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Thread: An Example of Truly Impressive Turbo Engineering

  1. #151
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    Throw a turbo on that lil v8 and I bet you could see 1000 HP
    s52 under boost construction

    e30 by davidkhan82, on Flickr

  2. #152
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    Damn... and wowsers. All you can say.

  3. #153
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    Amazing work for sure beautiful design and machining work.
    John Barreto; no BMW now ISO though, past cars '92 e36 325i, '98 M3/4

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by SUPADAVE View Post
    Throw a turbo on that lil v8 and I bet you could see 1000 HP
    Why would you bet that?

    There is no guarentee that the engine can handle double itīs torque output.
    Maybe itīs already at itīs design limits as is.
    With great challenges comes great engineering.
    Gunni - IG : @gstuning_ & @pnpecu
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  5. #155
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    Holy moley!
    Avus 1998 328is, No. 191 STX
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  6. #156
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    Pretty impressive and it looks pretty...yada yada engineering terms...I'm kinda not caring what it looks like/made out of/etc just let me drive it pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeee

  7. #157
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    What's up with the OP's s14 e30 m3 project car?
    “If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
    ― George Orwell

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by gstuning View Post
    I donīt think I have ever read about any engine making more then 130nm/liter when you donīt account for boost.
    This is the problem with what you're saying. You can't take 14 psi of boost (around 200 kPa total pressure) and half it to around 100 kPa of total pressure (ditch the boost) and assume anywhere near half the power.

    You're assuming that the first 14.5 psi (atmospheric pressure) will result in x power output, and then you're adding another 14 psi on top of that and making the incorrect assumption that power will simply double. That's not how things work, and the more cooling you have and the more efficient your induction and exhaust system is the less and less your assumption will match up with reality.

    You can't assume anything from pressure data without temperature data, and not without flow data. I have no doubt that induction system at that rpm can gobble up plenty of air. So much so, that you don't have the chance to create any real pressure in the charge pipes.

    Am I making sense to you?
    Last edited by BenFenner; 04-20-2012 at 01:19 PM.

  9. #159
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    so 1400 hp for how much money? really? for more than the kind of money you could buy a ford GT that runs the mile in 250ish mph?

    I don't see what is so impressive about this other than it is F1 regions of waste of cash.

  10. #160
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    Easy what you say about F1, sir.

  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by gstuning View Post
    Why would you bet that?

    There is no guarentee that the engine can handle double itīs torque output.
    Maybe itīs already at itīs design limits as is.
    Who said anything about torque?

  12. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by BenFenner View Post
    Who said anything about torque?
    Lets try some math.

    How do you double the power at a certain engine speed?
    Twice the torque?

    Easy math is easy

    Quote Originally Posted by BenFenner View Post
    This is the problem with what you're saying. You can't take 14 psi of boost (around 200 kPa total pressure) and half it to around 100 kPa of total pressure (ditch the boost) and assume anywhere near half the power.

    You're assuming that the first 14.5 psi (atmospheric pressure) will result in x power output, and then you're adding another 14 psi on top of that and making the incorrect assumption that power will simply double. That's not how things work, and the more cooling you have and the more efficient your induction and exhaust system is the less and less your assumption with match up with reality.

    You can't assume anything from pressure data without temperature data, and not without flow data. I have no doubt that induction system at that rpm can gobble up plenty of air. So much so, that you don't have the chance to create any real pressure in the charge pipes.

    Am I making sense to you?
    Your not reading what I said. Already making an assumption yourself.

    I did say very clearly that I have not seen a engine making more then 130nm/liter when boost is not accounted for. That referes to NA engines.
    That also doesnīt imply that it doesnīt exist, only that I havenīt seen any number for any engine.

    Since you have no doubt how about you math it out to remove any doubt or are you assuming that some intake you donīt know about has the ability to flow some number.

    Please explain the following

    Intake efficiency and itīs relationship to boost pressure.
    Exhaust efficiency.

    Am I making sense to YOU?
    Last edited by gstuning; 04-15-2012 at 05:49 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
    With great challenges comes great engineering.
    Gunni - IG : @gstuning_ & @pnpecu
    Donīt PM ME, I wonīt see it

  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by gstuning View Post
    How do you double the power at a certain engine speed?
    Who said anything about keeping engine speed constant?

    Quote Originally Posted by gstuning View Post
    Please explain the following

    Intake efficiency and itīs relationship to boost pressure.
    Exhaust efficiency.
    Do I really have to? Do you want like a 5 paragraph essay? Which citation format do you prefer? APA, MLA, or Chicago? I lean Chicago myself.
    Can you give me the grading criteria? I like to maximize my effort/grade ratio. Is there help offered after class?
    Last edited by BenFenner; 04-17-2012 at 04:57 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  14. #164
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    You made an assumption about what I wrote and gave a few reasons to why your assumption of what I meant would be wrong.

    Iīm extremely interested in your intake efficiency theory.
    With great challenges comes great engineering.
    Gunni - IG : @gstuning_ & @pnpecu
    Donīt PM ME, I wonīt see it

  15. #165
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    If your intake system is more efficient, you will make more power with less boost. It is not that hard to imagine.

    It seemed to me like you were falling into the trap of assuming boost pressure is good on a turbo engine. Maybe you weren't making that mistake?

    People who think boost pressure is good should take that all the way to the end result. Basically image the engine is a parasitic loss on your boost pressure. You try to pressurize the intake system and the engine is basically a leak in the system. The more efficient the intake system, the bigger the leak. So you can easily have an engine breathing through dime-sized intake runners for example that makes low power at huge boost levels. Fuck yeah 50 psi of boost! How easy is it to make huge boost levels on this engine? Real easy, because the engine represents a tiny leak in the system. Take it further and make sure you use a tiny, tiny turbo. Those things make tons of pressure, real easily. Don't mind that your intake temps rise like a motherfucker, we just want boooost! You will make huge boost levels and very quickly because of the size of the turbo and the restrictive intake. Don't bother installing an intercooler, those things reduce boost.
    No problems right? I love making 250 WHP on 50 psi of boost! Don't think about where you are on the compressor map, that might hurt your brain. Don't think about the fact that you're only moving 250 WHP worth of air. You've got 50 psi bitches!


    Open up that intake system, use a large turbo, install an intercooler and now all of a sudden you've got a completely different game. The engine is now a huge parasitic loss on your boost. The larger turbo doesn't heat the air as much so it doesn't make pressure well either. The intercooler cools the air and again fucks with your high boost goals.
    Not only is it much harder to build boost, it also takes longer to build boost. WTF mate?
    So we have this same setup, and we want to move the same 250 WHP's worth of air. So what boost pressure will it take to get there? You tell me.


    I thought you were taking an already boosted engine and trying to assume what power and torque output it would make in N/A form. The point I guess I was trying to make is that there is absolutely no freaking way you can just take an engine boosting 2 atmospheres absolute and take the power output, then half it, and arrive at what the engine will make N/A (1 atmosphere absolute). Like I said, you can't do that without intake temp data. Or flow data. Efficiency data. Same thing.
    Last edited by BenFenner; 04-20-2012 at 01:30 PM.

  16. #166
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    Boost is the best though.

    There is continous benefits running high boost. Which is why todays high end diesels run triple stage compression.

    What they overcome by having 150psi in the intake manifold is the delay of air movement when the valve pops open and there is less push back when the valve is closing, resulting in improved cylinder filling.


    When you put pressure ontop of the piston on the induction stroke it improves BMEP.
    Nothing wrong with a bit of 150psi on the induction stroke.

    Itīs a endless game of this and that when it comes to boost. Overall more boost is better as improved intakes only take you so far. more boost never stops improving.
    With great challenges comes great engineering.
    Gunni - IG : @gstuning_ & @pnpecu
    Donīt PM ME, I wonīt see it

  17. #167
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    You can make 150psi with heat and almost no air, is my point. It's not about boost at all, it's about flow.

  18. #168
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    I love threads like this. The first page is filled with awesomeness. Then you can flip to the 7th page and read all the hot rod dick wagging. So much fun! :
    2005 Silvergrau E46 M3 SMG

    "Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention to arrive safely in a pretty and well-preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming: Wow!!! What a ride!"

  19. #169
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    I second that! Inquiring minds want to know. Enough of this Hot Rod genital wagging as our common interest member suggested. Lets get back to the awesomeness began on page 1.
    Quote Originally Posted by GG///M3 View Post
    What's up with the OP's s14 e30 m3 project car?
    Its interesting to see how corrosive some Non BMW coolant can be on aluminum cylinder heads.

  20. #170
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    Bumping this crap
    who's good with photo shop lol

  21. #171
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    Wow impressive

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