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Thread: Short shifter installed - now reverse pops out

  1. #1
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    Short shifter installed - now reverse pops out

    I just picked up a used B&M short shifter and had it installed at a reputable BMW shop along with new oem bushings all around. When I picked up the car, the tech said that everything went smoothy, but when driving the car off of their lot I noticed that reverse didn't seem to fully engage. When I release the clutch it pops out of gear.
    The tech spent many hours rechecking the install and couldn't figure out the issue so he re-installed my stock shifter with fresh bushings only to find that reverse still pops out of gear!
    They told me the transmission is bad and want to take it out and inspect. I'm scratching my head as to how I brought the car in for a shifter install and am now in need of a whole new tranny.
    Does anyone have any thoughts as to what the problem could be?
    I don't want to disclose the name of the shop because they've been great in the process. The shop and tech that worked on the car is a household name to all local NASA racers and I trust their competence and ability.
    My car is a 97 M3 with 120k miles and the shifter was previously installed in a 98 M3. The shifter felt great in all other gears and looked good visually.
    Thoughts??

  2. #2
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    Did you drive the car around and use all the forward gears?

  3. #3
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    Yes. I drove it home 30 miles that night. No issues with the other gears. The shift pin detents were addressed during the 90k clutch change according to the paperwork that came with the car.

  4. #4
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    Can you try one thing when you get a chance? In a parking lot with nothing in front of you or behind you, try this. While the car is off, put the it into reverse, push the clutch pedal in, and try starting the car.

    Does the car behave out of the ordinary?

    Now, try letting the clutch out. Does it still pop out?

    This is something I would try. Give it a shot. I hope it yields some useful information.

    A young guy who designed his own shifter for one of my other cars (VERY nice piece) once said that a short-shifter will never cause a perfectly good tranny to stop working as it should. He said a short shifter can actually magnify existing tranny problems.

  5. #5
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    could be that you installed the selector rod the wrong way.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy
    Can you try one thing when you get a chance? In a parking lot with nothing in front of you or behind you, try this. While the car is off, put the it into reverse, push the clutch pedal in, and try starting the car.

    Does the car behave out of the ordinary?

    Now, try letting the clutch out. Does it still pop out?

    This is something I would try. Give it a shot. I hope it yields some useful information.

    A young guy who designed his own shifter for one of my other cars (VERY nice piece) once said that a short-shifter will never cause a perfectly good tranny to stop working as it should. He said a short shifter can actually magnify existing tranny problems.
    Unfortunately the car is at the shop and the tranny is already out. I'm with you that a shifter should not render a transmission useless. Even stranger is why it still doesn't work with the original shifter back in (with fresh bushings). If it wasn't worked on at the shop that shall remain nameless, I would be screaming installation error. I'm still giving the tech the benefit of the doubt.

    Curious, what would that test have proved?

    Also worth noting is that they also tried a dssr with the same results. They also used transmission mounts from a 5 series because they said they are stiffer and have the same dimensions as the standard m3 ones that I gave them.

    Also forgot to mention that the shifter rod on the b&r made a hard stop on itself when in reverse. We originally thought that grinding the blue anodized ring of the b&r would allow a millimeter or so of more movement in reverse. That was when we just decided to put the stock shifter back in.
    Last edited by rkybobby; 10-04-2011 at 11:47 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  7. #7
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    Get rid of that B&M. I had one break on me and left my wife and I 5 miles from home.

    Understeer.com is the place to get a short shift.

    http://understeer.com/onlinestore-shifters.shtml
    Last edited by KnudsonM3; 10-05-2011 at 01:23 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  8. #8
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    get the OEM short shift kit from the Z3, its half the price and its oem. B&M sucks
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  9. #9
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    You need a different length DSSR. My friend has same problem when he got UUC SSK and DSSR. They sent him one of a different length and problem was completely eliminated.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by JJCTHE1 View Post
    get the OEM short shift kit from the Z3, its half the price and its oem. B&M sucks
    did you read my post at all?

  11. #11
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    Did the shop replace the shift selector joint?



    If they replaced it, and changed it from the joint on the right to the joint on the left, it *could* cause the trans to pop out of reverse due to running out of throw. The joint on the left is something like 5-8mm longer from the pin to the shift rod hole.
    Chris
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  12. #12
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    I supplied them with the pelican shifter bushing kit so yes they did replace the joint. I didn't personally look the part but I have to assume that they supplied the right part.
    I'm still waiting for the tranny shop to inspect things and let me know what they think is wrong.

  13. #13
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    If youre going to continue to mod, DIY and save yourself the trouble of future headaches.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkybobby View Post

    Curious, what would that test have proved?
    I had an issue with one of my cars where the gear would get stuck at random times. I literally couldn't pull it out of gear unless the car was off for a few minutes. I put the car in gear while the car was off, pushed in the clutch, and tried to start the car. The car moved forward just like an auto tranny car would. It turned out to be a warped clutch disk.

    I wanted you to try it to see if maybe something similar happened to see if the problem could be clutch/flywheel related.

    Hope they figure out the problem and it doesn't cost you too much.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnudsonM3 View Post
    If youre going to continue to mod, DIY and save yourself the trouble of future headaches.
    I've done everything in my day from differential rebuilds, suspension and light engine work. My mid-rise lift covers the center section and I couldn't reach the shifter or remove the exhaust to do it myself. Trust me I wiggled around under there for 2 hours before realizing that the 1.5 hours of labor a shop would charge was well worth the aggravation.

  16. #16
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    I posted the solution and nobody wants to acknowledge it. You need a different length DSSR! I will bet $5 that it will fix the problem immediately.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkybobby View Post
    I've done everything in my day from differential rebuilds, suspension and light engine work. My mid-rise lift covers the center section and I couldn't reach the shifter or remove the exhaust to do it myself. Trust me I wiggled around under there for 2 hours before realizing that the 1.5 hours of labor a shop would charge was well worth the aggravation.
    Oh weird. Ive installed ssk'd with them installed.

    Quote Originally Posted by jayjaya29 View Post
    I posted the solution and nobody wants to acknowledge it. You need a different length DSSR! I will bet $5 that it will fix the problem immediately.
    That happened to me....Ill agree with you if it makes you feel better lol
    Last edited by KnudsonM3; 10-06-2011 at 11:40 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jayjaya29 View Post
    I posted the solution and nobody wants to acknowledge it. You need a different length DSSR! I will bet $5 that it will fix the problem immediately.
    Ha, I listened but didn't think this would still be the issue when I put all the stock bits back in (with new bushings). I assume the DSSR he tried was the same length as the stock selector rod. Why does UUC sell different length dssrs? Is it for different model years? I'll give them a ring tomorrow.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkybobby View Post
    Ha, I listened but didn't think this would still be the issue when I put all the stock bits back in (with new bushings). I assume the DSSR he tried was the same length as the stock selector rod. Why does UUC sell different length dssrs? Is it for different model years? I'll give them a ring tomorrow.
    95 is different from 99....I made an error in ordering and they shipped me out another one that day.

    UUC had good customer service.

  20. #20
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkybobby View Post
    Ha, I listened but didn't think this would still be the issue when I put all the stock bits back in (with new bushings). I assume the DSSR he tried was the same length as the stock selector rod. Why does UUC sell different length dssrs? Is it for different model years? I'll give them a ring tomorrow.
    Yes, they make different length ones to solve the very problem you are having.

  22. #22
    Rob Levinson's Avatar
    Rob Levinson is offline Member BMW E36 M3 Expert
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    rkybobby, I believe we spoke on the phone this afternoon.

    I think jayjaya29 is spot-on, you may have the incorrect selector joint installed for your year. Until 9/1994, BMW used a selector joint that was 9mm longer than the 9/1994+ production parts. That is exactly why we offer two different DSSRs for the E36 M3, one that is 189mm long and the other which is 198mm long (measured on-center at the pivot pins).

    You told me that you had replaced the selector joint and that the problem arose immediately, both with the aftermarket shifter and the original shifter. That really seems to point to an incorrect selector joint being installed (they do look very similar), which means your solution is either switching back to the correct selector joint, or using the DSSR designed for the joint that you have installed.

    Please let me know if I may be of further assistance.
    ----------
    NOT with that company any more.

  23. #23
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    It turned out that it was a bad tranny. The selector rod was the correct length.
    The b&m shifter is in and working great!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by rkybobby View Post
    It turned out that it was a bad tranny. The selector rod was the correct length.
    The b&m shifter is in and working great!
    I’m having the same problem with my e36, I picked it up at a dealers auction and I can tell there’s a short shifter kit installed, when I go into reverse it almost always grinds and pops out, and it feels as though it’s not engaging all the way. Is there any other way to fix this problem other than changing the transmission?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meti View Post
    I’m having the same problem with my e36, I picked it up at a dealers auction and I can tell there’s a short shifter kit installed, when I go into reverse it almost always grinds and pops out, and it feels as though it’s not engaging all the way. Is there any other way to fix this problem other than changing the transmission?
    Lol 7 years later and still no one acknowledges my solution (read my posts above).

    Try a longer DSSR (shift selector rod).

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