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Thread: Oil consumption after CCV replacement

  1. #376
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    I don't know where that sensor measurement is coming from, and having to guess about what's actually measuring makes it worthless right now. Get a spare oil filler cap, drill it and add a brass nipple, connect a vacuum gauge, and get a reading in inches of mercury. If you use a long enough hose you can prop the gauge up so you can see it while driving (that's what I did).

    Go back and read post #74. I've got my crankcase vacuum numbers in there. Are they really high compared to stock? Yep. But I ran the car out to 200k miles with that much vacuum being pulled and had zero problems related to it. The car is now with a friend of mine - we'll see how far it can go, but I have no doubt that the high crankcase vacuum is a non-issue.





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  2. #377
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    +1.

    Your device is reading a number which does not exist, on your car. You do not have a forced induction engine, and therefore you do not have "Boost", and the OBD reader device is making stuff up, all by itself. Of course, those numbers are nonsense. Just to emphasize the point, your car has absolutely no way to read crankcase vacuum, and no way to read Manifold Absolute Pressure.

    Every regular at this forum knows that I strongly discourage the vast majority of common alterations to the factory systems....like "cold air kits", and clutch fan deletes, and aftermarket alarms, and huge stereos....because these items typically cause big problems.

    However, the mod described in this thread is incredibly simple, and successfully addresses an issue which many owners have had with this engine. In these sixteen pages, we have extensive documentation, and dozens of happy owners who have proven this simple mod to work beautifully, with zero negative effects.

    If, therefore, one owns an M54 or M52TU2 which is consuming inordinate amounts of oil, after a smoke test and after replacement of the CCV system, and cleaning or replacement of the dipstick tube, I wholeheartedly recommend either following this easy mod, or going through the much more extensive mods necessary to create a properly plumbed catch can system.

    As an addendum, we should also note that MANY other manufacturers seem to have the same issue: Mercedes says 1 liter every 1000 km is okay..... (and VW says you can burn as much as you want as long as the EPA can't prove it.... )

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
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    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  3. #378
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    Oil consumption has been reduced dramatically. Before the mod, I was putting in a quart a week, and I'm still not seeing a drop in level. Thank you 02pilot.

  4. #379
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    Quote Originally Posted by 530e39 View Post
    Oil consumption has been reduced dramatically. Before the mod, I was putting in a quart a week, and I'm still not seeing a drop in level. Thank you 02pilot.
    Glad it's working out.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
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  5. #380
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Pilot View Post
    I don't know where that sensor measurement is coming from, and having to guess about what's actually measuring makes it worthless right now. Get a spare oil filler cap, drill it and add a brass nipple, connect a vacuum gauge, and get a reading in inches of mercury. If you use a long enough hose you can prop the gauge up so you can see it while driving (that's what I did).

    Go back and read post #74. I've got my crankcase vacuum numbers in there. Are they really high compared to stock? Yep. But I ran the car out to 200k miles with that much vacuum being pulled and had zero problems related to it. The car is now with a friend of mine - we'll see how far it can go, but I have no doubt that the high crankcase vacuum is a non-issue.
    I did the spare oil filler cap vacuum gauge and checked the crankcase vacuum. It is right around 0, maybe a little less, in inches of Hg. I found out that this value is pretty correct to stock, or else I have a leak somewhere. I guess we'll find out lol...

    Quote Originally Posted by bmwdirtracer View Post
    +1.

    Your device is reading a number which does not exist, on your car. You do not have a forced induction engine, and therefore you do not have "Boost", and the OBD reader device is making stuff up, all by itself. Of course, those numbers are nonsense. Just to emphasize the point, your car has absolutely no way to read crankcase vacuum, and no way to read Manifold Absolute Pressure.
    That is interesting, because OBDLink does have a Manifold Absolute Pressure gauge, which reads the same value when I check it against my analog vacuum gauge, around 15 inHg at idle.

    I also figured out that in OBDLink the boost is calculated by taking the difference between the manifold pressure and the barometric pressure. So if the MAP reading above is correct, then boost is simply MAP-baro, and it is displayed even on a naturally aspirated car, even though it doesn't mean much.
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  6. #381
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    Quote Originally Posted by cngzsn View Post
    I did the spare oil filler cap vacuum gauge and checked the crankcase vacuum. It is right around 0, maybe a little less, in inches of Hg. I found out that this value is pretty correct to stock, or else I have a leak somewhere. I guess we'll find out lol...
    So you've got stock levels of vacuum in the crankcase with the mod in place? There are a few possibilities: 1) you have a massive vacuum leak in the crankcase; 2) the mod is not hooked up correctly; 3) one of the ports is obstructed; 4) the vacuum gauge is defective. There's essentially no way you could be introducing post-throttle intake vacuum and not see it affecting the crankcase vacuum at all unless there's a major leak. Check that the ports are clear with a probe; if they are, a smoke test is in order.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
    -John Wayne

  7. #382
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Pilot View Post
    So you've got stock levels of vacuum in the crankcase with the mod in place? There are a few possibilities: 1) you have a massive vacuum leak in the crankcase; 2) the mod is not hooked up correctly; 3) one of the ports is obstructed; 4) the vacuum gauge is defective. There's essentially no way you could be introducing post-throttle intake vacuum and not see it affecting the crankcase vacuum at all unless there's a major leak. Check that the ports are clear with a probe; if they are, a smoke test is in order.
    Regarding 2 and 4, I had the intake out and the mod was installed along with a new CCV system. Pretty sure the I hooked it up correctly. I also get a reading on the vacuum gauge easily by sucking on the nipple.

    I don't know how one of the ports may be obstructed. I pulled the cap out of one of the small ones, didn't notice anything unusual. It is possible that this port may have been blocked from the factory, but then why use a cap also? I think there is another user who did this mod on his ZHP, and I'd love to hear from him about his crankcase vacuum measurement.

    I think vacuum leak is the most likely cause why I'm getting a stock reading. I don't see any oil leaks from above, but my oil pan gasket needs replacing. I rarely see an oil drop making it's way down, but maybe the leak is big enough to alter the vacuum substantially.

    I don't have any plans of replacing my oil pan gasket soon, but I will report back when I do. Thanks for the input!
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  8. #383
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    Crankcase vacuum leaks do not necessary cause oil leaks. You could easily have huge amounts of air entering through the dipstick guide tube o-ring for example. A smoke test is the only way to know for sure.

    Also, hook your vacuum gauge up to the intake manifold directly and see what it reads at idle. If you get a proper reading there, you know the gauge is good and that something is preventing the effective transfer of that vacuum to the crankcase.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
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  9. #384
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    Quote Originally Posted by cngzsn View Post
    I did the spare oil filler cap vacuum gauge and checked the crankcase vacuum. It is right around 0, maybe a little less, in inches of Hg. I found out that this value is pretty correct to stock, or else I have a leak somewhere. I guess we'll find out lol...



    That is interesting, because OBDLink does have a Manifold Absolute Pressure gauge, which reads the same value when I check it against my analog vacuum gauge, around 15 inHg at idle.

    I also figured out that in OBDLink the boost is calculated by taking the difference between the manifold pressure and the barometric pressure. So if the MAP reading above is correct, then boost is simply MAP-baro, and it is displayed even on a naturally aspirated car, even though it doesn't mean much.
    But an E46 has an M54 engine, which has no MAP sensor, only a MAF. And 15 in/Hg over 1 bar doesn't give a boost figure anyway, even if the computer did have a way to read MAP.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  10. #385
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    I'm working on this one right now, on an M54B30 that occasionally dumped oil out the tailpipe...
    It's new to me, so I have no idea of its history at 140k miles, other than it had a gauze air filter in the LF wheel well.
    And a no- name ccv that was incorrectly assembled.

    I DO wonder why BMW chose to connect liquid oil, in the dipstick tube, directly to the separator. It seems as though either an air break
    or a 1- way valve (people have added these later) would have been a pretty inexpensive way to absolutely prevent a hydrolock.
    And dramatically reduce the effects of a ccv malfunction.

    At any rate, as I'm doing the whole cool side cleanup (hoses, boots, ofh gasket, valve cover, ccv, etc) I'm plumbing for the mod,
    and if the new ccv by itself doesn't help, hook it up and see. I didn't think to measure vacuum beforehand, but I will, after.

    Thanks for all the patience, documentation, and help!

    t
    Last edited by Toby B; 08-24-2017 at 02:22 AM.

  11. #386
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    Hello, late to the party here.

    Car is an '02 325xi with about 100kmiles. Around town gas mileage is 15.8 mpg, pretty poor, although the car runs fine and AC works. BTW it's my daughter's DD. Code suggests a bad CCV so I bought the kit and got as far as pulling the oil dipstick tube, and cleaning it. Took me a while to realize that the oil return pathway was concentric at the bottom. Then, it being hot out, I came in for lunch and a little research.

    I get that increasing ccase vacuum is supposed to help with oil consumption, a problem that I don't (knock wood) have at this point. My main (though perhaps not only) problem is a plugged oil dipstick tube. It's soaking in carb cleaner now and I have a small compressor to blow it out, or try. The oil tube is dead plugged and I've been at it with the wire and solvent to no avail.

    First thing I found was that a new improved dipstick tube will cost about $100- shipping is high because of my location. Local dealer could bring it in a week for $178, but I think online ordering will do better, although to be sure I'll have to wait until Monday to confirm my vendor ACTUALLY has the updated dipstick tube in stock.

    Meantime, I have scanned the posts and gotten lost in the length and OT stuff. Can someone point to where the mod is described explicit terms? I can try that while waiting for my next $100 to go out the window.
    Charlie

    Your mission, should you decide to accept it, is to add value to these threads, either by pictures or by descriptions, so the next person with the same or similar problem stands on your shoulders.

  12. #387
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    The mod is described in post #74, but let me be very clear: you must understand exactly how the mod is going to affect the system before doing it; failure to do so may mean overlooking some important aspect that can have significant negative effects.

    That said, the extremely poor fuel economy makes me think you may have significant vacuum leaks. That, plus the condition of the dipstick guide tube, suggests strongly that you have a smoke test done on the engine before applying the mod. As described earlier in the thread, crankcase vacuum leaks combined with the mod could lead to significantly increased oil consumption.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
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  13. #388
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    +1. Start with a smoke test. Before modifying anything, you need to make sure that the system is in correct working order. For the smoke test and other work you can't do for yourself, I highly recommend A&A Autowerkes: http://www.aandamotorwerkes.repair.bz/

    To the best of my knowledge, there is no code that indicates a failed CCV system, except for fuel/air mixture codes, which also point to MANY other possibilities. Certainly, if your dipstick tube oil return is clogged, the CCV can't work.

    The mod described is really only for those who have an oil consumption issue. The stock system works just fine, on the vast majority of M54's, if all components are in good shape.

    You might want to try putting the bottom part of your dipstick tube in boiling water for a while.....

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  14. #389
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    Yes, I would forget the mod, as you state that you have no oil consumption problems.
    Concentrate on replacing the CCV valve as a kit, with all the associated hoses,
    then have a smoke test performed to make sure no other intake leaks exist.

  15. #390
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    I experienced increased oil consumption after replacing the ccv, and fixing vacuum leaks didn't change much, until the vacuum line mod.

  16. #391
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    Add me to the list of M54-powered car owners who have eliminated oil consumption using a couple of feet of vacuum hose.
    I bought an '03 525i about six months ago. It was three quarts low when I met the owner to look at it, and I told him I wasn't going to drive it like that. I had a quart in my own car, poured it it, and still saw nothing on the dipstick. Long story short, I got the car for a good price and drove it home. It had a number of issues related to deferred maintenance. I replaced all of the usual suspects (CCV, valve cover, DISA and dipstick O-rings, etc.), solved all of the issues that were causing recurring codes, etc. The car ran great, but then I noticed I was losing a half quart of oil in around 200 miles. My '97 528i used NO oil at all (up until the day the head cracked), so I did some googling and found this link.
    I'm at over 400 miles on the fix now and the level of oil on the dipstick has not dropped at all.

    It bugs me that the engine is in such a state though. I figured I find a core engine and rebuild it as I had the M52 in my '97. But I wound up with a very clean and low-miles M54 that I plan to swap in sometime soon. I'll dissect the M54 that's in the car now to see what I can see.

  17. #392
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    Glad to see this is still helping people reduce the M54's thirst for oil. FWIW, even though I sold my E39 525i last year, it went to a friend who's taken it well past the 200k miles I sold it with, and the oil consumption is still near zero. That's somewhere north of 50k miles of (enthusiastic) driving with the mod in place with no apparent ill effects.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
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  18. #393
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    Wow. Very interesting and informative thread indeed, although I still haven't read all the pages. I think this should be "parked"as it will be useful to a lot of people out there.
    "If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters." Alan K. Simpson.
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  19. #394
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breeze1 View Post
    Wow. Very interesting and informative thread indeed, although I still haven't read all the pages. I think this should be "parked"as it will be useful to a lot of people out there.
    Good suggestion. Added to this parked post.
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  20. #395
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    Dear fellow bmw owners,

    I own for a year now a E90 325i (2497 cmc ) 218 hp.
    After much troubleshooting with my oil consumption issues since when I bought the car, I changed the PCV valve and also I'm using 5w40 Motul BMW-LL04.
    Still after changing the PCV valve, I'm still encountering oil consumption like 1000 km on 1 L of oil which seems to me a bit too much.
    Sometimes on hot starts, the tailpipe immediately smokes white smoke upon startup.

    I revised the 02Pilot mod for the M54 engine but can't find anything on the N52B25 engine and if someone did the mod already.

    Can someone with a similar engine help out?

    Thank you in advance!

  21. #396
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    Totally different setup. While the theory holds - the mod balances vacuum between the crankcase and cylinders - I have no idea if it will work on the N5x motors. Truth be told, I haven't even looked at how the PCV/CCV is setup on the later engines.

    White smoke isn't oil. It's likely steam, which leads me to believe you may have a blown head gasket. Time for diagnostics: cooling system pressure test and leakdown tests on the cylinders. Have you inspected the oil? Since there's no dipstick (thanks for nothing, BMW) open up the filter housing and look.





    Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid.
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  22. #397
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    Quote Originally Posted by 02Pilot View Post
    Totally different setup. While the theory holds - the mod balances vacuum between the crankcase and cylinders - I have no idea if it will work on the N5x motors. Truth be told, I haven't even looked at how the PCV/CCV is setup on the later engines.

    White smoke isn't oil. It's likely steam, which leads me to believe you may have a blown head gasket. Time for diagnostics: cooling system pressure test and leakdown tests on the cylinders. Have you inspected the oil? Since there's no dipstick (thanks for nothing, BMW) open up the filter housing and look.
    I will then schedule a mechanic and do the diagnostics.

    I was really hoping for the mod to work out also on my car because it's really driving me crazy.


    This is how the new PCV looks like on my car:


    Thank you for the support!

  23. #398
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    Hi, I just registered because I wanted to provide some additional input regarding to the CCV vacuum mod. Just another E46 325i but in mint condition, consuming about 1l/1000km ~ 630mls. 250k kilometers / 155k miles on the odo. Absolutely no blue smoke apart from some occasional white smoke from condensation.

    That is just too much when the car is daily driven, especially when you rev it harder.

    I was too sceptical about the mod, just one vacuum hose and no consumption? Of course I decided to try it, as I had nothing to lose. I had to remove the cabin filter, air filter and both intake boots, the DISA valve and a couple of screws holding the electrical junction box, just to move it a little out of the way. I managed to remove the cap from the CCV valve with my fingers and I attached a 3.2mm ID hose to the CCV valve. At the rear of the manifold it was a bit tighter, because my car has a LPG system and the additional water hoses are routed over the spare vacuum. On my specific car the both the 3.5 and 7mm were free but I decided to use the bigger one. Here I attached another hose and connected it to the one from the CCV together, as they fit perfectly one into each other. Assembled everything back together and measured the oil by the dipstick. It was on the minimum mark, but no yellow oil light. Drove it very hard this evening and no oil lights and the dipstick still shows the same. I still wasn't fully convinced but when I heard the huge swoosh when removing the oil cap or dipstick after turning the car off, I knew there was something going on.

    I will top up the oil to the full mark and after a couple thousand kilometers I will update this thread.

  24. #399
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    Just bumping this immensely useful thread.

    Chris Powell
    Racer and Instructor since, well. decades, ok?
    Master Auto Tech, owner of German Motors of Aberdeen
    BMWCCA 274412
    German Motors is hiring ! https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/s...1#post30831471

  25. #400
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    Quote Originally Posted by alentje View Post
    Hi, I just registered because I wanted to provide some additional input regarding to the CCV vacuum mod. Just another E46 325i but in mint condition, consuming about 1l/1000km ~ 630mls. 250k kilometers / 155k miles on the odo. Absolutely no blue smoke apart from some occasional white smoke from condensation.

    That is just too much when the car is daily driven, especially when you rev it harder.

    I was too sceptical about the mod, just one vacuum hose and no consumption? Of course I decided to try it, as I had nothing to lose. I had to remove the cabin filter, air filter and both intake boots, the DISA valve and a couple of screws holding the electrical junction box, just to move it a little out of the way. I managed to remove the cap from the CCV valve with my fingers and I attached a 3.2mm ID hose to the CCV valve. At the rear of the manifold it was a bit tighter, because my car has a LPG system and the additional water hoses are routed over the spare vacuum. On my specific car the both the 3.5 and 7mm were free but I decided to use the bigger one. Here I attached another hose and connected it to the one from the CCV together, as they fit perfectly one into each other. Assembled everything back together and measured the oil by the dipstick. It was on the minimum mark, but no yellow oil light. Drove it very hard this evening and no oil lights and the dipstick still shows the same. I still wasn't fully convinced but when I heard the huge swoosh when removing the oil cap or dipstick after turning the car off, I knew there was something going on.

    I will top up the oil to the full mark and after a couple thousand kilometers I will update this thread.
    I'm back again after almost 4 months. It seems like the oil consumption has dropped, instead of the 1l/1000km it's now more like 0.5l/1000. The big swoosh when opening the oil cap is not as strong as it used to be, but it's still here. Next thing I was thinking about is replacing the CCV valve and all the hoses. The one going to the valve cover is really dirty on the inside and is probably clogged. As it gets pretty cold here I'm not sure if replacing the CCV is a great idea as it will most likely fail again. Catch can is not really convenient for me because it will need draining every so often.

    Maybe the best option will be to replace the entire CCV with all the hoses and remove and clean the dipstick drain, and apply the 02pilot mod.

    After my research I still don't entirely understand why BMW designed the CCV like this. The membrane seems to be designed to limit vacuum to a pre-calibrated value which is little, or only when there is little manifold vacuum, and to to try to stop the oil vapors going into the intake. What we are doing here is applying full vacuum to the port which is located under the membrane, basically bypassing the membrane entirely. Vacuum is drawn from the valve cover and the oil should be separated and drained back to the dipstick. What I find here in my vacuum hose is some oil, which of course goes into the intake, which is not good.

    Now I am wondering if a new CCV will do anything good with this mod because we are basically avoiding the membrane that usually fails so it doesn't really have any use.

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