilj]

I think I can clear this up for you.

Premise:
I have a TV module in my E38 and I just put one in the E39 after I retrofitted all the nav stuff to that. My E38 has a 4:3 monitor, E39 has a 16:9. Older units will not output a 16:9 picture, so you need to make sure you get one that supports your screen size. My E38 has an older TV module that I fitted like 7 years ago, which meant that I was forced to a 4:3 size picture when I installed a 16:9 in my E38, despite having an MK4. This is because both the MK and the TV module generate the video interface you see on the monitor. When either one is installed alone, that unit is purely responsible for showing picture on the boardmonitor. When they are both installed together, they know it, and the TV module becomes the slave unit, passing through the MK video to the boardmonitor. The only time this policy is disrupted is when the reverse camera ground signal is realized, at which point the TV module becomes the master and outputs the reverse camera picture.

Answer:
DON'T buy a hybrid unit. They are for European digital signals (DVB-T), which is different than the USA. That is why they command a lot of money on ebay.de $200+. That is a waste for us in the USA.

.... The big issue for me was the sound.

Sound:
Mono sucks. Unfortunately, even my BM53 radio firmware makes the radio take the L&R channels that I feed to it directly for the TV audio input and merges it into a mono signal. My solution (stick with me here) was to wire the audio from my HDMI converter for my phone (in your case DVD player) into the AUX inputs on the BM53. Then you just need one line of I-bus code to switch the radio out of TV audio mode when you select TV on the screen to get back to AUX. Then you have stereo audio through the speakers and your video on the screen. All you need is a little $25 Arduino and an i-bus interface board. I already coded the thing, so I can give you my code. Here is my thread: https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...hlight=arduino

Hopefully that covers everything for you.

racer2086 - thank you very much for taking the time to write up all this information. Very informative...

+1!! Really good write up dude!

No problem. I just went through this fairly recently, so it is still fresh in my mind. Give it another couple months and who knows.

Sounds like the NavTV does similar to what my Arduino does. It must signal the BM53 to switch from the TV audio back to the last audio input that was used. There's one ibus command to go off TV audio and another to go back on. I mapped mine to the < > switch of the tape deck. Really nice having stereo sound with a video input on the monitor.

And yeah, from what I understand, the digital is either all or nothing for the picture, which is why it is hard to get it while moving. I can't say from personal experience, however.

Thanks to you both for continuing to be present on this board and sharing! I love that things like this can be resurrected & tweaked after some time road time.

So here's the thing: I have ZERO intention of using the tuner for a TV signal. Having TV reception is not my main reason for asking. I saw a hybrid tuner going for less cost than an analog tuner, but was hesitant to purchase because I wasn't sure if there were any other concerns I should have. So it sounds as though it shouldn't be if I have no intention of watching TV in my car right?

** Sidenote: Also I thought they're called hybrid tuners because they can do both analog & digital tuning (or signal encoding)? NO?

So is there anything that would prevent me from using a hybrid TV tuner (module) in the same way as an analog TV module if I only plan to use it for onboard video (i.e., backup camera & DVD)? Is there internal circuitry/electronics or anything that would not be able to process the video signal from an onboard source and not display it via my MK4 and 16:9 monitor? (presuming that I get the right aspect ratio module which matches my display unit)

^This is the part that is confusing me.

Sound: This is a concern too which seems you both have figured out a solution. But does either solution (NAVTV or Arduino) require you to switch something else in addition to just selecting the TV option from your menu? Do you have to flip another switch or turn something else on? Ideally I would want both the video and (stereo) audio to automatically switch even if that requires re-wiring or modifying something. I dread mono audio as well and understand that's what the TV module will output.

Lastly, what wiring harness did you use from the TV module to the NAV (MK4) unit? Racer did you fabricate your own?

Thanks for your thorough help guys

[racer2086]

Short answer for the video part...

The hybrid should be fine for your video needs. I think the only thing different is the internal tuner, which you won't be using. All input stuff is the same. Not 100% on that, but if you have a hybrid cheaper than an analog, I think that's a good deal and you can unload to someone overseas without much of an issue.

The other thing is that I think all hybrid units are newer so will support 16:9.


I'll try to explain the sound thing...

To get stereo from your "external" device, you need to wire the audio to the BM53 aux input. The key to switching the audio is the i-bus command as I mentioned. But that I-bus command does not say which input to go to, it just goes back to the last input you used. For example, you are listening to FM and select TV, the audio goes to TV. You send the i-bus command to switch back and it goes back to FM. If you select Aux before switching to TV it'll go back to Aux. So that's not hard to switch to before hand -- that's what you do normally in the car.

In terms of sending the i-bus command, you can code the Arduino to do whatever you want. For example, I have it send the command when I press the <> button. So I switch to Aux mode using the Mode button, select TV, press <>. Done. If you didn't want to have to press <>, you could code the Arduino to automatically send the i-bus command to switch back to radio mode when it detected the TV audio i-bus command when TV is selected. That'll just eliminate the <> button press. I think that's about as short as you will get from the car side of things -- then it's just up to whatever you have to do with your "external" device.

I have an aux plug up front for my phone and/or passengers stuff. I didn't want to eliminate that, so I made a small Y harness to plug into the radio pins, which merges the aux plug from the front and my stereo audio from my HDMI converter in the trunk. Two aux into one. There is only mild loss of gain doing this, but not enough to make a big difference.

I made my aux cord like this, which is how the BMW one is, and I think it avoided excessive gain loss tying the two inputs together: http://www.m5board.com/vbulletin/e39...e-install.html