How To: E38/E39 Cruise Control and Multifunction Steering Wheel Retrofit to a '96 E36

[ultimatetester]

Brake and clutch sensors are ok. I checked their output to CC ecu

How did you test this? I'm having troubles myself getting cruise to work at all


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[lukelio]

I checked if pin 2 is really connected to ground when engine is started and if 21 is connected to 12V+ if I am not mistaken. I dont know how that think with which I have checked it is called in english. How cruise control can tell if car is in neutral gear? I am asking about mechanical gear box

[MParallel]

Or hook it up to laptop and check in INPA. Or DIS, but INPA is much quicker.

[ultimatetester]

Or hook it up to laptop and check in INPA. Or DIS, but INPA is much quicker.

If you retrofit an e39 cruise control it will magically show up in INPA? How does it know?

[MParallel]

Yes, because the THX/RDX wires are still used (and connected to the same pins).

I have the E38/E39/E46 cruise controle module in my car and it showed up in INPA no problem.

I was surprised that the NSC Export datenfile for this module was already available in the E36 folder. I thought I couldn't code it, because it's not there. And just copying the datenfile from E38 folder to E36 doesn't make it know for NCS Export.

Although I learned (not done) that you can hack the ZCS to make it look for other car's modules.

But in case of the CC module, it's not needed and I was able to code it without doing anything but swap modules and a few wires.

The main topic about this retrofit is here:

http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...t-pictoral-DIY

[ultimatetester]

Yes, because the THX/RDX wires are still used (and connected to the same pins).

I have the E38/E39/E46 cruise controle module in my car and it showed up in INPA no problem.

I was surprised that the NSC Export datenfile for this module was already available in the E36 folder. I thought I couldn't code it, because it's not there. And just copying the datenfile from E38 folder to E36 doesn't make it know for NCS Export.

Although I learned (not done) that you can hack the ZCS to make it look for other car's modules.

But in case of the CC module, it's not needed and I was able to code it without doing anything but swap modules and a few wires.

The main topic about this retrofit is here:

http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/sh...t-pictoral-DIY

I fired up INPA and indeed it is able to communicate with the cruise control computer. Here are some screenshots:

1.png2.png3.png

Cruise control still doesn't work but I was able to verify a few things:

* The master switch never turns black, it is always white
* The switch buttons (screenshot 3, the I/O button is pressed) react to the buttons on my MFSW, so that's alright
* The speed is always 6 at idle and increases as I go faster
* The RPM is always a high number at idle and goes lower when push the gas pedal
* The automatic gearbox "in gear" is always black (my car is a manual)

I would like to verify with you that this is normal behavior. I tested it with another module I have laying around and it shows the exact same.
Also I'd like to know how I can code the module to not think it is a 4-cyl car... I couldn't find the module in NCS (just the normal 3 modules that are always listed)

[MParallel]

Your E38/39 module comes out of a automatic. Needs to be coded.

If main switch never goes black, I'll bet the module is also from a car with the older separate "On" switch. So even though you see action when pressing I/O, that is just the print on the button, the module will only see it as the "Off" command.

Which means your system can not get in standby mode, and therefor, not activated.

What's the HW/SW of your module?

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P.S. NCS tells you what module you have after reading the modules.

[ultimatetester]

Your E38/39 module comes out of a automatic. Needs to be coded.

If main switch never goes black, I'll bet the module is also from a car with the older separate "On" switch. So even though you see action when pressing I/O, that is just the print on the button, the module will only see it as the "Off" command.

Which means your system can not get in standby mode, and therefor, not activated.

What's the HW/SW of your module?

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P.S. NCS tells you what module you have after reading the modules.

I have 2 modules. One says 8-cyl automatic (hw07 sw04?) and the other says 4-cyl manual (hw08 sw04?). Both show the auto gearbox as "in gear". I can of course test the theorie that I don't have the correct version by hooking up a basic switch that represents the On switch. After I figure out how I can code the module (will take another look at ncs soon) I will change every configurable to the correct value. Maybe that solves it...


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[MParallel]

You need the HW8 version to have on+off from the MFL.

if you know NCS it's easy. File shoulde be FGR.C0x.

[ultimatetester]

You need the HW8 version to have on+off from the MFL.

if you know NCS it's easy. File shoulde be FGR.C0x.

Okay I will keep on using the HW8 module then. That one says 4-cyl manual.
I still can't find the module listed in NCS, here's what I get (revtor's profile, should that matter):
modules.png

I do have the data (DATEN) files for FGR.C04 and FGR.C05, and they are in the DATEN folder for NCSExpert
What am I doing wrong here. Is there a trick I need to perform before this module will show up?
Sorry I'm acting so noob but I never have retrofitted a new actual module to the car...

EDIT: After some more Googling I think I need to change my ZCS somehow... is that right?

[MParallel]

Ha yes If your car didn't leave the factory with cruise, than NCS will not see it. Forgot about that. I thought it would just scan the car and come back with all modules it finds.

I have never altered my ZCS as I wanted to keep it original, nor did I ever needed it as I didn't put in new modules. My M3 already had CC.

I know it's possible. You can even add other models option codes to the ZCS and have them come up in NCS.

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Here's my post from the other topic. This is what you will see when you code the module

Here are the NCS Expert/Dummy screenshots

There are 3 things to code:
- Cylinder count
- Cruise Standby switch version/led behavior
- Model car

After reading module coding:




So as you can see, mine came out of an E39 520i manual, 6 cilinder and with MFL.

So that's 2/3 already correct.

Now as mentioned earlier in this thread, this mod will work without coding, but it will not be complete. Mine was very jerky when activated.
Maybe even worse with wrong cylinder count. It's been mentioned the module doesn't care. No the module doesn't, but the TD/Speed signal will be wrong, so the module will behave differently aka incorrectly.
It makes sense, as different model cars will have different amount of throttle movement for x amount of cruise actuator activation.

So in my case, the last step was to select the correct model car:



Luckely BMW has many models selectable while not even used on all.

After that, the cruise engangement is very smooth and better than factory. So it's not just about having cruise through steering wheel buttons.

[ultimatetester]

Ha yes If your car didn't leave the factory with cruise, than NCS will not see it. Forgot about that. I thought it would just scan the car and come back with all modules it finds.

I have never altered my ZCS as I wanted to keep it original, nor did I ever needed it as I didn't put in new modules. My M3 already had CC.

I know it's possible. You can even add other models option codes to the ZCS and have them come up in NCS.

- - - Updated - - -

Here's my post from the other topic. This is what you will see when you code the module

Yes thank you. Together with the help of revtor I managed to change my SA so now the FGR module shows up.
I coded it to be for the 6-cyl M52B20 and verified that the switch option is set to multifunktionslenkrad (aka mfsw).
Unfortunately the cruise control still won't activate. I only looked at INPA yet to see if the master switch get's black but it doesn't (is it supposed to be?).
Again, I have the (from what I understand newer) I/O button on the MSFW so that should be good.
I also have the newer HW08/SW04 device from an E46.
Everything is wired up correctly, I verified this more than 10 times now already....

tl;dr: Not working still, what could be wrong!?!?!?

[MParallel]

In that case I am out of ideas. Sounds like everything is connected correctly. Did you do a fault test in INPA to see if there is a fault stored?

Doesn't matter if you have the O or O/I button. It does the same thing, it's just the symbol. The module version is the one that can either understand just O or O/I (HW08 only).

I do recall that one thing didn't go black in INPA on mine too.

The only thing I can think off, and I have to admit, I made this mistake...I had everything wired correctly, checked it 3 times.

So there was only one possibility, which was the case: I accidentally put the cruise control signal wire on the wrong pin of the slipring, the connector under the steering wheel cover.
I even double checked, but didn't realize I turned it 180 degrees to make it fit the plug. After I pulled the pin and inserted it in the other free hole and reconnected it, that was it. Perfectly working MFL CC.

[ultimatetester]

In that case I am out of ideas. Sounds like everything is connected correctly. Did you do a fault test in INPA to see if there is a fault stored?

Doesn't matter if you have the O or O/I button. It does the same thing, it's just the symbol. The module version is the one that can either understand just O or O/I (HW08 only).

I do recall that one thing didn't go black in INPA on mine too.

The only thing I can think off, and I have to admit, I made this mistake...I had everything wired correctly, checked it 3 times.

So there was only one possibility, which was the case: I accidentally put the cruise control signal wire on the wrong pin of the slipring, the connector under the steering wheel cover.
I even double checked, but didn't realize I turned it 180 degrees to make it fit the plug. After I pulled the pin and inserted it in the other free hole and reconnected it, that was it. Perfectly working MFL CC.

Yeah it's super weird. I know the cable is connected properly because INPA shows a black dot if I press any button (ON/OFF, INCREASE, DECREASE, READ SPEED) so that can't be it...
I have the HW08 so that's alright too. There are 0 errors stored. The first time I read it there were errors but I think those were caused on the previous vehicle but I cleared them and not a single one came back (although I haven't checked since I coded the module). Due to the fact that I can read it with INPA and code with NCSexpert I'm convinced that the module itself is not faulty.

I think that your main switch won't turn black either. Would you have some time to check this for me?

This weekend I will recheck the wires (AGAIN)...

[MParallel]

I checked all switches in INPA last night. All 4 mfl buttons turn a dot to black and that's it. The "Haubtschalter" never turns black.

[MParallel]

p.s. I think it makes sense. The older cars with the separate On switch on the dash, that switch's single wire connects to a different pin on the older CC modules, not used with I/O MFL.

I'm sure that is the pin/switch that would trigger the "Main switch" dot in INPA.

[ultimatetester]

p.s. I think it makes sense. The older cars with the separate On switch on the dash, that switch's single wire connects to a different pin on the older CC modules, not used with I/O MFL.

I'm sure that is the pin/switch that would trigger the "Main switch" dot in INPA.

Yeah I guess it does. I have one last request. Could you see what happens when you disconnect the actual motor that's pulling the throttle cable? My last resort is replacing that motor because it might be faulty. But I wonder if INPA shows anything if that motor is faulty. Could you check it for me by disconnecting the motor and see what INPA says?

[MParallel]

Yeah I guess it does. I have one last request. Could you see what happens when you disconnect the actual motor that's pulling the throttle cable? My last resort is replacing that motor because it might be faulty. But I wonder if INPA shows anything if that motor is faulty. Could you check it for me by disconnecting the motor and see what INPA says?

Sure can do.

What you can also try is disconnecting yours and directly apply +12v to the corresponding pin(s) that would make the motor pull the cable and see if anything happens. Than you know for sure if it's working or not.

Since the CC doesn't do a self-test, I doubt any fault will be stored. Unless I drive it with the CC motor unplugged, then activate it. But since my M3 is now in winter hibernation, I can't test that part.

[djmhendrix]

Yes thank you. Together with the help of revtor I managed to change my SA so now the FGR module shows up.
I coded it to be for the 6-cyl M52B20 and verified that the switch option is set to multifunktionslenkrad (aka mfsw)........

How did you add the FGR to your car exactly?

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I see 2 confusing connections: X22 (GR module) indicates pin 11 -> pin 5 and pin 12 -> 7 on X70 (actuator).
All the other E36/E38 wiring diagrams i've checked have these 2 the other way around: 11 to 7 and 12 to 5.

Have you found out why that is? I am looking at the same discrepancy in my efforts to hook stuff up in my Z3 Coupe (replacing the old stalk system)

[ultimatetester]

How did you add the FGR to your car exactly?

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Have you found out why that is? I am looking at the same discrepancy in my efforts to hook stuff up in my Z3 Coupe (replacing the old stalk system)

In the end adding FGR was absolutely not necessary and I actually forgot again how I did it... don’t bother with this though, it doesn’t affect anything


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[djmhendrix]

Thanks, too bad... because I would very much like to be able to program it such that it works exactly like it should. It is an itch that requires scratching....

besides, the Z3 CC system appears quite different in some aspects to a regular E36 CC so I even have to rewire some of the actuator cables. Will take some time...

[MParallel]

In the end adding FGR was absolutely not necessary and I actually forgot again how I did it... don’t bother with this though, it doesn’t affect anything


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Not for having the system work, but to program it, doesn't it need to be in de VIN/FA to be reocignised? Normally when doing this with SSS Progman, this does that for you. But INPA/NCS Expert not.

I've never tried accessing a module for an option not in my VIN, so not 100% sure on this one.

[ultimatetester]

Not for having the system work, but to program it, doesn't it need to be in de VIN/FA to be reocignised? Normally when doing this with SSS Progman, this does that for you. But INPA/NCS Expert not.

I've never tried accessing a module for an option not in my VIN, so not 100% sure on this one.

You are correct. If you want to program it then you will need to change your sa (fa or vo is for newer cars). You can use “BMW Decoder” to generate a new sa, then write the sa using ncsexpert. I remember there are two modules storing the sa. You have to write the sa to both and you have to let ncsexpert calculate a new checksum.

Warning: this is what I remember from head. Please do more research into this if you want to attempt this. A wrong procedure might result in a bricked car!!!

[MParallel]

I don't recall if it's also in Revtor's NCS Dummy documentation, but otherwise you can find the exact instructions on Google.

Ulimtatetester, does yours finally work now or still chasing that mystery?

[ultimatetester]

I don't recall if it's also in Revtor's NCS Dummy documentation, but otherwise you can find the exact instructions on Google.

Ulimtatetester, does yours finally work now or still chasing that mystery?

Yeah yeah it works, sent you a PM about it quite some time ago I’m now slowly retrofitting PDC, have to create a cable harness that goes from the front to the rear