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Thread: E32 Suspension Thread

  1. #76
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    I paid $130 for the pair, but that was also 5 years ago.

    AKG's' website says:

    Product Description

    Bump Steer Correction / Strut Spacers
    For BMW E34 (5-series, M5) and E32 (7-series)
    Available in either 1/2 inch (13mm) or 1 inch (25mm) thickness
    Set of two, plus hardware

    https://www.akgmotorsport.com/produc...eries-12-inch/
    Last edited by gregeast; 03-19-2018 at 11:30 PM.
    '93 740i - Mine
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  2. #77
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    Wow, not sure how I missed that, yes i see it’s for a pair. Still seems expensive!
    thanks!

  3. #78
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    '88 750iL, '01 530iT
    Before and after pictures of my 1988 750iL. I went for the Bavauto LAD delete kit, Bilstien B6 dampers and Pedders springs.

    Before with stock LAD/SLS suspension.
    IMG_1161a.jpg

    After
    IMG_21143a.jpg
    After with the same wheels as before
    IMG_8457a.jpg
    Last edited by Zej; 03-23-2018 at 08:36 AM.
    1988 E32 BMW 750iL Bronzitbeige "....4372381"
    2001 E39 BMW 530i Sport touring Cosmosschwarz "....GL80561"

  4. #79
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    1993 740i
    Pretty car, well done sir!
    '93 740i - Mine
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    '08 Land Rover LR2 - Hers
    '96 328i - Son's
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    '74 Alfa Romeo Spider - Italian Mistress
    Northern Colorado, USA


  5. #80
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    So back to the spacer plates..I have asked the folks at the Tire Rack and others on the internet and can't seem to be able to get anyone to talk about geometry being impaired with lowering on H&Rs..I am getting 17"x8" Style 5s for my 740i and will likely jump in head first with these lowering springs (1-1/4" and 1" according to H&R) which is perfect for me, and stock style Koni struts.

    I am a bit worried that the increased weight and mass of the tires/wheels and lowering too will cause some serious lack of longevity in control arm bushings. I don't really drive aggressively with the car. Will that help? Am I worrying over nothing?
    Brian A Silverton, OR

    '85 Euro 635CSi 5 speed conversion
    '87 L7
    '93 Euro M5 3.8
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    '94 850CSi #31
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  6. #81
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    Hey M60Power,
    Don't trash the LAD shocks if they are not leaking. I may be interested in finding another set plus all the associated plumbing from the accumulators.
    PM me if you wish.
    --Ken
    Last edited by Sansouci; 04-09-2018 at 10:25 PM.

  7. #82
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    Maybe im wrong, but my opinion after investigation is that it is more or less an issue of personal preference. If you are anal about smooth buttery ride with no bump steer, then you may want the plates. If you’re ok sacrificing ride quality for appearance/sport, then save the money.

    Quote Originally Posted by MMMEAT View Post
    So back to the spacer plates..I have asked the folks at the Tire Rack and others on the internet and can't seem to be able to get anyone to talk about geometry being impaired with lowering on H&Rs..I am getting 17"x8" Style 5s for my 740i and will likely jump in head first with these lowering springs (1-1/4" and 1" according to H&R) which is perfect for me, and stock style Koni struts.

    I am a bit worried that the increased weight and mass of the tires/wheels and lowering too will cause some serious lack of longevity in control arm bushings. I don't really drive aggressively with the car. Will that help? Am I worrying over nothing?

  8. #83
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    For record, using the bump steer plates has no impact on how much the car is lowered/appearance.

    Sounds like you want/need to save some money (since adding the plates is essentially a "while you're in there" job if you're doing the springs, which is fine, it's your money and your backside.

    Anxious to hear how it all turns out for you!
    '93 740i - Mine
    '13 Range Rover Sport - Hers
    '08 Land Rover LR2 - Hers
    '96 328i - Son's
    '97 328ic - Daughter's
    '87 944 Turbo - Mistress
    '74 Alfa Romeo Spider - Italian Mistress
    Northern Colorado, USA


  9. #84
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    87 325is,91 318is,R53MCS
    I am in the process of installing springs and shocks (H&R with Koni yellow) but found my dust shields to be nearly disintegrated. What was on my car is not what real oem is giving me.
    1988 735i real oem says 31331134314
    but the part on my car looks more like 31322226190
    Does it really matter? I know the first one looks to be shorter (and a lot cheaper) but does it matter anyway?
    Any guidance would be appreciated.

  10. #85
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    E24, E32, E34
    I'm using Bilstein B4 and AP Fahrwerke springs.

    I like it a lot!



  11. #86
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    11/88 E32 750iL+98 E36M3
    mjimport,
    the first of your numbers 31331134314 looks like this https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...h/31331134314/
    the second one 31322226190 https://www.ecstuning.com/b-genuine-...t/31322226190/
    if the second one fits, use that, I also use a similar one, not like the sleeve type 31331134314
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  12. #87
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    Thanks! I’ve been so busy lately, I asked my wife to order parts and she ended up ordering both parts. I guess I’ll have a choice now when they arrive tomorrow.
    Now I need to find a shop to replace the shock insert, then an alignment and hope it was all done right before driving 700 miles to the Vintage!

  13. #88
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    So I had a shop install the new shocks and I’m glad i didn’t do it myself. Apparently it was a huge PITA with the adjustable konis but they only charged $240 for the two assemblies.

    The problem now is that the spacer plates from AKG are not well designed/produced. I had to file it down to get it to mate up and the bolt holes don’t align for me to assemble the knuckle.

    looks like i will have to live with bump steer cuz these AKG plates suck and I’m running out of time.

    Edit: Ok, so after 3 hours or so i eventually modified the aluminum AKG plates to the point where i could manage the process of assembly. For those researching, be aware you’ll need to elongate at least one hole, as well as dremel/file the machined channel to get this to work. Even then it’s a pain to get everything aligned after hyperextending the lower control arms downward.
    Rant over!
    Last edited by mjimport; 05-10-2018 at 01:58 PM.

  14. #89
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    Bumping this thread for an update. In my previous posts I said I'd be going with ground control coilovers for a 'sport' suspension on my e32; at first I had contacted them asking if they could just make a front coilover set so I could keep the rear LAD suspension. Ground Control will make a coilover system for the e32 (to the spring rates and shocks of your liking) but they would only make a matched set for both front and rear (which makes sense).

    I was at at the point of discussing the specific spring rates, but I've since decided that I don't want to get rid of a perfectly functioning LAD/SLS system that doesn't have any leaks, corrosion, or sagging. I really like the dynamic adjust-ability of it.

    With that in mind I think I'm going to go down the path of lowering springs, probably KONI shocks, and also replacing all the wear items like bump stops, upper strut mounts, spring pads, etc. Unfortunately replacing all these items really isn't that much cheaper than a full bolt-in strut assembly with camber plates from Ground control, but I like the idea of retaining the stock self leveling suspension.

    From what I can remember off the top of my head H&R is the only lowering spring option for the e32 with SLS suspension? Is that correct? There are a few pictures in this thread of forum members with the H&R setup and the ride height is pretty much what I'm looking for.

    ThiagoR posted a picture of 'AP Fahrwerke' springs; haven't heard of those but the ride height looks awesome!

    e30luv318i - I've seen a few of your posts detailing your swap to e24 M6 front springs. That looks like a great option too.

    For those of you with the H&R springs and SLS, how is the ride quality? Is it firm without being too harsh or 'crashy'? How much did they lower the front end? H&R quotes ~1.25" for the fronts.

    I also have a set of the AKG 1" strut spacers to install with whichever lowering springs I end up choosing. I see that some folks have had trouble getting them to align correctly. Hopefully they don't give me too many issues.
    Last edited by m60power; 04-15-2020 at 09:55 PM.

  15. #90
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    ap Sportfahrwerke is a German company which exists since about 20 years, here is their website https://www.ap-sportsuspensions.com/ checked a bit in the German forums, generally positive comments
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  16. #91
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    I ended up ordering the H&R sport springs p/n 29656-2 (version w/ self leveling suspension). It'll probably be some time before I actually install them because I still have things to complete on my 6-speed swap before getting to the suspension bits. But nevertheless I will eventually update this thread once I dive into it!

  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by m60power View Post
    I ended up ordering the H&R sport springs p/n 29656-2 (version w/ self leveling suspension). It'll probably be some time before I actually install them because I still have things to complete on my 6-speed swap before getting to the suspension bits. But nevertheless I will eventually update this thread once I dive into it!
    Where did you source the H&R springs from? It looks like ECS Tuning might have the best price. I see some yellow ones on ECS and elsewhere (eBay, Amazon, etc.) they are all blue? Is there is difference or is yellow just the new E32 spring color?

  18. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smoky540i View Post
    Where did you source the H&R springs from? It looks like ECS Tuning might have the best price. I see some yellow ones on ECS and elsewhere (eBay, Amazon, etc.) they are all blue? Is there is difference or is yellow just the new E32 spring color?
    I ordered the H&R springs from Turner Motorsport (Turner are owned by ECS Tuning). The springs are yellow, but I don't know if H&R makes them in other colors. I've seen stock photos that show them in blue or black. Maybe that's just the latest color?

  19. #94
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    maybe you ask H&R USA, toll free phone is shown here http://www.hrsprings.com/contact
    Shogun tricks and tips for the E32 series are HERE!

  20. #95
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    Some more info that might help others - I haven't installed the H&R springs yet, but I removed one of my rear LAD struts because an LAD module seals catastrophically failed and emptied the whole Pentosin reservoir in a few minutes. I will be making another thread about fixing that strut.

    Anyway, I had a chance today to take measurements on both the stock rear spring and the H&R rear spring to calculate the spring rates. The stock springs are 230 lbs/in and the H&R springs are 267 lbs/in, for a 16% increase in stiffness over stock. The two springs have the same overall height, but the H&R spring has more coils, a very slightly larger outer diameter, and a larger wire diameter.

    Don't take the spring rate numbers as absolute, only for comparative purposes between stock and H&R, as my measurement methods for spring diameter, coil diameter, and my judgement of "active" coils may not be consistent to how others determined these values. I used a shear modulus value of 11,400,000 psi for my calculations.
    Last edited by m60power; 07-11-2020 at 10:35 PM.

  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by m60power View Post
    Some more info that might help others - I haven't installed the H&R springs yet, but I removed one of my rear LAD struts because an LAD module seals catastrophically failed and emptied the whole Pentosin reservoir in a few minutes. I will be making another thread about fixing that strut.

    Anyway, I had a chance today to take measurements on both the stock rear spring and the H&R rear spring to calculate the spring rates. The stock springs are 230 lbs/in and the H&R springs are 267 lbs/in, for a 16% increase in stiffness over stock. The two springs have the same overall height, but the H&R spring has more coils, a very slightly larger outer diameter, and a larger wire diameter.

    Don't take the spring rate numbers as absolute, only for comparative purposes between stock and H&R, as my measurement methods for spring diameter, coil diameter, and my judgement of "active" coils may not be consistent to how others determined these values. I used a shear modulus value of 11,400,000 psi for my calculations.
    Just curious -- when do you plan on installing the H&R springs? I'm interested in going this route with OEM dampeners, but just worried that even 16% may be too harsh. Plan on keeping factory 225/60R15, so I don't think it should be too perceptible?

    I've just gone down the rabbit hole of car modifications before, and want to be very careful about modding this one. It's hard (and not accurate) to compare mod parts to shot and 20, 30 year old OEM. I want to keep the car as stock as possible, but make "light touches" to add better characteristics/aesthetics without losing much original feeling

    1989 BMW 750iL (prod 08/88) (vin: 2768675)
    Gone but not forgotten: 1994 BMW 740iL (prod 10/11/1993) (vin: *DE89667) 6spd swap, 2001 BMW 740i Sport

  22. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulmer View Post
    Just curious -- when do you plan on installing the H&R springs? I'm interested in going this route with OEM dampeners, but just worried that even 16% may be too harsh. Plan on keeping factory 225/60R15, so I don't think it should be too perceptible?

    I've just gone down the rabbit hole of car modifications before, and want to be very careful about modding this one. It's hard (and not accurate) to compare mod parts to shot and 20, 30 year old OEM. I want to keep the car as stock as possible, but make "light touches" to add better characteristics/aesthetics without losing much original feeling
    It might be some time until I can get them installed and the car back on the road. I need to fix the failed rear LAD strut and I'm waiting on a bunch of the ancillary parts I ordered, like rear nitrogen accumulators, bumps stops, strut mounts, spring pads, etc.

    I understand trying to keep the OEM 'feel' when doing modifications. That is my mindset as well for my E32, so I'm always worried about over doing it. I want to keep the noises/rattles/harshness to a minimum, otherwise the car is just not as enjoyable. This is one of the reasons I dropped the plan to go with Ground Control coilovers. I know they are great and all but might stray too far from the character of the E32. My first mistake on modifications was installing a single mass flywheel. In hindsight I would not do that again. I have worries the H&R springs will not be smooth enough (because they can be harsh for the E34 specific applications), but figured I'd give them a try. The E32-specific H&R sport springs are claimed to be a much smaller increase in stiffness than the E34 versions. I'm also considering trying to hunt down the factory M-technic e32 front and rear sway bars for a slight OEM+ sportiness without making the chassis too firm.

    Edit: An excellent upgrade for the front end suspension components that I've personally done on my other E32 is to use the 850csi lower control arms with the spherical bearing inboard bushing. These do not increase harshness in any way that I could tell. They are tight and smooth. I haven't settled on a perfect solution for the upper thrust arm bushings yet. I really like the well damped compliance of the stock bushings but hate that they start to noticeably wear out in 20,000 miles. I'm considering the Mooseheads (and other spherical bearing options too), but I worry they will be too harsh on things like highway expansion joints and other road imperfections that are perpendicular to the direction of travel.
    Last edited by m60power; 07-13-2020 at 09:03 PM.

  23. #98
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    moroza is offline MORΩN ΛABIA BMW CCA Member
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    Sorry if I missed it somewhere, but can you post your measurements of the H&R springs (and any others you have handy)?

    Is this your first lightweight flywheel? Before you write it off as a huge mistake, consider that it simply wasn't done correctly - you need to use a sprung clutch disk with a solid flywheel. Yes, even then there'll still be some noise, but nowhere near what your zero-give setup has. I had a UUC E31 conversion flywheel and OE E31 clutch, and while there was some minor noise here and there, it wasn't bad, and well worth the awesome response and direct feel. Transformed the car, woke it up, one of the best mods I ever did.

    Quote Originally Posted by paulmer View Post
    I've just gone down the rabbit hole of car modifications before, and want to be very careful about modding this one. It's hard (and not accurate) to compare mod parts to shot and 20, 30 year old OEM. I want to keep the car as stock as possible, but make "light touches" to add better characteristics/aesthetics without losing much original feeling
    Quote Originally Posted by m60power View Post
    I understand trying to keep the OEM 'feel' when doing modifications. That is my mindset as well for my E32, so I'm always worried about over doing it. I want to keep the noises/rattles/harshness to a minimum, otherwise the car is just not as enjoyable.
    This. Compared to a coilovered, pillowballed, DOT-R-wearing firebreather, my car (on a recently rebuilt OE suspension) would never keep up on a track, but is no less fun to drive (and a damn sight more comfortable), and isn't that the point, what makes it enjoyable?
    Last edited by moroza; 07-15-2020 at 08:02 PM.

  24. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by moroza View Post
    Sorry if I missed it somewhere, but can you post your measurements of the H&R springs (and any others you have handy)?
    No worries. I did reply in another thread with dimensions on the rear H&R springs but the measurements were quickly made with a ruler, so not of any real use. I got a chance to take measurements with calipers:

    Stock rear LAD spring:
    -Height: 344.5mm
    -Outer diameter: 112.50mm
    -Wire diameter: 12.55mm

    H&R rear LAD spring:
    -Height: 344.5mm
    -Outer diameter: 113.50mm
    -Wire diameter: 13.25mm

    The spring rate values in my post above are off because of the method I used to measure (used a string wrapped around the coil a bunch of times to calculate the diameter). Using these new measurements the rates are slightly lower, but still about the same difference in stiffness between the two (~15%). I'll post measurements for the front springs too once I get a chance.

    Quote Originally Posted by moroza View Post
    Is this your first lightweight flywheel? Before you write it off as a huge mistake, consider that it simply wasn't done correctly - you need to use a sprung clutch disk with a solid flywheel. Yes, even then there'll still be some noise, but nowhere near what your zero-give setup has. I had a UUC E31 conversion flywheel and OE E31 clutch, and while there was some minor noise here and there, it wasn't bad, and well worth the awesome response and direct feel. Transformed the car, woke it up, one of the best mods I ever did
    It is my first lightweight flywheel car that I have driven, so my baseline perspective is probably exaggerating the amount of rattle compared to what is typical of gear noise associated with similar setups. You're right, ideally I should have sourced a sprung 265mm clutch disk; in theory that should help dampen the power pulses from the engine some (depending on the clutch spring rate and whatnot). I do love the 'feel' of my setup, the clutch travel and engagement is soooo nice. Exactly how I want it. I'm honestly surprised the initial grab of the clutch is not more harsh considering I went with an unsprung disk and solid flywheel. Probably because the stock Sachs clutch material is not very 'aggressive'.

    Edit: another thought on spring rates - I've seen that most folks that go to coilovers for their E34 or E32 typically select a spring rate that is higher in the front compared to the rear. I've always suspected (based on driving feel) that stock E34/E32 springs run lower front spring rates than the rears. My car won't provide any evidence to back up this theory because I have LAD in the rear (where the spring is more of a 'helper' to carry the weight compared to actual leveling shock). I'd be curious to see actual measurements on stock cars without LAD rear struts.
    Last edited by m60power; 07-28-2020 at 08:42 PM.

  25. #100
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    moroza is offline MORΩN ΛABIA BMW CCA Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by m60power View Post
    Edit: another thought on spring rates - I've seen that most folks that go to coilovers for their E34 or E32 typically select a spring rate that is higher in the front compared to the rear. I've always suspected (based on driving feel) that stock E34/E32 springs run lower front spring rates than the rears. My car won't provide any evidence to back up this theory because I have LAD in the rear (where the spring is more of a 'helper' to carry the weight compared to actual leveling shock). I'd be curious to see actual measurements on stock cars without LAD rear struts.
    This is indeed the case. Stock front rates vary between 17 and 27 N/mm (518i and M5, respectively). Non-SLS rears between 29 and 40 N/mm (525i and 530iT, respectively).

    A sample of actual meaurements I did:
    E34 530iT front: 6.5 total coils, 5.9 active coils (best guess that fits data), 13.5mm wire, 153mm* coil, 385mm free length, rate at G=77 19.96 N/mm
    E34 525iT front: identical except 13.2mm wire, rate = 18.13 N/mm
    E34 530iT rear: 9.9 total coils, 8.9 active ("), 12.85mm wire, 103mm coil, 345mm free length, rate 40.25 N/mm
    E34 540iA rear: 10.25 coils (9.25 active), 12.2mm wire, 103mm coil, 369mm free length, rate 30.79 N/mm
    E28 528e front: 7 coils (5.8 active), 13.1mm wire, 144mm* coil, 345mm free length, rate 21.79 N/mm

    *most E34 front springs are 144mm coils at the ends, but bulge out to 153mm or so in the middle (active) coils. E28 front springs, as well as E34 Eibachs, are a constant 144mm coil diameter.

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