BFG Rival Launch Event

[z3papa]

The tires still had release mold when the radiator hose let loose on our first run. Thereafter, the second run had me driving through the legacy of blown radiator fluid as I hit the line with mold release still prevalent. Hard to really assess what we were doing right or wrong with the Rivals. It seemed like we were always chasing out tails and not taking data to really analyze what it takes to maximize the Rivals. I never even took a pyro setting and left my head in my ass. My feeling is with adjustments to pressure, camber, rebound/compression, they will prove very strong. Enjoy your victory, as time will tell.

[SUVETR]

Yay...finally got some autocrossing this weekend. We still had snow last week. I thought I was going to go insane.

So, some surprising info from the event. Saturday was COLD. Max was about 50. Most of the day was 35-45. Today was about 65.

We only had a few people here on Z2's, but the Rivals owned most of the top PAX finishes both days. On Saturday in the super-cold we had one STS team on Toyos that was in the mix, but generally everyone liked the Rivals.

A few notes:

• The Rivals don't seem to mind cold at all. I usually get killed by the STS/STC cars on Toyos around here when it is cold like it was Saturday. This weekend, I was right with them. And the couple fast guys that had both Toyos and BFGs all ended up running the BFGs. This was the most surprising turn of events for the weekend.
• When the weather was in the mid-60's, the tires didn't seem to retain heat much, even with two drivers on a fast rotation. We kept the blankets on all day.
• Crazy-low tire pressures. More experimenting to do, but we ended up in the very-low 30's. Might try high-20s next time.
• Turn-in and feel was really pretty darn good. But figuring out how to find and stay in the "sweetest sweet spot" is looking to be more challenging.
• Difficult to say because of conditions and other changes in the car over the winter (especially the diff), but so far longitudinal traction does not seem to be quite as amazing as the lateral traction.
• The wear looks great. We put 60 runs on a VERY abrasive surface, and the shoulders are holding up very well.

That's all for now...

Neal

[PrinceE30]

Did you scrub them in much beforehand, Neal, or just a few runs / driving to the event to get them all cleaned of the mold release?

[SUVETR]

Did you scrub them in much beforehand, Neal, or just a few runs / driving to the event to get them all cleaned of the mold release?

None of the above?

I only got them mounted about a week ago, but it was snowing/freezing all week, so I never got to scrub them in. Most performance tires will chemically harden if they freeze, so there was NO chance I was going to ruin a brand-new set of tires before I even got to run on them. We still weren't planning to run them Saturday because it was still forecast to be near-freezing and rain. Wasn't going to risk it.

But by the end of the first round of heats it was 40 and drying, and the forecast for the afternoon had drastically changed. A couple of the Toyo cars had put on BFGs and were going faster, so I ran home with the truck over lunch. Came back in time to peel the stickers off and bolt them to the car for Larry's 2nd afternoon run. He immediately went 1-sec faster on a 45-sec course.

For reference, the Z1s were full-tread about a year old and probably had 60-80 runs on them, so maybe not optimal but they should have been in reasonably decent shape. Pavement was abrasive asphalt with low-medium grip and a couple sections with lots of bumps. A fairly nice, flowing speed-maintenance course.

Neal

[PrinceE30]

None of the above?

I only got them mounted about a week ago, but it was snowing/freezing all week, so I never got to scrub them in. Most performance tires will chemically harden if they freeze, so there was NO chance I was going to ruin a brand-new set of tires before I even got to run on them. We still weren't planning to run them Saturday because it was still forecast to be near-freezing and rain. Wasn't going to risk it.

But by the end of the first round of heats it was 40 and drying, and the forecast for the afternoon had drastically changed. A couple of the Toyo cars had put on BFGs and were going faster, so I ran home with the truck over lunch. Came back in time to peel the stickers off and bolt them to the car for Larry's 2nd afternoon run. He immediately went 1-sec faster on a 45-sec course.

For reference, the Z1s were full-tread about a year old and probably had 60-80 runs on them, so maybe not optimal but they should have been in reasonably decent shape. Pavement was abrasive asphalt with low-medium grip and a couple sections with lots of bumps. A fairly nice, flowing speed-maintenance course.

Neal

From my experience, ~50-100 run Z1s are about as good as you get. I should have mine later this week and hopefully can contribute to the discussion towards the middle of this month.

[D. Hitchcock]

Crazy-low tire pressures. More experimenting to do, but we ended up in the very-low 30's. Might try high-20s next time.

Howdy, Neal: So we've been running the Rivals on my e36 -- about four events in. We love them. They're awesome. We've been running mid-30s for pressures, using tread temps to guide us. But we're operating in a vacuum here, with no comparables ...

If you were taking temps, how did they look? Can you talk a bit more specifically about how the pressure reductions affected the car on course/times, etc.?

[BJO]

man, 275/35/18 Rivals delayed until June14th. I will need tires before that. Looks like its back to the RS3's for this year.

[murph1379]

But by the end of the first round of heats it was 40 and drying, and the forecast for the afternoon had drastically changed. A couple of the Toyo cars had put on BFGs and were going faster, so I ran home with the truck over lunch.

Neal is so distraught about it he couldn't even type it... maybe he's actually blocked this painful event from his memory already, but after our morning runs, I was beating Neal by .009 on my shiny new Rivals. (and our Toyo driving friends didn't switch until the afternoon)

Came back in time to peel the stickers off and bolt them to the car for Larry's 2nd afternoon run. He immediately went 1-sec faster on a 45-sec course.

(right after he looped it twice on the mold release -weeeee!!!)

I switched from Conti DWs to Rivals at 40*, figuring it was way too cold, but as things warmed up that would tell us where the Rivals start to do better. I immediately dropped 1.5 seconds. (the Conti's were a big mess at 35*, it was a total drift show)

While it was cooler I was really enjoying how controllable the throttle-on oversteer was with the Rivals. Sunday with higher temps I couldn't seem to improve on my morning times, I think the grip improved, and it took a little more to get the back end moving, and I just couldn't get comfortable with it.

Looking forward to doing a lot of testing on these in Lincoln in a few weeks!

[SUVETR]

Neal is so distraught about it he couldn't even type it... maybe he's actually blocked this painful event from his memory already, but after our morning runs, I was beating Neal by .009 on my shiny new Rivals. (and our Toyo driving friends didn't switch until the afternoon)

LOL! But you still were only 0.2 off me at the end of Saturday. You were just plain driving well. And IIRC the Waich bros were running BFGs on their STC Civic before the end of the morning...but I could be wrong.

(right after he looped it twice on the mold release -weeeee!!!)

That's what it looked like to me, too. But when he came back he said it there was absolutely more grip on the BFGs right from the first turn. The spin was a combination of pure greed, winter cobwebs, and a car with a nasty on-throttle oversteer. The new diff and rebuilt shocks required some substantial suspension adjustment, and we got about 70% there by Sunday afternoon.

Neal

- - - Updated - - -

If you were taking temps, how did they look? Can you talk a bit more specifically about how the pressure reductions affected the car on course/times, etc.?

Very un-scientific at this point. Too cold and not good pavement to use any detailed data like that, so we didn't bother. We'll be looking at temps and camber at the next event, for sure. I was mostly just looking at roll-over on the shoulders, and hearing about what others were doing, both at the event and online reports. Mostly it seemed to be able to put power down a little better when we got to the very-low 30s.

[hhw711]

man, 275/35/18 Rivals delayed until June14th. I will need tires before that. Looks like its back to the RS3's for this year.

Where did you find estimated release dates?

[BJO]

Where did you find estimated release dates?

On the tirerack website. Click on the size and it tells you if they have it in stock or when they expect it in.

[Bimmerman535i]

245/40/17 also delayed again till June 14. Ugh.

[hoki06]

245/40/17 also delayed again till June 14. Ugh.

I just asked a Tire Rack rep about those dates. He said the 6/7 date is concrete from BFG so they should ship out that day or right around there.

[xvxax]

I just asked a Tire Rack rep about those dates. He said the 6/7 date is concrete from BFG so they should ship out that day or right around there.

Arrival Date: the day after the DC pro.. sucks.

[hoki06]

Arrival Date: the day after the DC pro.. sucks.

That sucks. My goal is to have them by HyperFest at Summit.

[Jim@tirerack]

We are shipping the tires as soon as they come out. The 245/40R17 should be in by 06/04 and the 275/35R18 is showing 06/14. If I can help with the tires let me know.

[S14]

225/50/16 was to come in on the 10th, now the 15th. think it will be pushed back again?

[Jim@tirerack]

We have a truck scheduled into us on 05/13 so we should be good. If I can help let me know.

[hoki06]

Jim if I order the 245/40R17 Rivals and the date is pushed back further than 6/4, will I be notified by email of the change?

[Jim@tirerack]

Yes you would. Just enter my name as a previous contact and I will keep you posted.

[hoki06]

Great, thanks Jim

[S14]

Haven't heard much about the new re-11a, how do you think that one stacks up against the rival and zII?

[Bimmerman535i]

Along with that, any idea when the TR test is coming out?

[ButtDyno]

245/40/17 also delayed again till June 14. Ugh.

Yeah, they're really supporting the sport... as long as you have one of the lucky sizes.

[hoki06]

Set of 4 245/40R17 ordered, est. delivery date of 6/7

Jim, I put you as a previous contact. Please let me know if that delivery date changes.