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Thread: E46 Can bus project.

  1. #301
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    has anyone used this info to retain use of there gauges and other hvac functions etc.. in a swapped e46 with no stock dme? very interested..

  2. #302
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    We don't have DME anymore (standalone) and are driving tach and coolant temp gauge via CANbus.

    MegaSquirt MS3 has built in on later alpha code. Could also be done with some Motec products (dash or logger) or Arduino.
    Peter Florance
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  3. #303
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    Quote Originally Posted by pftuning View Post
    Somewhat OT, but EDN does tear-downs of various gear. This week it's Bluetooth OBDII adapter. Though some of you might get a kick out of it.
    http://www.edn.com/design/automotive...etooth-adapter
    Great timing. I was about to explain how to convert one of those OBDII scanners to work with a serial connection instead of USB. Looks like the important part of the insides is the same for the USB or bluetooth. This picture is from a USB version (I think it was cheaper). Just like in the article just take out the screws and open it up. I removed the sticker to access them on mine. On the inside this is what you have.

    Solder leads on for Rx and Tx. Suppose ground and power could be supplied through the OBDII connections. But I've marked the 5V and ground on the board too. Edit. Realized I have the +5V and ground switched in the picture. I'll correct when i get a chance.
    ELM_Clone.JPG

    Thaniel.
    Last edited by Thaniel; 09-05-2013 at 09:00 AM.

  4. #304
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    I'm a little out of the loop, but am I right that the RX and TX are TTL or 3.3v levels and not RS232 levels?


    Quote Originally Posted by Thaniel View Post
    Great timing. I was about to explain how to convert one of those OBDII scanners to work with a serial connection instead of USB. Looks like the important part of the insides is the same for the USB or bluetooth. This picture is from a USB version (I think it was cheaper). Just like in the article just take out the screws and open it up. I removed the sticker to access them on mine. On the inside this is what you have.

    Solder leads on for Rx and Tx. Suppose ground and power could be supplied through the OBDII connections. But I've marked the 5V and ground on the board too.
    ELM_Clone.JPG

    Thaniel.
    Peter Florance
    PFTuning.com

  5. #305
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkSideofWill View Post
    Was really looking for a source for BMW harness terminal and connector body part numbers.

    I doubt BMW buys their diagnostic connectors and pins from Delphi.

    fiarluy sure the design of the connector and terminals is mandated and I think everyone buys AMP for those parts.

  6. #306
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    Quote Originally Posted by pftuning View Post
    I'm a little out of the loop, but am I right that the RX and TX are TTL or 3.3v levels and not RS232 levels?
    Not RS232 levels. The PIC18F25K80 chip runs off 5V and those lines come staight out of the chip (could solder on there too but too tight for me). I expect 0-5 V on the Rx/Tx but haven't checked as Arduino will take 0-3.3 inputs as well. Spec page for it is http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts...cName=en550200

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanCollins View Post
    fairly sure the design of the connector and terminals is mandated and I think everyone buys AMP for those parts.
    The pin part that interfaces. Yah length and width that's all the same. It's the part that holds it in the plastic that looks different. I've bought an OBDII connector for my car and for my IKE (have bunch of pins left from that). But the pins don't appear to be the same as the BMW (the way they are retained into the plastic).

  7. #307
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thaniel View Post
    Not RS232 levels. The PIC18F25K80 chip runs off 5V and those lines come staight out of the chip (could solder on there too but too tight for me). I expect 0-5 V on the Rx/Tx but haven't checked as Arduino will take 0-3.3 inputs as well. Spec page for it is http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts...cName=en550200

    - - - Updated - - -


    The pin part that interfaces. Yah length and width that's all the same. It's the part that holds it in the plastic that looks different. I've bought an OBDII connector for my car and for my IKE (have bunch of pins left from that). But the pins don't appear to be the same as the BMW (the way they are retained into the plastic).
    So just buy a popular delphi or metri pack obd2 connector and replace the goofy bmw issued one. I have those shells and pins in bulk if you need them drop me a line

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeanCollins View Post
    So just buy a popular delphi or metri pack obd2 connector and replace the goofy bmw issued one. I have those shells and pins in bulk if you need them drop me a line
    It would be nice to know the manufacturer of bmw connectors, as I'm trying to source lots of 02 sensor connectors
    352whp @ 10psi
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  9. #309
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    is there a how to for dummys guide to interfacing with the bmw can bus, for people that are not engineers, but have good reading comprehension and know how to use a soldering iron and what not :p ive scanned through this thread but its not easy to make anything out of it if your not hands on the project

    i am working on a swapped 00' 323i but i have not dug into the dme or electronics yet, i like to just dive into projects without always planning every step ha

    if i can get rid of the DME and keep the gauges, hvac, and anything else that would make life easier that would be nice

    EDIT: i just noticed you made a pdf in your lsx e46 thread - will check that out when im at home, maybe that will clear it up to me
    Last edited by 7808; 09-03-2013 at 06:45 PM.

  10. #310
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7808 View Post
    is there a how to for dummys guide to interfacing with the bmw can bus, for people that are not engineers, but have good reading comprehension and know how to use a soldering iron and what not :p ive scanned through this thread but its not easy to make anything out of it if your not hands on the project
    We'll have no dummies here Yah this thread is more of a running steam of what's happening currently. There are some other posts that have more concise information. Though still not quite to a DIY step by step. But someone with some knowlege could easily fill in the blanks. Or wait and I'll fill in more blanks as time permits. Without a E46 project car of my own (girls in my family keep taking mine) the engine interface is just a hobby.

    Sadly (for this project) I spent my free time last week and last weekend debugging more of my ipod - ibus, BMW interface. It had an immediate need since I have 2 E46's on the road and only one store bought ipod controller. On the plus side it has now managed several successful trips playing music in the wifes car (with her at the controls). High marks went to the menu system (better than the store bought controller) but it still has a few more bugs to get out.

    But hey. Most of us swappers will want some music in are engine swapped BMW. So it's all good. Right?

    Thaniel.

    P.S. I'll set up a google docs file with the programs in it so everyone can access the latest. I have been making improvements over the ones I've posted. ANd then the stupid .PDF -> .zip won't have to be done.

  11. #311
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    Need some help.

    I pulled the engine out of my Z4 last weekend and I'm working on the motor/trans mounts. I decided to test the electrical system (see what works/doesn't work) and I'm having some issues.

    The power top will not work right (it won't go up and down right, won't lock right, etc.) and I get the following two errors:
    - 40 [065] Arrester hook drive: current too high when bolting
    - 70 [112] Undervoltage at KL30

    The power windows go up/down but the motors are not "cutting off" as soon as they reach their limit (ie: all the way up/all the way down). I run them all the way up/down (they are LOUD!!! they were silent last weekend before I pulled the motor) and when they reach the limit they continue to get current (LOUD hum) for 5-10 seconds after stopping (so the controller is not cutting them off).

    I have checked all the fuses, the voltage in the battery is full (also have a charger on the system), etc. so I'm really lost. When I cut the ECU out (I unplugged everything that had a plug and cut what did not), could that have cut a BUS that could be affecting this? Reason I ask is that "Undervoltage on KL30" sounds like a BUS issue.

    What is "KL30"?

    Thanks,
    Chris
    Last edited by V8Z4; 09-07-2013 at 08:46 PM.
    Chris

  12. #312
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    Thaniel, Incredible work! I read through this thread a few months ago when I first got my BMW (with complete intentions of swapping the motor) and again today. I have my LS in the car, just waiting for some goodies to get it the rest of the way. I am using both ECU's. The DME and a trigger wheel mounted to the back of my balancer for my tach signal, the BMW temp sensor fits right into the GM block, so that will be to the DME. I am going to put a separate oil pressure gauge into my ashtray, but would really like to feed oil temp to the cluster (the M has a temp gauge instead of fuel as I am sure you know). My other main concern is getting my AC working. (please excuse what seems like a run on sentence, it appears my [Enter] key has stopped working!) My question is, is there a way to convert the signal the DME sends the BMW Delphi compressor to work with the GM Compressor. My thoughts are how different can an AC compressor be? I am not sure how Blair wired his up to work.

  13. #313
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    Need some help.

    I pulled the engine out of my Z4 last weekend and I'm working on the motor/trans mounts. I decided to test the electrical system (see what works/doesn't work) and I'm having some issues.

    The power top will not work right (it won't go up and down right, won't lock right, etc.) and I get the following two errors:
    - 40 [065] Arrester hook drive: current too high when bolting
    - 70 [112] Undervoltage at KL30

    The power windows go up/down but the motors are not "cutting off" as soon as they reach their limit (ie: all the way up/all the way down). I run them all the way up/down (they are LOUD!!! they were silent last weekend before I pulled the motor) and when they reach the limit they continue to get current (LOUD hum) for 5-10 seconds after stopping (so the controller is not cutting them off).

    I have checked all the fuses, the voltage in the battery is full (also have a charger on the system), etc. so I'm really lost. When I cut the ECU out (I unplugged everything that had a plug and cut what did not), could that have cut a BUS that could be affecting this? Reason I ask is that "Undervoltage on KL30" sounds like a BUS issue.

    What is "KL30"?

    Thanks,
    Chris
    I can look it up if you have not already found it

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
    Peter Florance
    PFTuning.com

  14. #314
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roooster View Post
    My other main concern is getting my AC working. (please excuse what seems like a run on sentence, it appears my [Enter] key has stopped working!) My question is, is there a way to convert the signal the DME sends the BMW Delphi compressor to work with the GM Compressor. My thoughts are how different can an AC compressor be? I am not sure how Blair wired his up to work.
    Don't they both use a standard magnetic clutch (engage/lock up clutch = compressor turns)? If so, it should work the same. The GM ECU switches a relay which sends 12V+ to the compressor clutch (12V+ in one wire, ground the other wire).



    Quote Originally Posted by pftuning View Post
    I can look it up if you have not already found it

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
    I have not been able to find anything that tells me what KL30 is. The top started working again, but it's still not quite right. The windows are still not cutting off as soon as they hit the travel limits. I have been sick all weekend (still am) so I have not had a chance to mess with it any.
    Chris

  15. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    Don't they both use a standard magnetic clutch (engage/lock up clutch = compressor turns)? If so, it should work the same. The GM ECU switches a relay which sends 12V+ to the compressor clutch (12V+ in one wire, ground the other wire).

    I have not been able to find anything that tells me what KL30 is. The top started working again, but it's still not quite right. The windows are still not cutting off as soon as they hit the travel limits. I have been sick all weekend (still am) so I have not had a chance to mess with it any.
    I believe the KL30 is position 30 of the ignition. So ignition on - last click before engagin the starter. First turn of the ignition is position 15.

  16. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by nurburgracer View Post
    I believe the KL30 is position 30 of the ignition. So ignition on - last click before engagin the starter. First turn of the ignition is position 15.
    That sounds right; I can't find my training manual at the moment...
    Peter Florance
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  17. #317
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    So then the "- 70 [112] Undervoltage at KL30" error would be from low battery voltage? The battery has 11+ volts in it..... odd
    Chris

  18. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    So then the "- 70 [112] Undervoltage at KL30" error would be from low battery voltage? The battery has 11+ volts in it..... odd
    All the grounds good?

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
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  19. #319
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    Quote Originally Posted by pftuning View Post
    All the grounds good?
    That's a good question....I had not thought of grounds.

    I removed/disconnected any/all grounds that were in the engine compartment (engine is out, ECU is gone, etc.). I guess it's possible that with those grounds disconnected there is an 'open' circuit which could be causing an issue. I'll have to check.

    In BMWs, are grounds always brown?
    Chris

  20. #320
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    That's a good question....I had not thought of grounds.

    I removed/disconnected any/all grounds that were in the engine compartment (engine is out, ECU is gone, etc.). I guess it's possible that with those grounds disconnected there is an 'open' circuit which could be causing an issue. I'll have to check.

    In BMWs, are grounds always brown?
    As far as I recall.

    Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
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  21. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by pftuning View Post
    As far as I recall.
    I'll have to do some checking of grounds then. Hopefully nothing else is brown (ie: I hope BMW was smart enough to make ONLY grounds brown).
    Chris

  22. #322
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    So then the "- 70 [112] Undervoltage at KL30" error would be from low battery voltage? The battery has 11+ volts in it..... odd
    I wouldn't say from the actually voltage accross the battery terminals being low - it would be the supply to a particular component/ecu when the ignition is on.

    Perhaps it would be worthwhile starting a thread on this particular problem?

  23. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by V8Z4 View Post
    Don't they both use a standard magnetic clutch (engage/lock up clutch = compressor turns)? If so, it should work the same. The GM ECU switches a relay which sends 12V+ to the compressor clutch (12V+ in one wire, ground the other wire).
    Agreed. Far as I have ever seen the clutch is just straight DC voltage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Roooster View Post
    Thaniel, Incredible work! I read through this thread a few months ago when I first got my BMW (with complete intentions of swapping the motor) and again today. I have my LS in the car, just waiting for some goodies to get it the rest of the way. I am using both ECU's. The DME and a trigger wheel mounted to the back of my balancer for my tach signal, the BMW temp sensor fits right into the GM block, so that will be to the DME. I am going to put a separate oil pressure gauge into my ashtray, but would really like to feed oil temp to the cluster (the M has a temp gauge instead of fuel as I am sure you know). My other main concern is getting my AC working. (please excuse what seems like a run on sentence, it appears my [Enter] key has stopped working!) My question is, is there a way to convert the signal the DME sends the BMW Delphi compressor to work with the GM Compressor. My thoughts are how different can an AC compressor be? I am not sure how Blair wired his up to work.
    You're not that far away. when you get it driving bring it on by. Could do some fun testing/demos on an actual LSx E46.

  24. #324
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    If that is the case with the AC, that makes it easier. My question is, there is only one wire going to the AC, Then there is a ground coming off the BMW compressor. Most of the circuits if I am correct on the BMW are grounded and the relay connects the ground. As my car is not running right now, can someone confirm whether the BMW sends 12V to the compressor when it is turned on through the 1 black plug on it?

    Thaniel, Dublin is only 2 hours away, I would be glad to bring the car up. I hope to have it done realistically by the beginning of November. I think I will go post a build thread now.
    Last edited by Roooster; 09-21-2013 at 11:37 PM.

  25. #325
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    Well, thanks Thaniel and son!

    I have my logger up and working finally (not that I've really been trying that hard, just found time to play with it finally).

    I ditched the Mega to be saved for a future aquarium controller project. I picked up an Uno and the shield and your sketch work perfectly. I did a couple of short logs on my E60 to make sure I had things right. Then yesterday, I logged about 20 minutes of data driving and operating everything in the car while running a voice recorder in my iPhone to correlate times.

    I then dumped everything into Excel (boy it really doesn't like files longer 65535 records) and have a lot of data to go through. While my experience will be much different than an E46, I found a surprising amount of data correlates to what I found for the E84 X1 listed here.

    Hopefully I can make short work of all the additional ARBIDs the E60 (a veritable rolling server farm) has and get what I'm after.

    Would either of you be willing to share your excel spreadsheet? I'm sure there's something more efficient to how I'm handling this. I would think it would be possible to have a macro autogenerate a worksheet with unique ARBIDs listed as rows and then populate the column with the bit values. My Excel-Fu is not that good...

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