E38 1/2jz...really?

[redciv1]

Kinda curious about this especially with such limited information. Since KS-Racing has 1/2 jz motor mounts for the e39 M5, then it would seem that the same mounts would be able to be used on the E38 since the v8 mounts are probably the same between the non m5 and m5 v8. Obviously I am interested in an E38/2jz swap. Logic is that E38's are older and most of the one's out there need maintenance that can be rather expensive. Not too many E39 guys that have done this swap, so rather curious.

[RVAE34]

I have been thinking how sweet a 2j would be in the e38 since an lsx seems to be such a pita as well recently. I literally was just discussing it with my best friend who has a sick gs w 2jzvvti from an aristo. Lots of room and I have seen an s62 powered E38 so I think you might be right about the engine mounts. Interested to see if you go anywhere with this.

[redciv1]

Hey five, I appreciate the comments. I have nothing against the LSx motors, but once you go boost it's just addictive. Have a stock Saab 9-3 and contemplated upgrading to Stage 3, however the 9-3 is small and I need more room. I love the E38, however FOR ME, it just makes more since to put in the 1/2JZ drivetrain and bump up power from there. Waiting on E-Shift to reply to email about the wiring harness. I see they did the dual ECU's for the M5 and that makes since with it being OBD2, so I am anxious to see mount wise if it would work. I will keep informed though. More comments on whether mounts for e39 v8 and e38 V8 are the same.

[RVAE34]

I would prefer the LS personally but from what I had read, it's a royal PITA to get the motor to fit in the E38 with the steering being the major setback. Being that I own an E34, I have always loved the E38's. And now that they are so cheap, I had considered getting one as my next project for a while. But I still think I want to go twin turbo LS in an E39 touring next. If I found either locally, I might pick one up and let that decision define which powerplant I went with.

This is my best friend's GS bay. His car makes me love the 2J. Driving 357i's S/C'd LS E36 makes me love the American V8. I would be just as happy with either though I think

[redciv1]

I understand about the 2jz and GS. My other friend has a GS the same and just this past weekend we were discussing putting a 2jz gt motor. I am trying to talk him into the swap ut we will see. I am really hoping the frame rail width between thw e39 &e38 are the same. I think this would be a good project. Just need more info.

[RVAE34]

Let me know if your friend needs help and I can put him in touch with mine. He did everything himself and knows a lot of tricks for the GS.

[Def]

Why not just run an M52 and put a turbo on it? 1JZ/2JZ engines don't offer anything over a BMW I6 at 600 rwhp or less really.

[RVAE34]

Well, I would prefer the 2JZ in the E38 for several reasons. First of all, I would actually prefer the verticle mount for ease of access to everything. And being that the E38 is such a heavy car, I would want about 700 RWHP. Which is much cheaper and easier to get out of a 2J that can handle about 1000hp on stock internals where as the M52 is only good to about 450 RWHP. Don't get me wrong, I love my turbo M52 in my E34 but I am now just about maxed b/c of turbo size restriction and stock internals.

[redciv1]

Let me know if your friend needs help and I can put him in touch with mine. He did everything himself and knows a lot of tricks for the GS.

I will definitely take you up on that one.

Why not just run an M52 and put a turbo on it? 1JZ/2JZ engines don't offer anything over a BMW I6 at 600 rwhp or less really.

This is just a personal decision that I feel would work good for my needs. Not knocking the BMW motors at all. There's been enough debates on that issue. I realize anything is possible as far as money is concern, however there is a point where it just is not cost effective. If after I research there are two many issues that are cost prohibitive then I will go e39, but I think this would be exactly what would meet my needs.

[M5Hunter]

I need friends like yours Brandon! I'm going to just start following you around.

[RVAE34]

Hehe

[redciv1]

...was browsing the site and came across this post regarding a LSx swap on a e38. Check out post 11, really gives confidence that 540/M5 1/2 jz mounts should work:
http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum....php?t=1730309

[andrep6810]

Great swap.

[dohcdoh]

what about off boost power with a heavy car like an e38? I would be worried about lugging til boost hit.

[wanganstyle]

what about off boost power with a heavy car like an e38? I would be worried about lugging til boost hit.

not an issue;

2j with twins will spool quickly with a heavy car, lots of load to wake up the turbo. e38 could take a single also, and one can do a compound setup if disel torque is desired.
Late model 2jz-GTE with VVti would be ideal for a heavy car install; tune the VVTi to spool the turbine. Local Friend just did an Is300 with late model Aristo VVti (cable throttle) and a gt35R happily spooling.

[redciv1]

not an issue;

2j with twins will spool quickly with a heavy car, lots of load to wake up the turbo. e38 could take a single also, and one can do a compound setup if disel torque is desired.
Late model 2jz-GTE with VVti would be ideal for a heavy car install; tune the VVTi to spool the turbine. Local Friend just did an Is300 with late model Aristo VVti (cable throttle) and a gt35R happily spooling.

Would definitely go single and either the Holset Hy35 or Hx35. Ideally, I would like for boost to come on at about 2800-3000 rpm for that reason of moving such a heavy car. Not use to lag even in my 9-3. Sticking with the non VVti setup as I have read getting the VVti to properly run can be difficult.

[wanganstyle]

Would definitely go single and either the Holset Hy35 or Hx35. Ideally, I would like for boost to come on at about 2800-3000 rpm for that reason of moving such a heavy car. Not use to lag even in my 9-3. Sticking with the non VVti setup as I have read getting the VVti to properly run can be difficult.

if you cant get the VVti toyota 2jzgte to run, you cant get any 2jzgte to run properly.... they are all the same. Modular to ridiculousness

if you care about lag and don't want VVTi why do you care about lag? quite a contradiction!

if you are actually serious you can stop reading "thoughts"- start reading wiring charts. Go to the toyota dealer and ask for wiring map for Toyota 1998 supra USA MK4 twin turbo, it costs $0 and makes alot of sense compared to a BMW wiring map.

[redciv1]

if you cant get the VVti toyota 2jzgte to run, you cant get any 2jzgte to run properly.... they are all the same. Modular to ridiculousness

if you care about lag and don't want VVTi why do you care about lag? quite a contradiction!

if you are actually serious you can stop reading "thoughts"- start reading wiring charts. Go to the toyota dealer and ask for wiring map for Toyota 1998 supra USA MK4 twin turbo, it costs $0 and makes alot of sense compared to a BMW wiring map.

Whoa there wangan, you confused me there. Of all the E36/2jz swaps I have read on, I don't remember anyone using the VVti. Can't recall the exact reason. Also, aren't the VVti engines front sump and BMW config calls for a rear sump setup?

[wanganstyle]

Whoa there wangan, you confused me there. Of all the E36/2jz swaps I have read on, I don't remember anyone using the VVti. Can't recall the exact reason. Also, aren't the VVti engines front sump and BMW config calls for a rear sump setup?

Not many have the liquid money to buy a late model 2jz and all of its associated specifics. Nobody I know with a 1998 supra twin turbo will be parting/removing/selling out the original engine. I could not source one affordably for my sc300 build so I bought a J spec unit from MK4 supra: http://www.clublexus.com/forums/perf...-progress.html


Some very Late model engines also has slightly different bottom end internals. Only an issue for very high power areas that you would be doing a built internal engine anyways. Aftermarket forged 2JZ internals are easy purchased, very very inexpensive also compared to BMW aftermarket forged internals. One can just order a HKS 3200cc kit and be done with it.

2jz NA and factory turbo share the same part number for crank/rods, same material for pistons (just taller tops for na)


all MK4/3 supra is a rear sump. The 2jz GTE vvti is the final evolution of the 2JZ engine; its the nicest setup you can have.

All 2jz shortblocks can be configured for Front, Mid, Rear sump -YES, there is a MID sump also.

If you are looking into 2jz-gte wiring for non-vvti you will probably run into my wiring FAQ/spreadsheet on club lexus. same username as BFC

VVTi is very similar, just get the ECU pinout directly from Toyota if using a USA spec vvti ecu (98 supra tt). Toyota vvti is just like BMW vanos, it can be added to non-variable valve timing versions (all modular). My last e36M got a non vanos head grafted into the s52 and retained vanos and OEM obd2 s52 dme before going s54b32 swap.

VVti has both usdm and JDM versions, which one you choose is your choice.
JDM engines are MAP only, compared to the usa engines with Airflow meters. Both setups are BPU powerup'ed with piggybacks and stock ecu/sensors to about 5-600rwhp. Use an AEM standalone ecu for more than 600rwhp goals.

photo from supra forms of 1998 supra MK4 with 2jz-gte VVti. rear sump is native because its a supra.



compared to a 2jz-gte from 95 supra JDM with no airflow meter (map only). Rear sump native also (This is my former SC300 with MK4 J-spec engine/electronics and US spec turbos and fuel system). OEM toyota style install into sc300 (both JZZ30 SC300 and JZA80 Supra share chassis dna). Native rear sump, everything fits like factory.

[redciv1]

Thanks wangan. I too am also on ClubLexus. I have to check out your posts over there.

[RVAE34]

Wanganstyle is dead on. My friend with the GS I posted earlier imported the Aristo vvti motor. Most people don't do it b/c they are harder to find and more expensive. He is running a single Borg Warner turbo and since he has the blow through system, he is still running the stock tune (although he does have the MAP ECU III hooked up just not tuned yet). On that stock tune, he made 450 RWHP at 11 lbs of boost. He is planning on running 25-30. His 3rd gear pull got up to 130 IIRC. It would be the perfect power plant for the E38 and if you don't want lag, just run a lower A/R and/or smaller single turbo.

[wanganstyle]

Wanganstyle is dead on. My friend with the GS I posted earlier imported the Aristo vvti motor. Most people don't do it b/c they are harder to find and more expensive. He is running a single Borg Warner turbo and since he has the blow through system, he is still running the stock tune (although he does have the MAP ECU III hooked up just not tuned yet). On that stock tune, he made 450 RWHP at 11 lbs of boost. He is planning on running 25-30. His 3rd gear pull got up to 130 IIRC. It would be the perfect power plant for the E38 and if you don't want lag, just run a lower A/R and/or smaller single turbo.

yupp..... not just buying it is expensive- the specific sensors, wiring, setup is more advanced and is really for somebody looking for the final evolution of the ultimate OEM turbo engine.

2JZ was designed for SPOOLUP, it has mild cams and the intake ports are small to keep velocity while the portal in the head post intake port is HUGE.

6-8k easy to make that setup; afterwards you can pull 180mph++ passes at the TX mile. (stock 2009 vette z06 is 175 or so)

to have a true 2JZ-GTE torn down to naked block/crank/head rebuild it to 100% oem new specs will cost about $2000-3000. Not nearly as much as a BMW longmotor!

mid sump, front sump, rear sump - it all costs the same to get the entire setup you need.

turbine kit is 3-5k depending on electronics and fuel system choice.

[redciv1]

Good Info guys.

[redciv1]

Kinda curious, I know that the E36/39 need a rear sump 1/2jz, but what is required for the E38 chassis? Kinda curious which one is needed on the E38. Anyone know for sure?
Also, do you have to use the fan clutch on the 1/2jz motor or could I just use a second electric fan?

[eightynine535]

http://www.zerotohundred.com/newforu...1&d=1302923561

looks sexy. Dirty, but sexy.