BMW E39 iDrive Project

[jamfool]

A quick mock up.

Beautiful!

With a mokup looking that good dude you should be thinking of making a commercial product out of it.

That is why I think your hardware platform should be small simple, but obviously powerful too. EEE PC based or somehting like that.

Also cutting the dash might be your preference but keep in mind in case of accident the damage could be worsened as the screen could simply detach itself out of the dash from the impact.

Keep up the good work

[DennisCooper]

Hiya,

A commercial product like this will cost north of £15,000 around $24,000 to get the necessary testing and accreditation for tapping into the CANBUS system. You'd basically need to prove that the system proposed does not affect the safety systems in the car. That's just the testing procedure, and part of that will stipulate the product is made in a certified factory - probably ISO 9000 (1) and CE marked and for the US FCC approved too (or the correct equivalent - I 'think' its the FCC for the USA and no doubt theres probably others for other territories around the world, apologies if I have got the exact names/references wrong). You'd need to find a factory that has those accreditations in place already and talk to them about numbers etc. So as you can imagine, the development costs from scratch would be massive.

If you create a system that doesn't interface with the CANBUS, all those costs would of course not needed. But in this case, it's fundamental to the project so you'd have to look at how to fund it all.

If you don't do that, and your product remains untested or certified, you leave yourself wide open for legal action when a claim comes in and that your system was connected to the canbus - the lawyers would have a field day and you'd be shut down and sued very quickly.

My post earlier on, you can see that in the near future, the big manufacturers are moving towards a centralised computer system for cars, they'll run on architecture perhaps intel and microsoft based - I don't know for sure of course! I just spoke to Microsoft Auto who pointed out they're working with the big manufacturers in development -Ford GM etc. To get the big manufacturers to develop something for the E39 is pretty much out of the question, unless you can persuade an oil baron as an investor to lend you the money to develop something like this.

If you develop something for yourself, then all fine and good - just make sure you don't ever have a smash as if your insurance company find out you tapped into the cars systems which can control the safety features of the car - you'll be toast if anything serious was involved.

Not putting a deliberate downer on this, the concept is fantastic - the reality to do it is completely different as you can see.

Currently the only interface you can use is the OBD2 - and I know that doesn't have the features you're wanting to have access to.

It'd be interesting if anyone knew anymore though? perhaps to show that there is some way of doing something like this properly?

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

[Xeniczone]

iDrive@NiGHT Concept:

Also cutting the dash might be your preference but keep in mind in case of accident the damage could be worsened as the screen could simply detach itself out of the dash from the impact.

Keep up the good work

Yeah, I had a few worries about cutting up the dash, but the dash will be rebuilt in fiber glass which is some good strong stuff, then the LCD Screen will be bolted to either the dash or the frame. Not sure yet as I haven't taken apart the entire dash. I know there are two steel poles running up the center which a bracket can be looped around and secured to. I don't want to drill into them as they may be pretty important structural

Hiya,

A commercial product like this will cost north of £15,000 around $24,000 to get the necessary testing and ac...

Yeah, I assume most of the costs involved is because of buying BMWs and installing the system into them, then purposely wrecking them to insure the safety systems are still functional. I'm not actually sure of all the procedures needed to make sure the system meets US and EU standards. Though I also haven't put much thought into it either. I know that other stuff like Wi-Fi, Bluetooth and any RF Module will have to be tested to insure that they meet wireless standards. Which can be a little pricey as well.

If you create a system that doesn't interface with the CANBUS, all those costs would of course not needed. But in this case, it's fundamental to the project so you'd have to look at how to fund it all.

This would definitely be possible, and not a lot of functions would be lost. After all the only functions required for the CANBUS are the steering wheel, window controls, light controls, and park distance controls. I can't think of any other feature we had talked about that used the CANBUS. The system should still be highly operational. Such as Radio, Bluetooth, DVD, etc.

If you don't do that, and your product remains untested or certified, you leave yourself wide open for legal action when a claim comes in and that your system was connected to the canbus - the lawyers would have a field day and you'd be shut down and sued very quickly.

I think a disclosure should cover any of the problems though. You know as soon as you open the box you get a "READ THIS FIRST!" Note that explains how "Installation of this module is completely at the users/installers own risk..." That would wave all liability of me or anybody else who helped in the project.

Though I think the safest thing that could be done is to sell the software and make the user do all the hardware stuff themselves. Though would be the best way to wave liability, but not many people are tech savvy enough to install a system.

If you develop something for yourself, then all fine and good - just make sure you don't ever have a smash as if your insurance company find out you tapped into the cars systems which can control the safety features of the car - you'll be toast if anything serious was involved.

I think that developing them myself would be the only way to go. Though I think your a little confused over the CANBUS system on the BMW. The BMW has 3 or 4 different buses on the CANBUS. Their is the D-Bus, K-Bus, and I-Bus that I know of. I believe it works like this. The K-Bus controls all the security features, Keys, doors, alarms ect. The D-Bus controls all the safety systems, Airbags, g-force sensors, etc. The i-bus controls all the media and a few other items, such as Light controls, Radio, GPS, etc. The only one that this system is tapping into is the i-bus. All other systems should be left alone.

Not putting a deliberate downer on this, the concept is fantastic - the reality to do it is completely different as you can see.

Currently the only interface you can use is the OBD2 - and I know that doesn't have the features you're wanting to have access to.

I still think it is possible even if it doesn't become a commercial project. I originally started out as a personal project that I decided to share. Which I'm glad I did share so early into the process otherwise I wouldn't have learnt about the CANBUS or any of the features.

OBD2 won't be necessary. As you said before, this would give access to the entire CANBUS system which would prove problematic if made commercial

[Chubblez]

I have an '02 540iT with the upper and lower dash completely removed. I can take pic's if you want.

Depending on what exactly you want to do, you could sell it as an aftermarket head unit/stereo/nat/whatever.

Just a thought...

~Chubblez

[DennisCooper]

Hi Xeniczone,

Thanks for your response, unfortunatley, your assumptions are incorrect. As mentioned, if you wish to sell this type of solution (once developed and manufactured) in a 'commercial' entity, you will 100% have to get it certified. A disclaimer saying installation is at users risk won't fly. If you did that, and one of your customers has an accident and the investigators discover your module piggybacked into the cars systems - they'll have you sued and shut down in a finger click.

If you're buying the bluetooth, motherboard, wifi module etc, from off the shelf components that have already been made to US/Euro/UK/Asia Pacific etc specific standards you won't need to get them re-tested I'd have thought. You'll simply be assembling pre tested products.

Remember the above is all in a commerical viewpoint. You'll have to convince other's your system is safe, tested, guarantee'd and warranted - for instance, how will you guarantee that their investment of perhaps $1000 will actually work 8 months down the line? if something goes wrong, what after sales and backup will you offer? if someone comes back saying ever since they installed your solution their airbag light is on and no amount of re-setting it with the BMW tool will get rid of it? - would I want to spend £1000 / $1000 USD on something which is untested and unproven which connects to my cars systems which currently greatly increases the risk my brakes and airbags won't work ? - no way.

You can see what I'm saying here, develop the system for sure, it looks great and executed well, will have a 'currently' niche market appeal. I know of at least 3 E39 PC installs and as I mentioned in my first post, one of them has the 'rotary' controller in what was the ashtray, of course minus any CanBus stuff.

I'm not a techie to the level of knowing the individual protocols within the system itself, I've spoken to the main after market makers of Canbus interfaces - Dension, Nav.TV, DICE and a few others. Whilst they make interfaces, they're not as specfic or comprehensive as what you're wanting to do. So you can get one of them to make it for you - and boom, you're talking circa $20,000 to get that section done. You'd also need to talk volume numbers when actually producing the unit when you then approach a manufacturer, they're not going to make you 20 or 30 of them here and there, I'd imagine 500-1000 units at least for every production run.

So you need to currently ask yourself what's the point at this stage. Commercially, you know you've got these hurdles to consider. If you do it personally, and want to try the disclaimer method, then perhaps spend 2-3 hours at a specialist lawyer to see what he says in case of what you'll do in those scenario's I mentioned above.

If you decide to develop commerically, drop me a line as I have industry contacts who do this sort of thing.

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

[Xeniczone]

I have an '02 540iT with the upper and lower dash completely removed. I can take pic's if you want.

Depending on what exactly you want to do, you could sell it as an aftermarket head unit/stereo/nat/whatever.

Just a thought...

~Chubblez

If you still have it in piece I will gladly like to see what the center console looks like.

Hi Xeniczone,

Thanks for your response, unfortunatley, your assumptions are incorrect. As mentioned, if you wish to sell this type of solution (once developed and manufactured) in a 'commercial' entity, you will 100% have to get it certified. A disclaimer saying installation is at users risk won't fly. If you did that, and one of your customers has an accident and the investigators discover your module piggybacked into the cars systems - they'll have you sued and shut down in a finger click.

If you're buying the bluetooth, motherboard, wifi module etc, from off the shelf components that have already been made to US/Euro/UK/Asia Pacific etc specific standards you won't need to get them re-tested I'd have thought. You'll simply be assembling pre tested products.

Remember the above is all in a commerical viewpoint. You'll have to convince other's your system is safe, tested, guarantee'd and warranted - for instance, how will you guarantee that their investment of perhaps $1000 will actually work 8 months down the line? if something goes wrong, what after sales and backup will you offer? if someone comes back saying ever since they installed your solution their airbag light is on and no amount of re-setting it with the BMW tool will get rid of it? - would I want to spend £1000 / $1000 USD on something which is untested and unproven which connects to my cars systems which currently greatly increases the risk my brakes and airbags won't work ? - no way.

You can see what I'm saying here, develop the system for sure, it looks great and executed well, will have a 'currently' niche market appeal. I know of at least 3 E39 PC installs and as I mentioned in my first post, one of them has the 'rotary' controller in what was the ashtray, of course minus any CanBus stuff.

I'm not a techie to the level of knowing the individual protocols within the system itself, I've spoken to the main after market makers of Canbus interfaces - Dension, Nav.TV, DICE and a few others. Whilst they make interfaces, they're not as specfic or comprehensive as what you're wanting to do. So you can get one of them to make it for you - and boom, you're talking circa $20,000 to get that section done. You'd also need to talk volume numbers when actually producing the unit when you then approach a manufacturer, they're not going to make you 20 or 30 of them here and there, I'd imagine 500-1000 units at least for every production run.

So you need to currently ask yourself what's the point at this stage. Commercially, you know you've got these hurdles to consider. If you do it personally, and want to try the disclaimer method, then perhaps spend 2-3 hours at a specialist lawyer to see what he says in case of what you'll do in those scenario's I mentioned above.

If you decide to develop commerically, drop me a line as I have industry contacts who do this sort of thing.

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

I definitely see what your saying, I don't think getting an approval will be a problem though, because it runs on the i-bus which has no links to anything essential in the car. Their are a lot of aftermarket devices that use the i-bus for things in the car, that are till on the market. Any kind of adapter for the steering wheel buttons into an aftermarket radio for example will run on the i-bus. So getting things tested and approved, at least I don't think, should be too big a problem.

I will definitely contact you if I decide to go commercial with this, but for now I'd like to focus on research and development for my, and anyone else who is helping, iDrive system.

[Camarok]

Oh my this looks interesting

[ckapranos]

This looks amazing. Can you post the pics of the final install with screen and 3D mouse.

[dookateh]

I am impressed, im guessing the picture in post #14 is in a e46 interior? But that screen looks like SEX, if you can get this to work properly with the onboard computer, this could be the hot mod of 2011. Any idea what the final costs could possibly be for a individual looking to do this upgrade all said n done?

[Xeniczone]

Final Cost should be around 500 dollars, but like mentioned before in the tread, I can't really make these for production. Their is no way to remove liability off myself without the proper tests, etc... I guess I could provide a guide on how to build the hardware then sell of the software, I have no idea.

I haven't worked on the project in a while. Problem being, I ran out of money, I don't have a job, and I can't get a job. It is driving me crazy. O well, As soon as I get a job, I will get right back on it.

[DennisCooper]

Hiya Xeniczone,

Keep positive and something will turn up for you ! I'm in a similar situation, savings have run out for the projects I have going, so jobhunting as well!

I'll keep it short, but in summary, there's no way 'commercially' that you'd be able to sell this (as a kit with all the parts/bits) for around the $500 USD mark. I'm going by your initial post with the dual top dashboard, the re-positioned vent, a car PC and screen in the secondary dash top and having the 'magic box' made to control eveything on the cars BUS system.

Just the dual dashtop would be that sort of price to retail for instance - I know, becuase I got as far as the pricing stage for a dual top dashboard piece around a year ago after seeing a rudimentary one 4 years ago!

A car PC and screen and running up to date technology such as SSD hard drives, miniature cases and motherboards will cost in excess of $500 as well.

The concept is great, the realistic pricing would be far higher than $500 though, if you can work on bringing the price down for retail level it'd increase your chances of selling them.

I'm not deliberatley being a wet blanket in response to you, it's just I've talked to the companies you'd need to as well and seen costings, from the vehicle PC people, to the guy who quoted me dual top dashboard tops, to the OBD2/BUS system specialists to the plastic injection moulding manufacturers.

Cheers, Dennis!

[Xeniczone]

Hiya Xeniczone,

Keep positive and something will turn up for you ! I'm in a similar situation, savings have run out for the projects I have going, so jobhunting as well!

I'll keep it short, but in summary, there's no way 'commercially' that you'd be able to sell this (as a kit with all the parts/bits) for around the $500 USD mark. I'm going by your initial post with the dual top dashboard, the re-positioned vent, a car PC and screen in the secondary dash top and having the 'magic box' made to control eveything on the cars BUS system.

Just the dual dashtop would be that sort of price to retail for instance - I know, becuase I got as far as the pricing stage for a dual top dashboard piece around a year ago after seeing a rudimentary one 4 years ago!

A car PC and screen and running up to date technology such as SSD hard drives, miniature cases and motherboards will cost in excess of $500 as well.

The concept is great, the realistic pricing would be far higher than $500 though, if you can work on bringing the price down for retail level it'd increase your chances of selling them.

I'm not deliberatley being a wet blanket in response to you, it's just I've talked to the companies you'd need to as well and seen costings, from the vehicle PC people, to the guy who quoted me dual top dashboard tops, to the OBD2/BUS system specialists to the plastic injection moulding manufacturers.

Cheers, Dennis!

Well I was thinking $500 more for a basic 7" head unit replacement for a head unit. Even then that would probably be in hardware not retail.

My first screenshot (photoshop) is very unrealistic for a retail market. For one the E38 air vents are expensive and their isn't enough of them to make a reasonable production run.

My idea for my car would have 2 separate computers (Dedicated GPS and Dedicated PC) and a lot of other stuff, like the screen design, that will make the costs far higher for it.

Though I think that an SSD hard drive would be a little overkill. They haven't really hit a good price point to be used in a large production. It could be an optional upgrade, but packing a normal 2.5" hard drive in a shock absorbent case should do nicely.

[DennisCooper]

Hi Xeniczone,

Cheers for the update there!

Yes, the initial screenshot/idea as I say is indeed possible, but will require significant investment to do. Making things simpler could be a way forward for you, however I'm unsure of the logic in having 2 computers.

SSD hard disks have now dropped in price to be a viable solution for consumer based electronics. When I was at the SEMA show I picked up a brand new Kingston 64GB SSD for $95 and indeed, they are the first choice for the latest round of electronic items. So for any production run, even small runs like 20-50 units, the price would come down significantly if a bulk order was put in for similar sized drives.

Alas, the latest generation of in car PC's have SSD drive options and the very latest is a logical step forward - it's a Single DIN unit with a flip out 7 inch screen that's a PC! it's been announced at the CES show, so will probably be available in the next quarter of the year (perhaps Q3/4) ..here it is
http://caraudiomag.com/articles/top-...es-2011-part-2

be great to develop the software for it....

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

[Costick]

Sell how to instructions and software at a reasonable price.

[Jungerishere]

Get a Dynavin head unit. I added iDrive skin for my E46 M3.

After seeing the new (2009) iDrive system, I freakin loved it. I decided to go ahead and try to make it for the E39, and apply some of my own taste to it as well.

First attempt was to use a prebuilt Windows CE device, which looks liked like this after 2-Days of work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTFYKq5HNf8


After two days of work, I ran into several problems with these weak devices.

1. Low storage: After all the GPS Maps are installed there is only 20MBs of space left. Which leaves me with very little room to work with.
   
2. No HDD Support: Which means other then read/controlling iPods and CD Player it will not be able to store music of it's own.
   
3. Weak CPU: Transparencies are not supported by WinCE, though it can be done with a few CPU intensive tricks. Making everything lag. This means all animations and effects have to be "pre-rendered" using lots of images, which leads me to the next problem.
   
4. Low Memory: With only 6MBs of memory 3.4 of which is used by Windows, I was unable to load all the animations into the memory at once. Which means images have to be swapped out, which means every time you push something you get a 1 seconds lag, and what does that remind us of? Generation 1 iDrive? Yeah... Interestingly enough it was also built on WinCE.
   
5. Wrong Aspect: This device has a 16:9inch screen. I worked out that BMW uses a 8:3 screen.

Next idea.
I discovered a few Linux Flavors that are specially built to load in 4-8 seconds even on slow devices, such as a 1.6ghz Atom w/ a 9400M GPU. I think I will add 512mbs of ram and a 40gig hard drive also.

I couldn't find a LCD controller that would work with the BMW 8.8in LCD, and I couldn't find a direct replacment that was the same 8:3 aspect. After some trigonometry I discovered 2 screen that could work. First is a 10.4" 4:3 which I would then utilize half the screen and hide the other half, but trying to hide 3-4" would be too tricky. The next option is a 10.1inch 16:9 screen, which would be 0.4" inches wider then BMWs screen, and I would only have to hide 1.6in of the screen to make it the same aspect.

Finally I have to design the layout in the car.


This would use a E38 air duct, which is shorter and wider then the E39s, if I'm correct, it is the same width as the E39s radio. The E39 head unit would then be replaced with something similar to the F10s radio, but would be nothing more then an DVD-Rom drive and some buttons for the linux machine.

Finally, the screen would be mounted where the old air ducts used to be. Then use an arch to go over it. I was trying to make the arch compliment the cluster panel's arch, but I failed in photoshop. Then the knob for the iDrive system would be place to the right of the shifter.

If anybody has a better suggestion for a layout, I would love to see it.

[Xeniczone]

Sell how to instructions and software at a reasonable price.

That seems the most reasonable way of doing it.

Get a Dynavin head unit. I added iDrive skin for my E46 M3.

No, thats alright. I think that hardware looks like junk. I wouldn't get one of those units near my Bimmer, but that is just my opinion.

Hi Xeniczone,

Cheers for the update there!

Yes, the initial screenshot/idea as I say is indeed possible, but will require significant investment to do. Making things simpler could be a way forward for you, however I'm unsure of the logic in having 2 computers.

SSD hard disks have now dropped in price to be a viable solution for consumer based electronics. When I was at the SEMA show I picked up a brand new Kingston 64GB SSD for $95 and indeed, they are the first choice for the latest round of electronic items. So for any production run, even small runs like 20-50 units, the price would come down significantly if a bulk order was put in for similar sized drives.

Alas, the latest generation of in car PC's have SSD drive options and the very latest is a logical step forward - it's a Single DIN unit with a flip out 7 inch screen that's a PC! it's been announced at the CES show, so will probably be available in the next quarter of the year (perhaps Q3/4) ..here it is
http://caraudiomag.com/articles/top-...es-2011-part-2

be great to develop the software for it....

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

Yeah, $95 dollars is great, but a similar metallic drive is only like $40 dollars. That is why I said it should be an option.

But like mentioned above, I think the best solution is just to let every pick and choose their own hardware. For those who are technically smart, they could just buy one of those prebuilt units, and then sell off the software. Like for me, I personally would prefer a SSD drive over a metallic drive. Simply because even with a silicon shock around the hard drive, the car is exposed to a lot of shock, especially a car with sports suspension, or worst track suspension.

Right now I'm thinking of using 2 screen also. Rather than using one large screen, I would use one screen above the air duct which would be all the menus and such, and another in the OEM position that would be for rearview cameras/turn signals/GPS etc. Then their would be a button to swap the screens around if needed. Again this is just something that would be for my car, and wouldn't be ideal for a production because not many people would be interested in it, or want to pay for it.

[Xeniczone]

If anyone has access to an E38, and would by nice enough to take a ruler out and measure this for me, it would be greatly appreciated. I made a post in the E38 section also.

[DennisCooper]

Hi Xenic,

I'm just about to head to get some shuteye, 145am and eyes are closing, i'll update you as theres some sites where mcuh of the work you mention software wise seems to have alredy been done

Cheers, Dennis!

[Jungerishere]

No, thats alright. I think that hardware looks like junk. I wouldn't get one of those units near my Bimmer, but that is just my opinion.

So you rather butcher your car to make this fit? Then more power to you.

[Xeniczone]

So you rather butcher your car to make this fit? Then more power to you.

Well, I actually thought about buying a OEM 16:9 Nav and gutting it, so I can get that OEM look but still have the system that I want. In comparison to the outdated system that is on them. Butcher is rather harsh word, but if it isn't done right, I guess it would fit perfectly. I'm fairly confident in my abilities, plus I'm planning on covering everything with leather, similar to the M5 with stitched leather interior, but any seams or mess ups should be covered up .

But yeah, I'm really not a fan of those aftermarket systems. I just hate the way they look, I can't put my finger on it to why I think that. No offense to you of course. Everyone has their own opinions.

Hi Xenic,

I'm just about to head to get some shuteye, 145am and eyes are closing, i'll update you as theres some sites where mcuh of the work you mention software wise seems to have alredy been done

Cheers, Dennis!

Great! Can't wait to see them.

Right now, I'm redoing all my trig. I just got a job so I'm looking more seriously into starting this project. My first goal is to get the E38 vents fitted and getting a LCD screen that I'm going to use. Right now I think my trigonometry is wrong . I thought I need a 10.1inch 16:9 screen to make the 8.8inch 8:3 BMW screen. I then modeled a 10.1inch screen on a piece of paper and then drew the BMW screen on top of it and it ended up being 9.3". So yeah... my math is wrong somewhere, lucky I caught it by drawing the screen before I bought the actual screen.

[DennisCooper]

Hi Xeniczone

As promised, have a look at these links

http://projects.tevs.eu/OpenBM

http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/hard...w-e39-e46.html

http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/show...1-compact.html

http://web.comhem.se/bengt-olof.swing/CarPCProject.htm

http://www.carx24.de/carx.htm

The above would be good for the PC element of what you are thinking as well as some of the integration aspects. The really 'tricky' bit would be trying to get it all done commercially as mentioned previously.

I'd hazard a guess if theoretically right now you could retail this, it'd cost you $1200-1500. If you jettison the dual dashboard and E38 airvent aspects and was just the computer and screen element, you'd bring that down substantially.

Other companies are sort of ahead of you in that respect, of course they're commercial entities so have better purchasing power. Here's a new all in one Single DIN flip out car PC for instance;

http://www.avxtec.com/

I'd put forward the suggestion to not try to re-invent the wheel when substantial bits of this have been covered already but maybe update the software side of things as you seem to know much more about that aspect?

hope the above help!

cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

[Xeniczone]

Thanks for those links. They really support my other idea, just buy a 16:9 monitor and replace all the parts inside of it. I just made a request on the E38 forums about how big the Air Vent is, and it seems, though it is 1cm to wide, it will work perfectly. So I'm back on track with my first idea, cutting the living hell out of the dash.

I did play around with a dual screen idea for a while, but I couldn't find a screen size, or a respectable reason to do so. I really like the idea of having the Nav appear on one screen while I still had the ability to media and such on the main screen, but o well. Can't find a way to make that work. Like I said I'm now strongly looking into my first idea of using the E38 air vent. I'm going to buy a E38 vent and 8.8 iDrive screen (if I can find one for a decent price) when I start getting some paychecks )

Those flipout/OEM style ones would be perfect if it was to turn into a commercial product, one we get the prototype done (my car). Their seems to be a few people interested, but I wouldn't call it enough to do a production run. Maybe when we have a presentable product they will change quicker. I understand the idea of not reinventing the wheel, but I'm kind of high on my standards and I don't see anything on the market that would offer everything that I want. So I can do it on my own hardware for now, and later port it over to that hardware, which shouldn't be too hard if it is all of Windows design.

Excuse me if I didn't cover everything of your post, I think I got all the keypoint.

[DennisCooper]

Hi Xeniczone,

I see you are in KY, I was in Cincinnati for a week or so Nov 09 and Jan 2010 and met up with a couple BMW enthusiasts - could've met up if we'd known of each other back then!

I think that flip out screen full car PC product is indeed going to be released shortly or has just been released, so it'd be interesting to see the price point it comes in at.

So are you saying you want to get an OEM monitor 16:9 unit and modify it internally and then create a dual top dash to house the 8.8 inch screen to show Navigation display, with the E38 vent in the middle ? (along the ideas of your initial post and photochop)

I'm going to be doing some more investigation and research this week - you 'might' just want to hold your horses for a little while longer

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

[Xeniczone]

UPDATE

I have started working on the iDrive controller. First was to determine the size. I found a picture on ebay with the iDrive controller laying next to the iDrive screen. Since I know the size of the screen, I can use that knowledge to determine the size of the iDrive controller.

Here is the design I came up with.




My iDrive controller will have 3 buttons less than the official CIC iDrive controller, because I don't think all those buttons are necessary. It will also be quite a bit thinner, because I want to install this next to the shifter on the E39, but under that part is an air duct. In order to avoid removing or modifying that air duct will require for the controller to be rather thin. So instead of packing all the technology inside of the controller (the microcontroller that converts the button presses into iBus Commands) I will leave it as an array of buttons, then move the technology (microcontroller) to another part of the car, toward the front, where it can be installed without a problem.

The other thing I need to figure out is the name of the top right button. Right now I've been calling it "Quick Options". This button is used to open up Music Options (treble, bass, balance, etc) and Quick Options (Night Visions, Rear View, etc), but I think the text "Quick Opt." Looks rather unprofessional. Any suggestions?

__________________________________________________ __

Hi Xeniczone,

I see you are in KY, I was in Cincinnati for a week or so Nov 09 and Jan 2010 and met up with a couple BMW enthusiasts - could've met up if we'd known of each other back then!

I think that flip out screen full car PC product is indeed going to be released shortly or has just been released, so it'd be interesting to see the price point it comes in at.

Yeah, but a year ago I lived in IN :P.

I think Lilliput already makes a flip out screen computer for cars, but the problem is they stored WindowsCE on a rom so it can't be modified. When you turn the system of all your changes disappear.

So are you saying you want to get an OEM monitor 16:9 unit and modify it internally and then create a dual top dash to house the 8.8 inch screen to show Navigation display, with the E38 vent in the middle ? (along the ideas of your initial post and photochop)

Well I've been playing with 3 ideas. Let me sort them out here.

1. Use the OEM Widescreen Sat Nav and gut it. Replace all the insides and LCD screen with my own electronics. (one screen total)

2. Use the iDrive 8.8inch (8:3) screen and build a one screen system. Similar to the on I photoshoped in the first thread. The I would place the screen in the same location as the current E39 Air Vents, and use the E38 Air vents in the location of the E39's CD Player. I would then replace the MID with a custom made "head unit," which would be nothing more than a few buttons and a DVD-ROM drive. The iDrive controller would be placed next to the shifter, and using preexisting wires (previously used for the audio and stuff on the current system) to wire all that up to a computer in the trunk. Not sure if their is enough wires yet, but all I would need is VGA, 1 USB, everything else will communicate over the ibus.

3. Use 2 screens. A 16:9 7" screen in the OEM location and an 8:3 8.8" screen on top of the E39 air vents. The E38 Air vents wouldn't be used in this model. The problems I ran into was, the screen sitting on top of the air vents created a small blind spot, mainly for shorter drivers; The designed looked weird with 2 different sized screens; Trying to tweak the design to reduce blind spots would make the second screen rather small and actually be too small to be of any use; Finally the price was a little bit higher than I wanted because of the few extra things needed for the extra LCD screen.

I'm currently looking into executing design #2.

I'm going to be doing some more investigation and research this week - you 'might' just want to hold your horses for a little while longer

Cheers, Dennis! West London UK!

Alrighty, Good luck.

[Xeniczone]

Started designing the LCD screen mount. I first started by making a design on the computer that I liked and thought complimented the cluster.



I traced the design and applied it to a screen to get an idea of how it would look.



After I decided if it was good, I then traced it onto a piece of cardboard to see what it looks like in the car. At this point I can't really decide which one to do.



A. Place the screen on top. This generates a small blind spot on top of the screen. No big deal. This is also the easiest to implement.



B. Cut the vent in half or find a newer BMW vent that is about the same size as half the size of the stock vents.



C. Probably the hardest one to do, but I think is the best looking is to relocate the A/C Vents or Delete the A/C vents. This is probably the one that I don't like because it means that if I do relocate the air vents they will have to be similar to my original concept of using the E38 air vents and removing the trim where the CD Player is at. Which I like that trim.