A Rare Bird: The E30 Baur

[tomscat1]

Tom

Thanks for the leads. The prices I quoted were admittedly taken from the Penske site, which represents full-boot retail.

I recently had my first good experience while speaking to a BavAuto rep (Alan or Allen). While he didn't have the item I needed, he did offer some very useful info for which I thanked him; it has often been frustrating to talk to most of the others up there.

I lately use Levent at GutenParts; his prices are quite reasonable, and you can't beat the personalized service. I should probably have called him about this by now.

So: do Baurspotting users get any discount at FCPGroton . . ?

Jeff

UPDATED INFO:

According to this spark plug chart http://e28calendar.com/Misc/SparkPlugChart.pdf, all of the M20 "i" engines used the W8LCR plug -- along with a few other '80s - '90s BMW applications . . . so they shouldn't be too hard to find.

Now to find Bosch numbers for that oddball cap, rotor and wires . . .

Jeff

Sorry, Jeff, Baurspotting users dont get an FCP discount, although, as a list sponsor, I believe they make special offers to members of this list. Their BMW inventory is not as extensive as others, however.

Don't forget to check Maximillian Importing in MD also. I ordered some brake parts for my Baur last summer from Bav Auto, just before Bimmerfest East. One part of the shipment didnt arrive, and, when I called, I was told it was not only out of stock, but they didnt know when it would arrive from Germany! They originally told me that they had everything I needed. Very upsetting news as the departure date for my 900 mile trip loomed on the horizon! I called Maximillian, and they had the parts on my porch in 48 hours! I couldnt have been more pleased! So try them all!

I had no trouble obtaining cap, rotor, wires, etc. for my E21 323i, btw.

[Baur]

Hi Jeff,

About the Parcel; you need (off course...) an early one. The newer parcel isn't an option in this case.

Till body-number B45214 (and out of the B44149, a 323i I took apart)

So you need a parcel out of a car build before 7'85!

And yes, you can convert one out of a normal saloon. Don't know if it is neccesary to have one out of a 2-door though.

Gr Jeroen

[BMWtyro]

Thanks for the info, Tom and Jeroen!

Jeroen, you have a PM.

Jeff

[tomscat1]

We have some exciting Baur news today over in the E21 forum: RonP (Vintage Motorsports Group, Duarte, CA), noted BMW restorer and modifier whose work has been featured in Bimmer Magazine (November 2011: "E21 Dinan 333i: Six into Three...and Charge! "We drive another fabulous Ron Perry restoration, this one a six-cylinder turbocharged E21 widebody built by Steve Dinan in 1980.") has just purchased an E21 Baur (The Beaufort Baur) that we have been following on Baurspotting from SC to LA and now to RonP.

RonP formerly owned the beautiful TC2 in the first two pics attached below. The last three pics are of the car featured in Bimmer magazine last year. Amazing stuff! Check it out!
http://www.bimmer-mag.com/issues/102

Much more info here, and much more to come! We can hardly wait to see what he does with this Baur!
http://baurspotting.blogspot.com/

Stay tuned!

[TomDC]

Hi guys,
I'm back from my Florida vacation and was happy to see no one took off with my baur!
I took it to BMWExcluservice in Rockville, md (Tomcat and Jeff both mentioned Lothar's shop so I thought I'd let them do an inspection). They told me what I pretty much knew already -- that is, without anyway of knowing for sure when timing belt and water pump were last changed, I should have that done. Good news is they did not think valve job was needed so soon. I think the car is running pretty strong too.

Tom-jeff: I may be ordering some basic parts too, as well as water pmp and timing belt. Have you guys ordered from Pelican before?

Jeroen: pls let me know if you do have spare parts for the 1st gen of tc2 top. My clips (those that are screwed into the hard top) are completely trashed on mine. I may call Max. Imports to see if they can find some of this even though it's NLA...

[BMWtyro]

Welcome back from vacation, TomDC. Your car couldn't be in better hands than those of Lothar Schuettler.

I have dealt with Pelican, ECS Tuning and GutenParts. Until a couple of days ago, I would have recommended GutenParts; I still would except that owner Levent sent me an e-mail informing me that his computer system had crashed and he didn't know how soon it would be running again . . . therefore he couldn't fill my most recent order.

He recommends ECS as the next-best choice, and I have indeed found that their prices are on average better than those of Pelican -- plus they are in relatively-near Ohio, not distant California.

By "clips" on the hardtop do you mean the two tabs which engage the windshield header, or the channel which engages the screw mechanism on the Targa bar . . . or something else altogether?

Jeff

[tomscat1]

Hi guys,
I'm back from my Florida vacation and was happy to see no one took off with my baur!
I took it to BMWExcluservice in Rockville, md (Tomcat and Jeff both mentioned Lothar's shop so I thought I'd let them do an inspection). They told me what I pretty much knew already -- that is, without anyway of knowing for sure when timing belt and water pump were last changed, I should have that done. Good news is they did not think valve job was needed so soon. I think the car is running pretty strong too.

Tom-jeff: I may be ordering some basic parts too, as well as water pmp and timing belt. Have you guys ordered from Pelican before?

Jeroen: pls let me know if you do have spare parts for the 1st gen of tc2 top. My clips (those that are screwed into the hard top) are completely trashed on mine. I may call Max. Imports to see if they can find some of this even though it's NLA...

Hi Tom, Welcome back!

http://baurspotting.blogspot.com/p/b...dfor-sale.html

http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E3...p_cabriolet-5/

Check the second link above for the part number you need. If it is not in the exploded diagram shown, scroll to the bottom of the page where you will find further links to other TC2 exploded diagrams, both before and after the page you are on. You can get the part numbers you need.

You can try Maximillian Importers (they are right there in MD), Walloth and Nesch in Germany, or.... you can even try your local BMW Dealer. Another bimmerforums member got a bunch of Baur specific TC parts thru his local dealer in Texas not long ago. Lothar Schuettler would be another source.... if anyone knows where to get those kinds of parts, HE will!

I have never ordered from Pelican, but I have used both Maximillian and Bav Auto up in NH. Maximillian came through for me in 48 hours last year with some brake parts that Bav Auto told me were back ordered and they couldn't even say WHEN they could get them. I am not sure how much stock Maximillian carries for the E30, however. (My Baur is an E21, of course.)

Let me know how you make out with those parts. There may be some used spares out there somewhere if they are indeed NLA.

See attached ad.... BMW has been making an effort to cater to some degree to these older cars.

Good luck,
Tom

[TomDC]

Thanks guys. Btw, I forgot to mention that while in Florida, my friend and I also took out his AC Cobra -- talk about a different animal...

As far as the parts I'm looking for, I'm Baur 42077 and have not been retrofitted with their 2nd generation. According to the S African parts diagram, I need part # 5 (both right and left) shown here:
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E3...p_cabriolet-7/
It appears to still be available! However, the actual part #s in S African diagram (54 21 0 006 351/352) are different from my Baur catalog (534 032 091 09). It's clearly listed as the same part and the same diagram is used...I will call Max. Importing.

Btw, I did speak with Lothar for a little bit. They charged me about an hour labor to go over the car and gave estimates on various things they think need to be done. Some things I can obviously do myself. Others I will probably be best served leaving to them --just a matter of prioritizing and budgeting...

Tom

[BMWtyro]

TomDC,

That forward top retention set-up shown in your link does look quite a bit different from my own; apparently my car was built prior to yours because the Baur number is B40560-43. Mine uses a central channel-and-screw mechanism at the rear, plus a strap with a snap on either side. It does use the same basic design with slots and tabs at the front.

Somebody please straighten me out if that number doesn't reflect that TomDC's car was converted about 150 units after mine, because I am not familiar with Baur's numbering system.

Oh, and after Jeroen confirmed that the parcel shelf on eBay was indeed the version that I needed, I went ahead and bought it just to avoid any needless hassles.

Jeff

[tomscat1]

TomDC,

That forward top retention set-up shown in your link does look quite a bit different from my own; apparently my car was built prior to yours because the Baur number is B40560-43. Mine uses a central channel-and-screw mechanism at the rear, plus a strap with a snap on either side. It does use the same basic design with slots and tabs at the front.

Somebody please straighten me out if that number doesn't reflect that TomDC's car was converted about 150 units after mine, because I am not familiar with Baur's numbering system.

Oh, and after Jeroen confirmed that the parcel shelf on eBay was indeed the version that I needed, I went ahead and bought it just to avoid any needless hassles.

Jeff

2077-0560 = 1517 units after yours, if my math is correct.

Your roof setup is completely different from mine on my E21 Baur, so I can only compare by the diagrams.

Jeroen may be able to advise on this, since he has TC2s, or perhaps an inquiry to Walloth and Nesch is needed. They have a catalogue for the E21 Baur, but I am not sure what they have for the E30 Baur.

[BMWtyro]

Tom,

Where did I get the idea that TomDC's car is a TC2? I don't suppose that it can be, built so much earlier than mine.

Oh, and did I fail to mention that I am "mathematically challenged" . . ?

Jeff

[tomscat1]

Thanks guys. Btw, I forgot to mention that while in Florida, my friend and I also took out his AC Cobra -- talk about a different animal...

As far as the parts I'm looking for, I'm Baur 42077 and have not been retrofitted with their 2nd generation. According to the S African parts diagram, I need part # 5 (both right and left) shown here:
http://bmwfans.info/parts/catalog/E3...p_cabriolet-7/
It appears to still be available! However, the actual part #s in S African diagram (54 21 0 006 351/352) are different from my Baur catalog (534 032 091 09). It's clearly listed as the same part and the same diagram is used...I will call Max. Importing.

Btw, I did speak with Lothar for a little bit. They charged me about an hour labor to go over the car and gave estimates on various things they think need to be done. Some things I can obviously do myself. Others I will probably be best served leaving to them --just a matter of prioritizing and budgeting...

Tom

Wait a moment... we have some confusion.

TomDC please post a pic of your Baur plate.

In the post above you refer to it as 42077.

In your post a couple of weeks ago, you listed the following:
"It is Baur no. 40277-15 and the car vin no is WBAAA7101D9146401. I think I mentioned already but it's 1983 323i (bronzit with brown tops)."

Transposing the "2" and the '0" in those two numbers. Which is the correct Baur plate number?

[TomDC]

Sorry for any confusion, I have Baur 40277 (not 42077)-- so, it's an early TC2 and has the first generation of hard top plate/ retention clips -- Baur 42265 and after have the second generation for tc2 tops. I recall Jeroen posted some photos earlier in this thread or on Tomcat's blog showing the difference.

Trust me, I'm still trying to find a way to post photos! It would make explaining a heck of alot easier!

Edit: I just ordered the parts I need from Max. Imports. I actually ordered 2 sets figuring they will break again...

I have to admit I find it very strange. Baur offered a retrofit (changing the system so you would not need the parts I just ordered). The retrofit is no longer available but I can still get my old parts...oh well...

[tomscat1]

Sorry for any confusion, I have Baur 40277 (not 42077)-- so, it's an early TC2 and has the first generation of hard top plate/ retention clips -- Baur 42265 and after have the second generation for tc2 tops. I recall Jeroen posted some photos earlier in this thread or on Tomcat's blog showing the difference.

Trust me, I'm still trying to find a way to post photos! It would make explaining a heck of alot easier!

Edit: I just ordered the parts I need from Max. Imports. I actually ordered 2 sets figuring they will break again...

I have to admit I find it very strange. Baur offered a retrofit (changing the system so you would not need the parts I just ordered). The retrofit is no longer available but I can still get my old parts...oh well...

Great, Tom! Also good to know that you can get the Baur parts thru Maximillian Importing! Do they have the parts readily available.... or are they coming from Germany?

Maximillian is right near you there in MD.



Check Baurs for sale:
http://baurspotting.blogspot.com/p/baurs-for-sale.html

[TomDC]

Parts are coming from Germany, I paid "express" shipping (supposed to arrive in US in one week). Actually me being in MD hurts -- I actually have to pay sales tax and they do not allow picking up in person!

Ok, I think I can now post photos -- thanks to Picasa.
Here I am on day of pickup -- not a great photo taken by random stranger...


Baur plate

[tomscat1]

Parts are coming from Germany, I paid "express" shipping (supposed to arrive in US in one week). Actually me being in MD hurts -- I actually have to pay sales tax and they do not allow picking up in person!

Ok, I think I can now post photos -- thanks to Picasa.
Here I am on day of pickup -- not a great photo taken by random stranger...


Baur plate

Hi TomDC,

I cant see any of those photos. Did you try loading them using the 'manage attachments" function located just below the "reply to thread' window?

[BMWtyro]

Ditto, TomDC.

You can also use the "attachment" button (paperclip icon in top toolbar) provided that each photo is 150KB or less. You can publish only five photos per post this way, however.

Jeff

[TomDC]

I tried linking to my Picasa photos... I thought that would work.

Anyhow, I just took a little "lunch break" from work and am quite happy I was able to fix my Baur top handle (the part you turn to raise/lower the hard top). Basically the handle part was not connected (see attached photo -- i lowered my camera's resolution!!) Using a very baur-specific tool (a hammer) and some brute strength, I was able to get back in decent working shape. (the internal plastic screw mechanism is still cracked but the handle functions ok)

I will try once more to post photos of car through picasa or will take more with my camera at the same low resolution.

[TomDC]

Some more photos...

Obvious good: it runs when warmed up, car is straight, bumpers in excellent condition, does not need valve job as seller's mechanic said should be done asap, baur tops in good shape and will be working just fine once i receive clip parts

Obvious bad: seats are shot (both mechanically and upholstery), runs rough starting up (air flow valve, cold start injector, spark plugs???), needs timing belt/water pump asap, leaking all kinds of stuff (transmission seals, oil pan gasket, camshaft seal, pwr steering hose), wiring is crazy under steering column

Not so bad: has scratches and minor rust, odometer is erratic, wiper relay needs a good kick every once in a whil

[tomscat1]

I tried linking to my Picasa photos... I thought that would work.

Anyhow, I just took a little "lunch break" from work and am quite happy I was able to fix my Baur top handle (the part you turn to raise/lower the hard top). Basically the handle part was not connected (see attached photo -- i lowered my camera's resolution!!) Using a very baur-specific tool (a hammer) and some brute strength, I was able to get back in decent working shape. (the internal plastic screw mechanism is still cracked but the handle functions ok)

I will try once more to post photos of car through picasa or will take more with my camera at the same low resolution.

Congrats on getting a pic posted and getting your handle functioning!

Another technique that I have used to get large pics posted in here..... I open the pic in Office Picture Manager, resize it so that it is smaller than 150kb, and resave it. Then I can post it in thumbnails, as above. Kind of a PITA, but it works.

Also, there are times that I can simply copy a pic from another site and paste it here in the body of the text (not as a thumbnail). Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't .... the exact process remains something of a magical mystery to me, but I will often give it a shot... and Voila! it works!
I will leave the explanation for that phenomenon to one of the technical geniuses in here who actually knows why this happens and can perhaps explain it to me. I'd love to know why it works, but, in the meantime, I am content to accept it as a little bit of magic, and a surprise gift. Or a reward for clean living.


OK, OK, forget that last bit. It ain't that.

[TomDC]

Hi guys,
Just thought I'd share with you that I'm adding to my order form Max. Imports -- I'm basically stocking up on parts that I think will be hard to find down the road. I asked to look into the "handle" -- it shows in realoem.com as "ended" but I'm hoping that they can somehow get their hands on one.

Also, I took another "lunch break" today and bought a nearly new Recaro driver's seat and put it in the Baur. I found this locally on craigslist and the guy already had the e30 bracket. It is a temporary "fix" as I plan to restore the interior.

Btw, does anyone have a rear baur hard top? the guy at max. imports said they had a couple in the warehouse but recently sold them. to be honest, i've never seen a photo of one on the car. can't imagine it looks as good as the hard top does on the e30 convertible.

[BMWtyro]

TomDC,

Glad you have been able to begin posting photos -- nice-looking Baur!

I see that yours has the same steering wheel as mine (see attachment). That wheel is Option Code S218A -- Sports Leather Steering Wheel II. Everyone to whom I show that photo says "I've never seen a wheel like that before!", but they can't be all that uncommon if both of our cars have one.

Perhaps most owners have simply changed their Sports Leather II wheel to something else more common because the leather became degraded. The leather on mine was literally in tatters when I bought it; I "solved" the problem by simply peeling off the remnants and cleaning the wheel, then treating it with 303 Aerospace Portectant. Now it is a Sports Rubberized Underlayment Steering Wheel II . . . but it looks so much better than it did when clad in deteriorated leather.

Looking at the photos of your top securing mechanism, I don't think that it is the same as mine. I'm quite certain that my attachment mechanism doesn't incorporate the two pins which appear to extend and retain the top.

Yesterday I thoroughly(?) cleaned Miss Opal’s engine compartment in preparation for performing the timing belt - sprocket - water pump - etc. job, and today I removed the hood and stowed it in the garage rafters. I am hoping to get some time tomorrow to tackle the disassembly.

So: how come you can post photos which measure 640 x 480, and I am limited to around 386 x 290? I see that mine are at 100% and yours are at 91%, but yours display at least a third again larger; I can't (or simply don't know how to) achieve that effect. How do you do it?

Jeff

[Sammy7]

Btw, does anyone have a rear baur hard top? the guy at max. imports said they had a couple in the warehouse but recently sold them. to be honest, i've never seen a photo of one on the car. can't imagine it looks as good as the hard top does on the e30 convertible.

I believe Jeroen has one. I'm a little curious about them as well. If you find a guy that has two, let me know. We could save on shipping.

[Baur]

Hi Jeff and Tom,

The 218 steering wheel was only used in 1983 cars. And that's why they are quite rare (these days).

Here some pics of the hardtop

After picking up


Mounted on the B47095:


And on the B47172



Only 195 hardtops where made.

Gr Jeroen

[BMWtyro]

Jeroen,

Thanks for the clarification regarding the 218 steering wheel. Do you know of anyone who recovers these rare wheels at a reasonable price? The one steering wheel restorer to whom I showed it was scared of fitting new leather to its unique contours.

Or is there a way to remove that vinyl section at the bottom so that I might at least sew on a generic leather cover myself? It doesn't look bad as-is, but when that rubberized underlayment begins to wear out from the stresses associated with non-power steering, whatever will I do then?

The rear hardtops look great and I am sure that they add weather protection for hash climates, but it would seem that in nice weather they would limit the Baur owner to exclusive removal of the front hard top. I'm pretty sure that they can't be stored in the trunk along with the front section.

Jeff