Most Bang for the Buck

[E46makesmeHard]

Lets say I saved up $4000 to modify a E46. If I decided to dump it all into the engine what would be the best route to go to get the most HP? If I decided to spread out the money to get all around performance (engine, suspension, brakes, etc...) what would be my best bet to spend the money on so the car would be the most fun to drive. I'm asking because I'm saving up some money to modify my new car when I get it and I'm not sure if should just strait up turbo it or first put on nice shocks and lower springs and tight rims. Maybe later I could modify the engine. I want to put on a nice body kit and rims but looks won't win a race.

[umnitza]

spend the money on a driving school...whatever you find out there about your skills...that's what you should modify.

[E46makesmeHard]

I'm 16 you really think I'm gonna spend my money on a driving school?

[mpbmw318is]

No, Umnitza is right.
Driving school (which I want to take badly) will yield the best results. You'll learn how to handle and drive your car to its limits, much better and dumping cash into anything else. whatever is left over use that for mods. Trust me and I know I'll get a lot of support on this, this will be the best money you can spend for "mods". You can take it with you to your next car too.

[funkyboss]

Originally posted by E46makesmeHard
I'm 16 you really think I'm gonna spend my money on a driving school?

It's really not a bad idea. And it's nothing like drivers ed. It's actaully a lot of fun!!! You get to go out and do everything that would be illegal on city streets. Without it, you really wouldn't be able to drive your new car to it's full potential.

A better driver will beat the faster car any day of the week.

We all have seen too many stories about inexperienced drivers with a fast car, that wrapped it around a pole because they didn't know how to drive it.

I've been driving for over 10 years, and I found that I can take on cars now that I would have lost to before I took some driving school a few months ago.

And, hey c'mon.....where else can you put your car into a slide at 60mph and not wreck it or get a ticket?

Besides - It's not going to cost you the whole $4000.

[umnitza]

the fact that you're 16 only underscores my response further.

Please, please, please take a driving school.

When I was 16...I was the WORST driver. I only know that now...you may think you know how to drive, great reactions, etc. you don't.

Not a slam...just experience.

[Bry]

Yes, I highly reccomend a drivers school. I'm 16, and I can't wait to go. My cousin has been and he said he learned so much about his car, about the limits, and how to drive the car better.

I cant wait 'till I can go!

[E46makesmeHard]

Ok so lets say I had $6000, I spent 2 on driving school and had 4000 left? What mods would you suggest?

[funkyboss]

training wheels and a helmet. J/K

[The Beastmaster]

Originally posted by E46makesmeHard
Ok so lets say I had $6000, I spent 2 on driving school and had 4000 left? What mods would you suggest?

Buy an old E30 325 and build it for track events. After the driving school you're going to want more and more track time. Track time is pretty harsh on a daily driver and you have to setup the car everytime you track it. If you had a dedicated track car, just hop in start the ignition and time to rock and roll.

For more info on building an E30 for the track go to BMP Designs

[E46makesmeHard]

training wheels and a helmet

I'm actually a very good driver despite my lack of experience. I've also taken driving clases where I got to drive crazy and skid on black top.

[funkyboss]

I was just kidding dude.

seriously though, unless you plan to go out hunting down races, I would spend the money on looks:

Wheels
Suspension
whatever else you can think of......

[Dark Helmet]

"Drive crazy and skid on blacktop" is not driving... and therefore has no relevance to this discussion.

I'm 22, I am still learning how to drive a car fast... I thought I was a great driver when I was 16 (bull shit) yet, only 2.5 years later, I was telling my brither that I sucked as a driver at 16...and now, 4 years fter that, can't believe how badly i sucked as a driver at age 18!

bottom line. I still remember my driving as a teenager. I could drive into or out of any situation, but I was always at the edge of my abilities.

Driving a car at the limits is EXTREMELY difficult, it requires an understanding of physics, and physiology, not to mention the individual traits inherent to YOUR car. I have had my car for damn near 5 years, and am still learning how to get through that corner faster, and EXACTLY where the limits are, and how best to approach them.

as for mods. CAI, software, exhaust, maybe springs/shocks. the first three will help you "listen" to your car and translate what it is telling you into meaningful information that is applicable to your next control input. in a "luxury car" like a BMW, it is very easy to be too isolated from what is happening betwen the car, the road and the driver... these things must be transparent.

if you don't think you need driving school (unless you have a bunch of carting experience your not sharing with us), then you shouldn't be driving anything more powerful than a big-wheel. I said it, I'll back it up. that attitude of arrogance is what gets more people injured and more cars fucked up than anything else on the road. Get your priorities straight, having a "tight" car may get the ladies, but all this posing is not going to do anything for the safety of yourself or the rest of us. And guess what your #1 priority is on the rods.. the safety of OTHERS. not how many girls like you, not how fast you can drive without getting caught, none of that shit. I'll tell you now. if your bad driving ever injures someone I know I will beat your ass so hard you won't be able to walk.

REMEMBER THIS: Untill a professional tells you otherwise, your driving sucks, it always has sucked, and it will suck untill they give you further notice. passing your drivers test is not an indication of your ability to drive a car.


to the rest of you, sorry about the rant, it just flipped the switch to "vigilante" this morning.

[Rel44 M3]

WHOA!

DasMafia on a tirade... that's pretty funny. It's all true though. We probably all thought we could drive very well when we were 16. Heck, I'm 28 now and I'm still figuring some stuff out. I haven't gone to a driving school myself yet, but I'm planning to, as my close friends have gone to a couple of them and their experiences were amazing. Plus all the people that talk about it on these forums have gone through it too.

Let me put it this way. A lady in this area is trying to sell her son's E36 M3. I think the kid is 17. The ad says "car too powerful for son." Why? Well apparently he was showboating and lost control of the car, ran it into something. Go to a driving school, figure out the limits of what your car can do and more importantly what you can do.

As for mods though, do they even make a turbo for the E46's? I think they've just started working on superchargers at around 4psi or so.

[E46makesmeHard]

Dasmafia calling me arogant is really uncalled for. All i wanted to know in this post was the best mods i could get for the money I have and someone suggested going to driving school instead. Thats cool advice noted. I don't need some ass ranting on and on about how everyone a shitty driver except them. Next time I post STFU.

[Rel44 M3]

Sorry to offend. I can't speak for DasMafia but I didn't intend to put you down if you took it that way.

[Russell328is]

E46makesmeHard posted a valid question, which seems to have elicited some very constructive concern for enhancing your own skill before tackling your car's performance. While it's good to have a discussion about driver's schools, it's also important for EVERYONE INVOLVED to be respectful of other members and their opinions.

We expect and tolerate nothing less around here.

[Dark Helmet]

Russell: duly noted.

makesmehard (wtf): i don't ever remember telling you that i was a better driver than anyone else ("I don't need some ass ranting on and on about how everyone [is] a shitty driver except them"... i said "but I was always at the edge of my abilities" implying that i was NOT as good a driver as I thought I was), and I am going to tell you something you need to come to grips with. ANY 16 year old, who has not participated in extensive driving instruction is a crappy driver. and you have twice indicated that you had little or no interest in driving school and insinuated that you were of the opinion that you were a good enough driver that school was not necessary, see below:

I'm 16 you really think I'm gonna spend my money on a driving school?

I'm actually a very good driver despite my lack of experience. I've also taken driving clases where I got to drive crazy and skid on black top.

this attitude, combined with you talking about adding a turbo when you have yet to prove conclusively that you can handle the performance (and inherent responsibility) of a natually aspirated car, is what solicited my reaction. this statement

REMEMBER THIS: Untill a professional tells you otherwise, your driving sucks, it always has sucked, and it will suck untill they give you further notice. passing your drivers test is not an indication of your ability to drive a car.

and this one

your #1 priority on the rods.. the safety of OTHERS

are an indication of the correct mindset in which you need to operate while driving your new car. This mentality will keep you and those around you alive and walking under their own power.

Tell you what: print this post out and save it. in 5 or 6 years, take it out and read it. if I was wrong I owe you dinner your choice of mafia hangouts in NYC. If I was right, and you are still alive, then dinner's on you. gentleman's bet. you in?

PS. i never called you arrogant....I said your attitude was.

[funkyboss]

One thing that may have been overlooked here is the fact that while driving school will make you a better driver, it may also create a jaded driver. What I'm trying to say is, that when I was 16, I knew how to drive a car. While I may not have been a "great" driver, the inhibitions were not there. If I would have gone to driving school at that age, I probably would have been a driving terror! Instead of building fast cars, I built lowriders through highschool. I never drove fast, simply because I coudn't in my vehicles of choice. Of course, I'm not saying that you should go out and get yourself a '64 Impala, but you should ask yourself: "Why am I getting a car?"

What is your primary use of this car going to be?
Are you planning to cruise it or race it?
Is this your first car, so you're just getting what's cool?
I'm not trying to deter you from getting a Bimmer, but most Bimmer folks like to push they're cars to the limits, and (speaking from experience) when your 16, a fast car is the wrong answer.
Make it look pretty, and as you gain more experience driving it, add the go-fast parts.

We're not trying to slam you here. It's equally important to us that you are safe in your endeavors as your car is cool.

[E46makesmeHard]

I bet dasMafia went to driving school and now thinks he is the best driver but is just cocky instead. Just becuase I want to make my car tight doesn't mean I'm gonig to go racing. I was actually planning on trying to get sponsered by someone and taking my car to shows.

[funkyboss]

Originally posted by E46makesmeHard
I bet dasMafia went to driving school and now thinks he is the best driver but is just cocky instead.

Why don't you just kill this childish bullshit right here? This board isn't here to pick fights on. And this won't end until both of you quit trying to insult eachother. If you want to talk about your car, then simply ignore the slandering comments from another member. You don't have to reply and get the last word to save face. Somebody suggested driving school, and you came off all defensive like. That's where this started. You also, tried to move on to the original topic after that (good for you). But, this fighting between you and dasmafia is just a waste of time, and you will end up getting this thread locked by a moderator.

If you would like to have some insight and suggestions from other members about your car, I'm glad to give some suggestions, as I'm sure others would too.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally posted by E46makesmeHard
I bet dasMafia went to driving school.

actually, I've never been to driving school... and I've been trying to relay that I'm NOT a great driver, in part because I have never had the correct instruction. Now, while I am not a great driver, I think that perhaps I have now become a decent driver after 9 years of experience. I will find out next spring when I finally get to attend my first driving school. (IF they ever finish this bloody racetrack)

And just to make it brutally clear: My Life Story:

Age 16: BAD driver (about 60-65th percentile vs. my peers, in retrospect -- a little better than average, but really bad nonetheless)

Age 18: Passable driving skills -- still far from good

Age 20: starting to understand complex vehicle dynamics and learning how to adapt to the traits of different cars.

Age 22: could probably get around a racetrack without great incident... but WAY off the pace. Inputs are beginning to result from instinct, and a knowledge of my cars inate capabilities.

Hopefully, It will include these entries at later dates

Age 27: first podium finish in NASA club racing

Age 30: first class win.

[umnitza]

REMEMBER THIS: Untill a professional tells you otherwise, your driving sucks, it always has sucked, and it will suck untill they give you further notice. passing your drivers test is not an indication of your ability to drive a car.

True, very true.

One thing that may have been overlooked here is the fact that while driving school will make you a better driver, it may also create a jaded driver. What I'm trying to say is, that when I was 16, I knew how to drive a car. While I may not have been a "great" driver, the inhibitions were not there. If I would have gone to driving school at that age, I probably would have been a driving terror!

This is also very true. This is the mature way to look at it. from both sides

I'll add one little thing. This is not intended to offend...just the way I see things. At 16, I was hell on wheels. I did constant four-wheel drifts on public roads, pulled 180s, peeled out at every chance I had, drove VERY FAST. Guess what...I did all this in a harmless Camry wagon that had no guts. So, I couldn't get into that much trouble (well a car is still a rolling hearse if you do the wrong thing). When you have a car capable of so much more, you intend to find out what it's capable of.

I think Sean or someone else said that you really should just concern yourself with keeping most of the money and just do some cosmetic things if you want to be individual.

Just be safe.

[trkmedic69]

Since obviously there are a "few" driving school advocates here, I was wondering if anyone had a suggestion of a school?

While I would LOVE to be able to travel and go to the big shot schools, due to many other life committements right now - I can't. I'm located in Philly and can probably handle going anywhere in the mid-atlantic/new england, as long as its only for a weekend or so.

I am a BMWCCA member but my chapter isn't very active, so I haven't been able to find anything there.


As far as my strictly NOVICE opinion goes:

1) Get car. Find what you don't like. Fix what you don't like. This stuff costs A LOT of money and there is no sense not enjoying every penny spent.

2) I found that my coilovers (Bilstein, just installed last week) were my BEST "performance" mod. BMW's are inherently fast. These have allowed me to take advanatge of this in a more controlled manner. And another plus, the 2" drop makes it look TIGHT. Even on stock 16" wheels... These would run you about $1000-1500 (including install).

3) I don't know what your mechanical abilities are and I'm not making any assumptions. Fully admiting that mine SUCK - I have all my work done by a certified BMW independent (http://www.iaibmwsp.org/). Just be careful - you can save a lot of money DIY'ing, but you can also damage alot of stuff and cause big hazards.

4) BE CAREFUL OUT THERE!

-Nick